Is Jeremey McGovern the best intercept mark the game has ever seen?

[Ricmel]

Peter Knights. And they were contested.

Yep. Intercept marking was not a thing in 70s where the game was more static and kicks went to big packs. But Knights was outstanding at the pack marks and had he played today with his pace and leap would have absolutely dominated AFL footy. Was way ahead of his time.

 

[demondavey]

Isn’t every mark that a defender takes an intercept mark? And isn’t every defender an ‘intercept’ defender to find degree?

Intercept; a footy buzz word.

 

[Hojuman]

Yep. Intercept marking was not a thing in 70s where the game was more static and kicks went to big packs. But Knights was outstanding at the pack marks and had he played today with his pace and leap would have absolutely dominated AFL footy. Was way ahead of his time.

And he'd run and play on, take a bounce. Brilliant. Was at the Knights v Vanderhaar game. Wow. Then lucky to watch Carey v Jakovich battles. Never see that again sadly.

 

[Port Adel Proud]

Gov has developed a style of play to absolutely maximize his strengths and covers up his weaknesses.

He's clearly fat for an AFL footballer, and so he lacks ground level agility, acceleration, and his second efforts are usually a bit slow. If he tried to play as a conventional defender who focuses on his man, good key forwards would towel him up because he doesn't have the speed and agility to stay with people on the lead.

But he dominates his opponent by combining good judgment of the flight of the ball, with a willingness to totally disregard his opponents and attack without hesitation once he's decided where the ball is going. So even if he should be slower to the ball than many of his opponents, he usually gets there ahead of them because he thinks faster and acts more decisive. Then suddenly his bulk becomes an asset because people can't shift him from the drop of the ball and his elite set of mitts do the rest.

I don't know where he ranks all time but I love how he plays football, he's a great example of how all shapes and sizes can play and how quick thinking > quick feet.

If there were an award for the most insightful post from a WCE supporter ever, then this is it. I read it but I don't believe it.

 

[Ricmel]

And he'd run and play on, take a bounce. Brilliant. Was at the Knights v Vanderhaar game. Wow. Then lucky to watch Carey v Jakovich battles. Never see that again sadly.

Peter Knights is comfortably the best CHB I have ever seen. Simply did not have a weakness, could go forward and dominate at CHF as well. Twice runnerup in Brownlow (one year when I think he only played a few games).

 

[HairyO]

Is Jeremy McGovern the best intercept mark the game has ever seen?

Intercept marks (per game, 2020):

#1 J McGovern

Intercept marks (per game, career):

#1 J McGovern

Intercept marks (total, career):

#1 H Taylor (debut 2008)
#2 H Shaw (debut 2005)
#3 S Hurn (debut 2006)
#4 J McGovern (debut 2014)

How far back do the stats go ?

 

[Juddernaut08]

This is just wrong, played on at worst the second best forward. It was his decision making on when to leave his man that made him look like a loose man more often then not.

Wrong. He played as a loose man because you had an extra in the backline.

At best he was an elite third man up.

 

[Rich01]

What? Concuss him in the 1st quarter?

Dude didn't know whether he was Arthur or Martha after that first contest.

Don’t buy that.
If that was the case, he would have been assessed by the club doctor and had a test. The Eagles medical team aren’t that incompetent to risk it. He just got beaten on the night.

 

[tiger_tough]

Wrong. He played as a loose man because you had an extra in the backline.

At best he was an elite third man up.

He led the comp in one on one contest wins....

 

[demondavey]

I don’t actually think he is, fat blokes can’t stand on Himmelberg’s head, like he did.

He looks like he enjoys a cheeseburger, but his fatness is over rated.

I agree with everything else you said though.

Yeah he has athleticism. You don’t jump like that without it, I don’t think buddy can even leap like that. He just looks not overly muscular and lean. He wouldn’t be unfit. Just doesn’t have muscular lean physique. His training program probably involves maintaining his strength and core strength for contested work.

 

[demondavey]

The best intercept marker ever? No.

The best current intercept marker? 100% yes.

