List Mgmt. The 2018 Draft & Trade Hypotheticals Thread

[Tedeski]

The draw is a copout, how about losing to bottom 8 sides at home. That isn't the draw, that is purely and simply an inability to score.

Yeah I said "Winning an extra 4 games at home is a start."
The draw wasn't as good as Pies & Hawks.

 

[skipper kelly]

off topic - my brain just exploded.

 

[The Gong]

off topic - my brain just exploded.

Imagine being a list manager for real. So many variables you can't control that make you a genius or an abject failure.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

100% agree on the kicking skills.

We need speed through the middle and we have Jones already signed up that will provide that. Mills won the Rising Star playing outside his normal position when he's a midfielder first and foremost so imagine how he'd go in the middle. We've got Taylor Duryea coming in who may be bottom six type player but a pretty bloody solid bottom six player to help with running the ball off half-back. You've got Rampe who was All-Australian as a rebounding defender and Lloyd who made the 40-man squad doing the same role. I think we can cover those moves but we need KPD depth since we're still really looking for a replacement for Ted Richards and now Grundy. If Melican is fit he's your fullback and Aliir playing CHB or loose defender. Need a few more options there. Also need to replace Smith which won't be easy.

We need speed and quality. Need less ball butcherers. Shipping Hanners off will help this, well the bloke coming in can't kick any worse that's for sure. Meh if we don't replace Smith, we go more attacking. I would actually prefer this way. Another attacking HBF would be ideal. Personally I feel we have enough defenders.

 

[skipper kelly]

Imagine being a list manager for real. So many variables you can't control that make you a genius or an abject failure.

I struggle to manage myself. It's all too complex these days.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Yeah I said "Winning an extra 4 games at home is a start."
The draw wasn't as good as Pies & Hawks.

Maybe so but dropping games to GC (laughable), Port...and North at home. We would have been top 3, we wouldn't have won but that's beside the point. The lack of a gameplan to score is a huge issue.

This also goes into drafting as it's harder to attract players to play a boring game style.

 

[RUNVS]

We need speed and quality. Need less ball butcherers. Shipping Hanners off will help this, well the bloke coming in can't kick any worse that's for sure. Meh if we don't replace Smith, we go more attacking. I would actually prefer this way. Another attacking HBF would be ideal. Personally I feel we have enough defenders.

Agree so much. If the player is not at a minimum an average kick they should not even be considered, so I would think at the very least a 60% kicking efficiency for an inside player and 65% for an outside player.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Who are these others?

Draft them. I'd be investigating every possible way to trade up this year, or at worse stockpile picks in 2019.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Agree so much. If the player is not at a minimum an average kick they should not even be considered, so I would think at the very least a 60% kicking efficiency for an inside player and 65% for an outside player.

Bare minimum on the 65% as an outside. That is our HUGE issue right now.

 

[The Gong]

We need speed and quality. Need less ball butcherers. Shipping Hanners off will help this, well the bloke coming in can't kick any worse that's for sure. Meh if we don't replace Smith, we go more attacking. I would actually prefer this way. Another attacking HBF would be ideal. Personally I feel we have enough defenders.

Replacing Smith has nothing to do with being more attacking. His job is to shutdown the opposition's best small forward and that job doesn't suddenly disappear. Smith isn't a distributor out of defence.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Replacing Smith has nothing to do with being more attacking. His job is to shutdown the opposition's best small forward and that job doesn't suddenly disappear. Smith isn't a distributor out of defence.

That is my point. Maybe we don't necessarily need to replace Smith. Rather we get in another runner coming out of defence. Back these new defenders to shut down their players enough whilst hurting the opposition the other way.

 

[ClarkeyyRednWhite]

If Parker left we’d be done


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[Heeney2Franklin]

If Parker left we’d be done


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Good thing he isnt leaving

 

[Dan87]

Wingard situation is odd

his management and Port are bickering it out in media, was supposedly leaked that he'd backed down from a trade request, Wingard denies it, Club says he'll stay at Port if he wants.

watching with interest

 

[The Gong]

That is my point. Maybe we don't necessarily need to replace Smith. Rather we get in another runner coming out of defence. Back these new defenders to shut down their players enough whilst hurting the opposition the other way.

Well that would be Nirvana but you'd do well to have a player that can do both.

It is also a game plan thing. It was based on forcing stoppages and grinding out possession and grafting the ball forward and then our contested footy went to crap and the game plan fell apart. Getting a decent tap ruckman back might fix some of that but Naismith has limitations.

So our defenders generally always work the ball to the wings out of defense, willing to have the ball go out of bounds and force a stoppage but we've been progressively getting worse at stoppages so we've struggled to get ball into the forward half. Harley has said they know they need run through the middle so I'm desperately hoping that means a new focus on run and carry and taking the corridor on and getting enough ball into the forward 50 to actually kick some goals. In balance we also need to win more clearances as well and I think Mills helps there and Jones helps with the outside run. We can cover them in the back half with the right recruits.

 

[Wolftone]

What exactly is it?

