Autopsy Autopsy vs Saints - Nadir

[naturally north]

Du

Which is why I never get the "in Tudor" posts. When we change coach I don't want someone who has been part of the same decision-making team.

Dunno we look different when coached by Crocker, i am 100 % sure Scott has final say on pretty much everything.

 

[Dirty_11]

Unfortunately the more pessimistic hunches of the last couple of years are being validated.

It's unpopular as it goes against the party line but on his career trajectory Waite should never have been retained. While immensely gifted, his intra-season form has always been incredibly erratic. He never seems to be in the sharpest condition but this year he looked AFL overweight, ie he's not of much role model value in teaching others how to live an AFL lifestyle in a 'resetting' side.

Conversely you have Boomer. Absolute icon in terms of how to prepare and despite the notion his absence opens up spots, all its done is load Higgins shoulders to breaking point. Boomer might've had his defensive deficiencies (who doesn't?) but on perceived form he'd be getting a game this year of all bar about 4-5 blokes and filling a much needed role. Might've kept a few members too..

Moving back to the current I can see how armchair fans are unmoved. I posted during summer that I was confused as to our direction and still am. It took until their confidence was eroded to dust omit Swallow and Thomas. Goldie (albeit slight form uplift last night) and Waite seemingly undroppable.

Then you have Daw. Everyone has their opinion on his potential. But after 8 seasons that's all we can still talk about - potential. Yes he was injured but in the season where he plays his best ever 'heart' game, he hasn't been seen again in senior company. Surely this is the season to give the mid 20s bloke who aced a final and signed a 3 year deal some assured continuity so we can FINALLY get a handle on his realised value as a footballer? Here we are in 2017 still asking the same questions!

Then there's the usual team traits. The inability to protect leads. The inability to overrun teams that race away on us. Short range disposal that doesn't hit a target and when it does it reaches a flatfooted target.

Which is the biggest issue. Lack of running effort. Ziebell did a 1-2 with I think Atley at halfback and offered no shepherd, didn't run a few metres to give a get out. Nothing. Just stood there. Waite stood and watched a saints player kick to himself on a kick out and just waltz past him. No arms up, no token chase. Nothing. Just stood there.

No standards. As it's been for a long time.

I think the "saints were s**t too" comments are disingenuous. When it mattered they spread to a degree of having multiple options on each play, they cracked in harder, played keepings off with our terracotta army and nailed all their shots when the heat was on.

Against the Cats, the Daw/Preuss combo was good. Better than the Goldy/Preuss and solo Goldy efforts we have seen since. The problem with Goldy is that he is the biggest bloke on the ground but plays like a flanker. We have a problem now of trying to keep Goldy's trade value at the expense of Preuss and Daw's development. Goldy has to be traded at season's end.

 

[ferball]

Maybe there was a message in that. In my opinion very few people would have got all that much joy in seeing Boomer go around in a car, when they disagreed with the decision last year and still do. If people did stay away because of Boomer's treatment; and I'm only saying they may have; then it would not have taken them long to feel relieved they never turned up.

I'm trying to console myself that maybe one reason for our poor showing last night was, once again for us, coming off a bye, where if I am not mistaken, we have historically not performed well. (This- the impact of the bye - might have been covered earlier in this thread, but I'm not too much into self-flagellation when it comes to reading autopsy threads after a game like last night. I would prefer to go and clamber through a 6 wire well strained barb wire fence and enjoy the experience of painfully extracting myself from its clutches.)

Geelong has never won a game coming off a bye. Famously (or infamously whichever way you want to look at it) we won coming off the equivalent of a bye in the Elimination final in 2015, but I don't think we have much before.

I seem to remember complaining about this last year. The AFL should do away with Bye rounds over 3 weeks and just have one bye round, heavily promote the VFL for that round, or at the very least only have teams coming off a bye, playing other teams coming off a bye. Interestingly the Saints came off a bye last week and were terrible against Adelaide. But of course that would be far far far too hard for the AFL to be able to construct a drawer around a notion as "complex" as maybe having something along the lines of a level playing field.

I know a trick for getting thru barbed wire fences but the older and rounder I get the harder it is to do.

Wondered about the Boomer thing too. Maybe people were over it. Have the overall numbers for the league been down at all the last few weeks?

And the bye. We hate the bye.

 

[Dirty_11]

Can't believe you watched the replay. I couldn't even watch the game once. My son had it on when I got up this morning and I insisted he delete it unwatched.

I so hope that was the nadir. I left last night when I thought it was as bad as it could get - as Daniel Cherney so eloquently says in his Age article about half time, "But almost defying belief, the game quality actually deteriorated from there".