Who would be? How is an ‘intercept’ mark different from one when we weren’t using the term? Leppitsch and Chad Cornes were both elite intercept marks back ‘in the day’.

 

[Baird]

Not even the best intercept marker named Jeremy

 

[Richo83]

I suspect we're forgetting just how dominant Alex Rance was.

2016 Rance 286 intercepts from 20 games (McGovern 181 from 22)
2017 Rance 236 (25) v McGovern 182 (24)
2018 Rance 237 (24) v McGovern 206 (24)
source: footywire

Rance was a better interceptor than McGovern. Eagles fans, ditch the numbers, look at how they play. McGovern generally sits deep and intercepts long high kicks to goal. It's why the best way to defeat McGovern is to hit his opponent up with short 20-30 meter stab passes. If you actually expect him to spread and keep on his man 50 meters from goal, he's as not effective.

However Rance tried to and was successful at intercepting passes all over the defensive 50. He would play deep, he would play high up. I'm biased but I think Rance was asked to do more than McGovern is. I also think the eagles' backmen's numbers are inflated by the fact that they play in the dry which makes marking the ball easier.

 

[_Mike_]

FESTIVAL OF RED NOW IN EFFECT: READ THE MAINBOARD RULES THREAD

 

[Scotland]

How far back do the stats go ?

Not sure. Footywire counts intercepts from 2015, but not intercept marks. Would be harsh by afl.com.au to count Harry Taylor from 2014/15 then calculate his average going back to games from 2008.

 

[PAFC_1870]

At his best Chad cornes was better and he provided alot of run and rebound off half back. Does mcgovern ever take the game on with his run?

I'm taking Cornes, also played against better fwds in the day imo.

Not as much team defence going on then too to help him.

 

[demondavey]

I'm taking Cornes, also played against better fwds in the day imo.

Not as much team defence going on then too to help him.

Cornes was up there with Leppitsch and Barry as the best CHB in it. James clement was also elite.

 

[PAFC_1870]

Cornes was up there with Leppitsch and Barry as the best CHB in it. James clement was also elite.

This. People have short memories.

Plenty of guns.

 

[Scotland]

Rance was a better interceptor than McGovern. Eagles fans, ditch the numbers, look at how they play. McGovern generally sits deep and intercepts long high kicks to goal. It's why the best way to defeat McGovern is to hit his opponent up with short 20-30 meter stab passes. If you actually expect him to spread and keep on his man 50 meters from goal, he's as not effective.

However Rance tried to and was successful at intercepting passes all over the defensive 50. He would play deep, he would play high up. I'm biased but I think Rance was asked to do more than McGovern is. I also think the eagles' backmen's numbers are inflated by the fact that they play in the dry which makes marking the ball easier.

Ditch the stats so the Richmond guy comes out on top, righto. And you are one of the long term good Richmond posters.

Rance took 27 contested marks one season, his best. McGovern took 30 in his first season, of 13 games. His best is 67. He averages over 2 a game over 133 games. If you want to look at how they play, consider that.

Rance played like a bigger Josh Gibson and people fawn over him like he was Silvagni, Jakovich, Langford and Scarlett all rolled into one. It's an indictment on modern footy fans that a key forward kicks 5 and his opponent is praised as though he's Jakovich drubbing Carey.

Richmond with Rance (and Vlasutin, Grimes, Astbury etc.) were destroyed by Mason Cox (a tall potato) and Jordan De Goey (a talented medium forward) in a prelim. Rance had 20 touches and took 6 marks. Richmond post-Rance let Aaron Naughton take 10 contested marks and have 8 shots at goal. Jeremy Cameron had 30 touches and kicked 7.5. Meanwhile with a full complement of midfielders and forwards back and a few weeks of form the same team steamrolled the Lions, Cats and Giants to win the flag. That people still don't get that Richmond's entire game plan revolves around the pressure from the forward, half forward and centre lines is baffling. The Tigers had the game on their terms on Thursday but it was still close. McGovern had to defend like a defender and neither Lynch or Riewoldt were BOG candidates. We would've loved him to take 10 marks but if Lynch or Riewoldt kicked a bag as a result what's the point? Rd 22 last year was 62-44 inside 50s and came down to the last goal. The only meeting at Perth Stadium was on our terms and we won by 8 goals. Jack Darling made Rance look like a first gamer. What is the point of being an 'intercept defender' if you can't defend?

