Preview Rnd 11: Collingwood vs Geelong Sat May 29 1:45pm @ MCG

[Ratcat]

It was an example hence the E.g .....

I wasn't saying CC had 34 handballs and they all went the the opposition i was stating that a player having 34 posies doesn't mean they were good (CC was actually fairly good) so looking at just stats is just wrong.

Yeah l know stats don't say it all, but they are there to indicate who is performing or not, a bit like sitting exams.
So imo they do carry a lot of weight.

Personally l'd like to see him have 4 games on the trot to genuinely asses the guy, l wouldn't just dismiss his AFL potential we just don't know enough, he's a mature player now and he started brilliant 4 years ago.
Just my opinion l might be wrong, but need to see the 2021 version.

 

[CatToTheFuture]

So if he is sh** I was right and he wasn’t managed. He was dropped.

if he is good then I’m right again as he was still dropped. 7 weeks off including a couple of vfl game is not being managed. especially given he had only played 1 afl game.

"Dropped" is a term used to indicate someone being removed from the best side available. So no. He was coming in for Menegola who was injured and this time he's coming I'm for Duncan who was concussed.

Fundamentally you can't be dropped from a position you're not in. It's a good development opportunity for a kid who is a reliable 2022/23 prospect

 

[CatToTheFuture]

Funny that ... you say he can't run but somehow windes up with 34 possies, l find that quite peculiar.
Anyway you have your opinion, l have mine.

Please find an example of one of his possessions that he had to run to create then. They're all either at a stoppage or with him sagging off a stoppage, or with him standing flat footed in the corridor as a link up.

You have your opinion and I have mine

 

[Wojcinski]

I am a Constable fan and I'd like to see him get a run in the seniors but there is something very George Horlin-Smith about both his VFL and AFL performance

 

[catempire]

I am a Constable fan and I'd like to see him get a run in the seniors but there is something very George Horlin-Smith about both his VFL and AFL performance

I feel the same.

 

[catempire]

I'll put it to you that Cam Guthrie doesn't hurt sides either and is never tagged by the opposition for that reason but is loved by the club and majority of supporters.

Given he has 30 coaches votes including two 10 vote games, it seems the opposition coaches have a somewhat different view than you.

Nobody gets tagged these days. That’s not a useful measure.

 

[you pick one]

Given he has 30 coaches votes including two 10 vote games, it seems the opposition coaches have a somewhat different view than you.

Nobody gets tagged these days. That’s not a useful measure.

What's Mark O'Connor's job been this year?

 

[catempire]

What's Mark O'Connor's job been this year?

Towel boy in the injury room?

 

[foodles05]

I'll put it to you that Cam Guthrie doesn't hurt sides either and is never tagged by the opposition for that reason but is loved by the club and majority of supporters.

Yeah find it hard to agree to be fair. If we are comparing; Guthrie wins it inside and outside the contest. He wins damaging clearances not just handball ones. He's very good overhead and he does all of this week in week out at the highest level. Oh and he is an absolutely elite kick who can drill goals from outside 50.

 

[Ratcat]

Rat you have to get away from this obsession with pure numbers. It really doesn't do you or anyone else any favours in assessing someone's output. I have no doubt you will respond with his inside work from a stats perspective but again if that's all he does he ain't good enough to play. All you have to do is think who are the pure inside mids (no outside game really) in our team considering you absolutely can't carry anymore than 1 of them. That in our current team would be Joel in my opinion. Joel would get 50 in the 2s maybe more.

Why do you think Rockliff gets dropped by Port despite his output. It's because he can't spread at all and they already have Wines. Also Rockliff gets obscene numbers in the 2s by the way. Not Constable numbers way way more impressive. Like 38 and 2 goals ect

Hey Foodles,

I reckon first use players are an absolute necessity if you expect success especially in finals, and l reckon 2nds footy also often doesn't support high stats, yet CC has been dominant with high numbers.
Now, you're comparing him to the Captain who's a legend, l think we need to cut some slack and hopefully we get to see him play senior footy before we put a line through his name.
Look at Narkle of late, l thought this guy's never gonna cut senior level, but l called it a month ago when he got some game time, Narkle is going to be great.

 

[Live in hope]

Danger game for us, Magpies still pretty good in the middle, with Grundy back to form and a dangerous forward line particularly if Moore moves there.

Given no Dangerfield, Duncan and a sore Cuthrie, huge reliance again on Joel and Parfitt, be a good test for Narkle-can he maintain that intensity. Hopefully Holmes can help with some break away speed.
If we give Magpies a ‘sniff’ early we may find this very tough.

 

[you pick one]

Yeah find it hard to agree to be fair. If we are comparing; Guthrie wins it inside and outside the contest. He wins damaging clearances not just handball ones. He's very good overhead and he does all of this week in week out at the highest level. Oh and he is an absolutely elite kick who can drill goals from outside 50.

