POLL ADDED: Are Hardwick & Cotchin the right leadership combination for Richmond

[Xenthor]

I reckon Cotchin should be captain, but I would want a leadership group of:
Cotchin (obviously)
Riewoldt
Ranch
Deledio
Vlaustin
Edwards

 

[MaddAdam]

I don't disagree that there was a lot of pressure on Scott, but a large supporter base definitely adds pressure to a team as there is a lot more media focus the two previous losses just add to that.

You only have to look at the amount of threads about Richmond lately or the blow up over Martin to realise that size does matter, if we were small there wouldn't be half the interest.

West Coast have far more intense media interest and pressure and they do OK.

It comes down to a lack of leadership and and poise from the coach and onfield leadership from senior players. Both of which are found desperately wanting when it counts.

 

[Tiger2709]

West Coast have far more intense media interest and pressure and they do OK.

It comes down to a lack of leadership and and poise from the coach and onfield leadership from senior players. Both of which are found desperately wanting when it counts.

I live in WA and I would strongly disagree with that, WCE had little pressure last year owing to lack of expectation because of their injuries and a new coach etc. Freo have more pressure because they are yet to win a flag and Richmond with its years of nothing has more pressure than any club I know of but were all entitled to our own opinions, the Melbourne media IMO is a much harsher judge and more intense, here they are very supportive of the teams

 

[PhatHQ]

I would rate Cotchin pretty low on the Captain scale, as a distant observer. He is in the same meek class as Swallow IMO & has had his shot with little to show.
I don't think Richmond have had a decent Captain that represents what Richmond have long stood for since Campbell. I have always viewed the Tigers as being a hard nosed team who like the tough stuff while having some controlled flair. I don't see that leadership coming anyone on the Tigers list. The closest to it would be Dusty but his baggage & bad boy rep will hold him back from being captain. Maturity & a decent hair cut could change all that & I would definatly be on the Dusty as Captain
Jack could do it but.... It's sookie Jack! Yet he would still be better than Cotchin!
I hope that doesn't sound like a bit of s**t slinging! I love to hate a good Tigers team & a hard nosed Captain that drives his team

 

[Ry009]

Dannnnn covered it well, they're still building, I think a few big wins against the tops sides along the way have blown the lid right off, and has been touched on in the thread media continually throw fuel on the fire and they're victims of expectations.

I think Dimma probably went a bit early on getting players from other clubs, but you would hope there is still some maturity to come in the top end to carry them a bit further into September. I'm not sure about Hardwick but I think the extension was a good idea to take the pressure off and let this current squad to continue to develop.

 

[woopedazz]

Dannnnn covered it well, they're still building, I think a few big wins against the tops sides along the way have blown the lid right off, and has been touched on in the thread media continually throw fuel on the fire and they're victims of expectations ... but I think the extension was a good idea to take the pressure off and let this current squad to continue to develop.

They've been building for a while. At some point they need to offer some results. Jack won't go forever.

 

[SdKfz 181]

They've been building for a while. At some point they need to offer some results. Jack won't go forever.

We had 10 players under 50 matches last night, 4 retirements last year, and few injuries leading up into that match. We will only get stronger as the season progresses.

 

[kneecapper]

Not sure if Cotchin is the best leader but I think it's wrong of him to have stolen the front of Dustin Martin's haircut for his own head.

 

[theyellowsash]

Cotchin is a pathetic captain. He is a total soft**** who is unreliable and goes missing constantly. If he wasnt captain he would be in and out of the side.

I vote for jack as at least he shows some heart and passion and has the capability of lifting the team if required. He generally shows up at important times even if he's having a poor game.

 

[BRWB]

Leadership can't really be judged accurately from the outside. However, one aspect of leadership is standing up in critical moments. Not sure that Dimma and Cotch achieve this consistently.

My Tiges supporting bro has said for some years that the Tigers were destined for mid table. For instance he has wanted to trade Lids for a some time in order to take a step back to go fwd.

The introduction of FA, GC and GWS has crueled most list builds and artificially kept the top clubs at the top.

In that environment clubs like the Tiges can barely afford a mistake at the draft table.

Unfortunately for the Tiges I'm pretty certain they stay mid table. But leadership is just one of many reasons for this.

 

[juss]

Would have Rance personally. Directs traffic well and stands up every game

 

[MaddAdam]

I live in WA and I would strongly disagree with that, WCE had little pressure last year owing to lack of expectation because of their injuries and a new coach etc. Freo have more pressure because they are yet to win a flag and Richmond with its years of nothing has more pressure than any club I know of but were all entitled to our own opinions, the Melbourne media IMO is a much harsher judge and more intense, here they are very supportive of the teams

The real pressure on Richmond is inside their own heads.

Blaming the media is an enormous cop out.

 

[Tiger2709]

The real pressure on Richmond is inside their own heads.

Blaming the media is an enormous cop out.

What do you think creates the pressure in their heads?

The media just does it's job but there is no comparison in the heat that is put on at a big club compared to a smaller club, why do you think todays news is about the Magpie 11 when the media know that two other clubs have more offenders, because big clubs are big news, if you dont think that adds pressure then I dont know what to say.