That's what makes McGovern so valuable. He is a defender first and foremost. If there are opportunities to go for the mark over the or spoil, or he backs himself to leave his man etc. then the takes them. But he's not in the side to take uncontested marks while Hawkins or Dixon or whoever kick bags.

 

[Reservoir tiger]

Ditch the stats so the Richmond guy comes out on top, righto. And you are one of the long term good Richmond posters.

Rance took 27 contested marks one season, his best. McGovern took 30 in his first season, of 13 games. His best is 67. He averages over 2 a game over 133 games. If you want to look at how they play, consider that.

Rance played like a bigger Josh Gibson and people fawn over him like he was Silvagni, Jakovich, Langford and Scarlett all rolled into one. It's an indictment on modern footy fans that a key forward kicks 5 and his opponent is praised as though he's Jakovich drubbing Carey.

Richmond with Rance (and Vlasutin, Grimes, Astbury etc.) were destroyed by Mason Cox (a tall potato) and Jordan De Goey (a talented medium forward) in a prelim. Rance had 20 touches and took 6 marks. Richmond post-Rance let Aaron Naughton take 10 contested marks and have 8 shots at goal. Jeremy Cameron had 30 touches and kicked 7.5. Meanwhile with a full complement of midfielders and forwards back and a few weeks of form the same team steamrolled the Lions, Cats and Giants to win the flag. That people still don't get that Richmond's entire game plan revolves around the pressure from the forward, half forward and centre lines is baffling. The Tigers had the game on their terms on Thursday but it was still close. McGovern had to defend like a defender and neither Lynch or Riewoldt were BOG candidates. We would've loved him to take 10 marks but if Lynch or Riewoldt kicked a bag as a result what's the point? Rd 22 last year was 62-44 inside 50s and came down to the last goal. The only meeting at Perth Stadium was on our terms and we won by 8 goals. Jack Darling made Rance look like a first gamer. What is the point of being an 'intercept defender' if you can't defend?

That's what makes McGovern so valuable. He is a defender first and foremost. If there are opportunities to go for the mark over the or spoil, or he backs himself to leave his man etc. then the takes them. But he's not in the side to take uncontested marks while Hawkins or Dixon or whoever kick bags.

But the thread is umm... best intercept mark...

 

[Scotland]

But the thread is umm... best intercept mark...

Do you want us to play Jeremy McGovern as a spare man in defence every week?

 

[Reservoir tiger]

Do you want us to play Jeremy McGovern as a spare man in defence every week?

Couldn’t care less what they do... but the thread is best intercept mark.

 

[Scotland]

Couldn’t care less what they do... but the thread is best intercept mark.

And McGovern is the best.

 

[HairyO]

Cornes was up there with Leppitsch and Barry as the best CHB in it. James clement was also elite.

There is a 5 times Premiership player at Hawthorn who was so good he kept Peter Knights out of CHB in our team of the century.

Chris Mew.

His game style would slot straight in to a modern footy team.

 

[RichLeMonde]

Why do people insist on running down Gov like he’s some Joel Bowden-esq loose kick off a flank type?

I know people like to cut down a tall poppy but anyone who’s actually watched him play over the last 5-6 seasons knows how good a player he is - how much of an impact he has on games and the role he plays in the Eagles back line.

He’s up there with the best CHBs ever and he’s probably the best intercept mark I’ve seen - nobody reads it like him.

A lot of footy fans still haven’t figured out the difference between the old loose man in defence who would pick up cheap intercept marks,, and players in current defensive systems who are both highly accountable within a zone, and will be in lots of one on one contests, but can also use their brains to know when to zone off an opponent to intercept or create a 2 on 1. A lot of people simply can not grasp this. They think McGovern or Rance never beat an oppo one on one and had the freedom to stroll around at their leisure, when in reality they constantly win one on ones AND know when to zone off and intercept. Well, Rance used to