I agree he's capable overhead but the fact is he's averaging over 30 disposals a game this year as a mid for 2 goal and 5 assists total that's not hurting the opposition that doesn't cause any concerns for oppositions, coaches know his first second and third option is to go short with the ball and to lead up short, he has become so predictable sides just let him run around on his own.
I'd like to see him use the space he's afforded to get forward into dangerous positions kick some of those long goals and make oppositions send someone to him.

 

[foodles05]

Hey Foodles,

I reckon first use players are an absolute necessity if you expect success especially in finals, and l reckon 2nds footy also often doesn't support high stats, yet CC has been dominant with high numbers.
Now, you're comparing him to the Captain who's a legend, l think we need to cut some slack and hopefully we get to see him play senior footy before we put a line through his name.
Look at Narkle of late, l thought this guy's never gonna cut senior level, but l called it a month ago when he got some game time, Narkle is going to be great.

Yeah agreed totally unfair to compare him as a player with a legend. I was only using it to explain why his limitations may keep him from playing for us or perhaps anyone. A team just can't carry more than 1 of his type of player. That is especially the case when he is competing with some who can be first possession but also spread and hurt on the outside. Narkle is a good example of this.

So I only referenced Joel as the player he is most similar to and will have to replace in my opinion to get a spot in this team. He could have perhaps played ahead of Narkle but he simply can't do the things that Narkle can and Narkle can do the things inside that CC can.

I have said this before but if you want to play like Constable you better be so ******* elite at inside craft that you make yourself undeniable, and negate the obvious deficiencies he also brings to the team. I just don't think give how badly he moves that he makes up for it inside when compared with others.

 

[Grimoz]

Tipping Rohan to kick a bag

 

[Grimoz]

Danger game for us, Magpies still pretty good in the middle, with Grundy back to form and a dangerous forward line particularly if Moore moves there.

Given no Dangerfield, Duncan and a sore Cuthrie, huge reliance again on Joel and Parfitt, be a good test for Narkle-can he maintain that intensity. Hopefully Holmes can help with some break away speed.
If we give Magpies a ‘sniff’ early we may find this very tough.

I think every game is a danger game but they have lost there best mid in Adams and one of their better player over the last month in Mcreery, stats dont lie, they are a shambles and cant see them getting close to us if we play well.

 

[FredLeDeux]

Tipping Rohan to kick a bag

Cameron kicks more goals against Collingwood than any other team except Gold Coast, at nearly twice his career average.

 

[Pollywaffle]

Tipping Rohan to kick a bag

What's her name?

 

[calder_daddy]

I said it before and i will say it again a big reason maybe even the main one they have gone Holmes instead of CC/Clark is because Holmes was the sub last week and didn't get any game time at any level and with the VFL getting called off they will not want him to miss another week if they can help it hence him being picked first.

For me it’s as simple as Holmes is a pure wingman and could end up with a similar output of Duncan “who he’s replacing” by the end of his career
If Clark was in form he’d come in, if the Narkle wasn’t already in the side Constable would be in.
You can’t have both Narkle and Constable in your midfield IMO

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

Tipping Rohan to kick a bag

It's better than kicking a bucket.

 

[frggr]

"Scott said revered recruiter and list manager Stephen Wells had returned to the club after a short break but his role would change for 2022. Premiership player Andrew Mackie is in Wells’ list-management team and is highly regarded."

That's good to hear

From this article, which also says the Magpies have been so deplorable with their skills, they've added a skill specific training session each week

‘Price we had to pay’: Struggling Magpies ramp up focus on skills

Collingwood coach Nathan Buckley has revealed the Magpies have added a skills-focused training session to their weekly agenda, as Chris Scott defended a controversial tackle on Mitch Duncan.

www.theage.com.au

 

[frggr]

He's certainly a rare talent.
Given his ability and family connection to the Pies, it's intersting the club only managed a two year contract. He is back on the market at the end of next season....

He and Buckley with something in common then

 

[Chinacats]

I said it before and i will say it again a big reason maybe even the main one they have gone Holmes instead of CC/Clark is because Holmes was the sub last week and didn't get any game time at any level and with the VFL getting called off they will not want him to miss another week if they can help it hence him being picked first.

Speed on big MCG gets him the nod over chook. Clark attitude issues rankle Scott. He likes zuthrie & Esava types. Good boys , polite, nice and good listeners.

 

[catempire]

Fort replaces Constable as emergency. What sorcery is this??

 

[Chinacats]

Please find an example of one of his possessions that he had to run to create then. They're all either at a stoppage or with him sagging off a stoppage, or with him standing flat footed in the corridor as a link up.

You have your opinion and I have mine

Yes that’s exactly right about chook. Sagging off at stoppages and a few link up possies. Definitely no speed to space or sprinting or anything. Can’t have that at the G.

 

[Spearman]

Fort replaces Constable as emergency. What sorcery is this??

like for like ?