A Free Agent can move from your club, even if contracted, if they get a better offer and the club does not match it. They can move even if the club matches it if they are a non restricted free agent. The AFL will offer a compensation pick for a free agent. A contracted non free agent player at a club may not move from the club unless the club gives permission for them to explore other avenues. If the club does this, as in the case of Sheil, then the two clubs will sit down to thrash out a deal in trade week. If a deal cannot be done the player Must stay at his club for the remainder of his contract unless a deal can be brokered before the end of the contract period

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[ClarkeyyRednWhite]

Anyone expecting us to pick anyone up tomorrow in free agency, maybe Taylor duryea?


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[ponsdale]

Yeah I'd be offering one of our second round picks for Tyson, can't see anyone at the club making that offer.

What's Vandenburg's currency though?

Demons fans and the club love the bloke. He always plays at 100% commitment to the team, his tackles and hits hurt, is quicker than he looks, and does have some improvement.

But he's not young, he's been quite injured, and if it happens, it's because he wants to move to be near family.

I'd say it would be a late third round, or even may be lower because of injuries.

 

[Mick Oxlong]

Bare minimum on the 65% as an outside. That is our HUGE issue right now.

Ah but the efficiency is borne by the kicker, not what happens at the end of the balls trajectory (the defensive measures such as a spoil) or the competence of the ‘marker’, that in itself is a flaw because it’s out of the kickers hands.

Having said that, we do butcher it because we always seem to be in two minds...stick to plan or play our natural game? We seem to stick to plan in my opinion!

 

[doona]

A Free Agent can move from your club, even if contracted

A player can only be a free agent if out of contract. If they are contracted, they require a trade.

 

[Mick Oxlong]

A Free Agent can move from your club, even if contracted, if they get a better offer and the club does not match it. They can move even if the club matches it if they are a non restricted free agent. The AFL will offer a compensation pick for a free agent. A contracted non free agent player at a club may not move from the club unless the club gives permission for them to explore other avenues. If the club does this, as in the case of Sheil, then the two clubs will sit down to thrash out a deal in trade week. If a deal cannot be done the player Must stay at his club for the remainder of his contract unless a deal can be brokered before the end of the contract period

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A free agent CANNOT move if they’re contracted...they’re not ‘free’ from their contract!

 

[Opts]

A Free Agent can move from your club, even if contracted, if they get a better offer and the club does not match it. They can move even if the club matches it if they are a non restricted free agent. The AFL will offer a compensation pick for a free agent. A contracted non free agent player at a club may not move from the club unless the club gives permission for them to explore other avenues. If the club does this, as in the case of Sheil, then the two clubs will sit down to thrash out a deal in trade week. If a deal cannot be done the player Must stay at his club for the remainder of his contract unless a deal can be brokered before the end of the contract period

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Even if contracted? . I don't think so.

 

[ponsdale]

A player is only a free agent if out of contract. If they are contracted, they require a trade.

I think Wolftone is talking about the timing of the end of contracts - which is always timed to be just after the end of the trade period, but before the draft.

So if Player A comes out of contract in 2018, he will actually still be contracted through the trade period. This means that the club has some negotiating power during trade week.

For a free agent (restricted, or unrestricted), this part doesn't apply. At the end of the contract, the free agent has the ability to decide on any club themselves.

 

[robbieando]

Also anyone who believes the cap is a "hard" cap are kidding themselves. Players are bought things all the time. "Take 200k less salary a year with us and we will buy you 600k worth of property"

I'm sorry but this is just nonsense. Clubs or people connected with clubs can't just buy or gift players property and not include it in the salary cap. It would be a Carlton level breach of the salary cap. The CBA the Players Association signed even forbids this

But your right about there not being a "hard" cap. While next year the Salary Cap will be $12,758,095 for each club, EVERY club will also have an additional Additional Services Agreement Limit of $1,125,983 on top of the cap.

Yep. Sponsors supply free or heavily discounted cars to players and their families/friend and also use players as "ambassadors" or to advertise, get put on the Footy Show, etc, etc. The big Melbourne clubs are the worst abusers of this loophole.

Again that is nonsense. Free cars would be a cap breach unless included in the players contract, but free use of a car would be included under the clubs ASA limit and is not a loophole and is available to every club. Don't think for a second we don't have a fleet agreement in place with VW under our sponsorship with them for any player that wants a VW vehicle to use. If the player wants any other make of vehicle they have to pay for it themselves otherwise we would be breaching our our sponsorship deal.

The ASA limits apply for money earned from media appearances (so bookings on shows like the Footy Show or AFL 360 fall under this), additional uses of the players image for club or media use than agreed under the CBA and AFL promotional events or ambassadorial roles

All ASA limit payments have to fit within the $1,125,983 cap available to each club and have to be approved by the AFL. They also apply to the players families.

http://www.aflplayers.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/2017-2022-CBA.pdf

Its pretty clear cut.

 

[Mick Oxlong]

I think Wolftone is talking about the timing of the end of contracts - which is always timed to be just after the end of the trade period, but before the draft.

So if Player A comes out of contract in 2018, he will actually still be contracted through the trade period. This means that the club has some negotiating power during trade week.

For a free agent (restricted, or unrestricted), this part doesn't apply. At the end of the contract, the free agent has the ability to decide on any club themselves.

No he’s not, he’s talking gibberish...stated ‘even when contracted’.