 

[Tiger2709]

I would rate Cotchin pretty low on the Captain scale, as a distant observer. He is in the same meek class as Swallow IMO & has had his shot with little to show.
I don't think Richmond have had a decent Captain that represents what Richmond have long stood for since Campbell. I have always viewed the Tigers as being a hard nosed team who like the tough stuff while having some controlled flair. I don't see that leadership coming anyone on the Tigers list. The closest to it would be Dusty but his baggage & bad boy rep will hold him back from being captain. Maturity & a decent hair cut could change all that & I would definatly be on the Dusty as Captain
Jack could do it but.... It's sookie Jack! Yet he would still be better than Cotchin!
I hope that doesn't sound like a bit of s**t slinging! I love to hate a good Tigers team & a hard nosed Captain that drives his team

Vlastuin is a likely Captain, hard as nails but still to young, Cotchin was actually rated as one of the better Captains throughout last year, until the final, so probably deserves this year but he has to stand up and lead from the front, last night was very dissapointing.

Lets not forget the players and coaches choose the Captain so they must feel he is still the best to lead us.

 

[MaddAdam]

What do you think creates the pressure in their heads?

The media just does it's job but there is no comparison in the heat that is put on at a big club compared to a smaller club, why do you think todays news is about the Magpie 11 when the media know that two other clubs have more offenders, because big clubs are big news, if you dont think that adds pressure then I dont know what to say.

Letting the media get to you is the definition of a poorly led club. A good coach and list with strong leaders create a culture where what happens on "media street" is immaterial.

I suspect you just like posting about how Richmond is a "big club". Hasn't exactly served the Tiges well in the last three decades, being a "big club", has it?

 

[Tiger2709]

Letting the media get to you is the definition of a poorly led club. A good coach and list with strong leaders create a culture where what happens on "media street" is immaterial.

I suspect you just like posting about how Richmond is a "big club". Hasn't exactly served the Tiges well in the last three decades, being a "big club", has it?

I suspect this conversation has run its course.

 

[PhatHQ]

Vlastuin is a likely Captain, hard as nails but still to young, Cotchin was actually rated as one of the better Captains throughout last year, until the final, so probably deserves this year but he has to stand up and lead from the front, last night was very dissapointing.

Lets not forget the players and coaches choose the Captain so they must feel he is still the best to lead us.

No doubt that within the walls at Punt rd he would have some really good leadership value & that would also translate well into the community as he is well spoken with a touch of class unlike a Tex walker who translates to the cross eyed Crows supporter I think he played better footy when he didn't have the extra responsibility not unlike Murphy.
I rate Cotchin quite high when he is on & he can bring others up to a higher level but if he isn't doing that on game day then there isn't any point to being a Captain that only does half of the job. Sounds a bit harsh & everyone has up & down seasons! Fingers crossed he can get it back on track

 

[pinot]

Don't be stupid Cotchin is a top player and brownlow material obviously.

Players sometimes go through a patch in their careers which can be considered grossly out of form until they get their rhythm back. Sometimes it takes one week, sometimes it takes many months. but cotchins case form is temporary class is permanent. Feels weird standing up for him as I want to see him choke but its is what it is,

 

[rippersnipper]

Why not deledio. Seems to always lift the tiges when he plays, compared to when he doesn't and they play terribly.

 

[Jack Bradley]

Richmond is my second team, so I'll put that on the cards. We all have mates who go for them, we all feel their anguish (and they feel mine).

After watching the AFL captain's special last year and, like many, feeling thoroughly underwhelmed by Trent Cotchin, I found myself tonight, after watching the round table, feeling equally ambivalent about Damian Hardwick. I fear the leadership in the club isn't what it could be. Do Richmond need "better" leaders or are they a victim of their own supporter base size?

This is not a bash Richmond campaign, it's just a discussion about whether the men who are charged with their on field success, are the right people.

Your first team is bulldogs and your second team is Richmond? Ouuuuuch

 

[Barry_Badrinath]

Cotchin is a pathetic captain. He is a total soft**** who is unreliable and goes missing constantly. If he wasnt captain he would be in and out of the side.

I vote for jack as at least he shows some heart and passion and has the capability of lifting the team if required. He generally shows up at important times even if he's having a poor game.

 

[Jack Bradley]

Richmond were 15-7 last year. They beat Freo, Sydney, Hawthorn & North during the year.
I think they are doing alright.

Lol at counting the north win

 

[Pannalstaroz]

Lol at ever counting a north win

EFA

 

[MaddAdam]

I suspect this conversation has run its course.

Indeed, as I am correct.

 

[Barry_Badrinath]

Leadership can't really be judged accurately from the outside. However, one aspect of leadership is standing up in critical moments. Not sure that Dimma and Cotch achieve this consistently.

My Tiges supporting bro has said for some years that the Tigers were destined for mid table. For instance he has wanted to trade Lids for a some time in order to take a step back to go fwd.

The introduction of FA, GC and GWS has crueled most list builds and artificially kept the top clubs at the top.

In that environment clubs like the Tiges can barely afford a mistake at the draft table.

Unfortunately for the Tiges I'm pretty certain they stay mid table. But leadership is just one of many reasons for this.

Have they? When the Gold Coast entered the league the top 4 were: Collingwood, St Kilda, Geelong and the Bulldogs. How have those clubs gone in recent years?