Even thinking about watching that replay at the moment makes me want to throw up all over the floor. I will at some stage. Maybe tomorrow.

 

[ferball]

I still reckon it's this Dosh Kelly and gold Dusty Martin thing . The players feel like they should be getting more cash . But with performances like the last 2 we ain't getting either and these spuds we have as players CGAGF........

We finish last or there abouts then we can pick up some jet who has all the attributes you request ... I think if we play in this manner we will get . But I hope North pick a Franklin and not a Tambling ... ;-)

I have a Swans supporting mate who reckons overpaying Franklin is why they have struggled to win flags for 5 years despite being a very dominant team.

 

[shintemaster]

The comment wasn't based on their playing ability, it was delivery inside 50. Boomer was the best in the comp for 20 years.

I agree but our current problem is getting it cleanly to that half forward line IMHO. It's not so much the last kick, it's the fact that every possession getting it there (if it even does) is heaping more and more pressure on the final carrier.

Wells was the best player at finding space on our list - basically since he was recruited.

 

[ferball]

Winning and losing are irrelevant at the moment. We need to discover how to play footy.

Yeah I agree. If we'd actually played footy we probably would have won too FWIW.

 

[ferball]

Interesting point. BMac was often maligned here, but he was better than many who played last night.

Yeah but would he have been if he'd played last night?

 

[Only Forwards]

We have pieces but no cohesion.

Its like we're a car, sometimes we have no petrol, so will fill up only to find out that in the process all the tires went flat. We sort out the tires and someone steals the steering wheel.

 

[Dirty_11]

Not sure it's as simple as that. Bringing the extra crowds is not just about ladder position - it's about it feeling worth the effort. The team is back between a rock and a hard place at the moment - a few older players hanging on and some not delivering all that much, no players like Daw and Simpkin who you know will give you some thrills, neither contending nor rising. I think we'd have better crowds with more dash and dare at selection and on the field, and with the effort and pressure we saw earlier in the year - it wouldn't be just about ladder because we'd know it would be fun and we'd be in with a shot of an upset.

I didn't mention ladder position, I mentioned 'bottom 4 form' as in playing ordinary football.

 

[Donkey Chop]

Roses are red
Violets are blue
North Melbourne are s**t
StKilda is too

 

[SonofSamsquanch]

Yeah but would he have been if he'd played last night?

Good point, and we will never know. BMac was never a great player, but the current team have a few of these still, and frankly, some are worserer.

 

[SonofSamsquanch]

Roses are red
Violets are blue
North Melbourne are s**t
StKilda is too

POTW

 

[Snake_Baker]

 

[Scallop Industry Thug]

I saw Luke Beveridge on level 2 scouting us for next week. He left his scouting report on his seat at half time, so I snuck a glance.

It said "Just turn up".

 

[Grogg]

Is that Tudor on the bonnet?

 

[Shermanator]

Roses are red
Violets are blue
North Melbourne are s**t
StKilda is too

Yeah that's so true. If you think we've harbored false hope of the years, I would hate to be an Aints fan..

 

[ferball]

Which is why I never get the "in Tudor" posts. When we change coach I don't want someone who has been part of the same decision-making team.

Tudor is always pegged as the forward and midfield coach. The very place we fall down. Our backline is unreal but our back coach always cops it.

 

[muttley45]

My nephew (supercoach generation) trots in this morning and tells me how good was Goldy last night, he scored 128 pts, i said so he should have against an absolute s**t truck in Longer, what did he get 70+ hitouts ? check the stat's and 2 kicks, 0 tackles, and 33 hitouts, HTF does that work ?

 

[Grogg]

Unfortunately the more pessimistic hunches of the last couple of years are being validated.

It's unpopular as it goes against the party line but on his career trajectory Waite should never have been retained. While immensely gifted, his intra-season form has always been incredibly erratic. He never seems to be in the sharpest condition but this year he looked AFL overweight, ie he's not of much role model value in teaching others how to live an AFL lifestyle in a 'resetting' side.

Conversely you have Boomer. Absolute icon in terms of how to prepare and despite the notion his absence opens up spots, all its done is load Higgins shoulders to breaking point. Boomer might've had his defensive deficiencies (who doesn't?) but on perceived form he'd be getting a game this year of all bar about 4-5 blokes and filling a much needed role. Might've kept a few members too..

Moving back to the current I can see how armchair fans are unmoved. I posted during summer that I was confused as to our direction and still am. It took until their confidence was eroded to dust omit Swallow and Thomas. Goldie (albeit slight form uplift last night) and Waite seemingly undroppable.

Then you have Daw. Everyone has their opinion on his potential. But after 8 seasons that's all we can still talk about - potential. Yes he was injured but in the season where he plays his best ever 'heart' game, he hasn't been seen again in senior company. Surely this is the season to give the mid 20s bloke who aced a final and signed a 3 year deal some assured continuity so we can FINALLY get a handle on his realised value as a footballer? Here we are in 2017 still asking the same questions!

Then there's the usual team traits. The inability to protect leads. The inability to overrun teams that race away on us. Short range disposal that doesn't hit a target and when it does it reaches a flatfooted target.

Which is the biggest issue. Lack of running effort. Ziebell did a 1-2 with I think Atley at halfback and offered no shepherd, didn't run a few metres to give a get out. Nothing. Just stood there. Waite stood and watched a saints player kick to himself on a kick out and just waltz past him. No arms up, no token chase. Nothing. Just stood there.

No standards. As it's been for a long time.

I think the "saints were s**t too" comments are disingenuous. When it mattered they spread to a degree of having multiple options on each play, they cracked in harder, played keepings off with our terracotta army and nailed all their shots when the heat was on.

Superb post

 

[Bigeasy]

We have pieces but no cohesion.

Its like we're a car, sometimes we have no petrol, so will fill up only to find out that in the process all the tires went flat. We sort out the tires and someone steals the steering wheel.

Yep there is always something

 

[goalieboy82]

we should have made the Saints cry last night.

 

[ferball]

My nephew (supercoach generation) trots in this morning and tells me how good was Goldy last night, he scored 128 pts, i said so he should have against an absolute s**t truck in Longer, what did he get 70+ hitouts ? check the stat's and 2 kicks, 0 tackles, and 33 hitouts, HTF does that work ?

I know WTF?

Do they value a successful hit out to a roving player the way they value a clean disposal?

 

[ferball]

Unfortunately the more pessimistic hunches of the last couple of years are being validated.

It's unpopular as it goes against the party line but on his career trajectory Waite should never have been retained. While immensely gifted, his intra-season form has always been incredibly erratic. He never seems to be in the sharpest condition but this year he looked AFL overweight, ie he's not of much role model value in teaching others how to live an AFL lifestyle in a 'resetting' side.

Conversely you have Boomer. Absolute icon in terms of how to prepare and despite the notion his absence opens up spots, all its done is load Higgins shoulders to breaking point. Boomer might've had his defensive deficiencies (who doesn't?) but on perceived form he'd be getting a game this year of all bar about 4-5 blokes and filling a much needed role. Might've kept a few members too..

Moving back to the current I can see how armchair fans are unmoved. I posted during summer that I was confused as to our direction and still am. It took until their confidence was eroded to dust omit Swallow and Thomas. Goldie (albeit slight form uplift last night) and Waite seemingly undroppable.

Then you have Daw. Everyone has their opinion on his potential. But after 8 seasons that's all we can still talk about - potential. Yes he was injured but in the season where he plays his best ever 'heart' game, he hasn't been seen again in senior company. Surely this is the season to give the mid 20s bloke who aced a final and signed a 3 year deal some assured continuity so we can FINALLY get a handle on his realised value as a footballer? Here we are in 2017 still asking the same questions!

Then there's the usual team traits. The inability to protect leads. The inability to overrun teams that race away on us. Short range disposal that doesn't hit a target and when it does it reaches a flatfooted target.

Which is the biggest issue. Lack of running effort. Ziebell did a 1-2 with I think Atley at halfback and offered no shepherd, didn't run a few metres to give a get out. Nothing. Just stood there. Waite stood and watched a saints player kick to himself on a kick out and just waltz past him. No arms up, no token chase. Nothing. Just stood there.

No standards. As it's been for a long time.

I think the "saints were s**t too" comments are disingenuous. When it mattered they spread to a degree of having multiple options on each play, they cracked in harder, played keepings off with our terracotta army and nailed all their shots when the heat was on.

Yep.

 

[GarnerSmash]

My nephew (supercoach generation) trots in this morning and tells me how good was Goldy last night, he scored 128 pts, i said so he should have against an absolute s**t truck in Longer, what did he get 70+ hitouts ? check the stat's and 2 kicks, 0 tackles, and 33 hitouts, HTF does that work ?

Yeah well apparently he was good.


Split the hitouts pretty much, won a bunch of handballs in the contest and took 2 marks.

Goliath.

0 tackles and 8 pressure acts despite being in the contest for the vast majority of the evening.

From an AA standard ruck.