List Mgmt. 2017 GC Draft/Trade Thread/FA - National Draft Pick 19

[17er]

Southport is not an AFL club - they have no AFL License !
With respect - like the Melbourne media - its pretty obvious you know nothing about AFL football structures in Queensland .
No AFL player contracted to the Suns would accept being coached by Southport staff -they play for an AFL team - the Suns. No Academy player would accept being coached by Southport staff while they have a chance to be drafted to an AFL team (Suns).
I have no problem with Southport - only with your uneducated position..

I think there is only one ignorant person in this debate and that is you, Sunraysia. I do not think you are stupid, so that leaves ignorant or willfully ignorant.
Southport Sharks were instrumental in getting GC17 an AFL License and launched the Suns in 2010. They are Patron Partners, which is unique to the AFL. This information is pretty easy to come by, buddy, probably more so for me because I was living on the Gold Coast while it was happening, having been born there in 1976. I've got an encyclopedic knowledge of AFL history in Queensland and Victoria, so your pathetic repudiation is so far off the mark that you do actually look a bit stupid after all.

My contention that the Suns and Sharks are paying too much money to field 3 sides and maintain competitiveness in all 3 is a valid argument for any number of reasons. The main reason is that no other club in the AFL does it, either fielding their own reserves or entering an agreement with a State based club, whereas our unique partnership would mean we could avoid either of those outcomes given that the AFL isn't going to implement a reserves comp and that the rocky affiliations of interstate teams aren't a prospect in our case. Evans has just said that he is trying to recoup massive losses from previous seasons, so it will be interesting to see how he handles this expensive and, in my opinion, untenable situation.

 

[17er]

Is that right? My recollection is that the Bears players were farmed out across all QAFL teams. My club Windsor Zillmere had both Williams brothers and Frank Dunnell amongst others allocated to them. Choco was a regular down at O’Callaghan Park.

Yep, good memory there, mate. Ultimately, it didn't really work out for any number of reasons and Brisbane went with the Reserves formula. They've had a number of nicknames and a few trophies too - Bears Reserves (coached by Rodney Eade, '91 premiership), Lion Cubs, Suncoast Lions QAFL - 2001 premiership, Lions2 NEAFL - '12, '13, '17 premierships.

Considering the Lions2 success in the NEAFL, you'd reckon if the Suns lined up all their ducks and played their fringe AFL players in the NEAFL along with seasoned State players at the Sharks, while giving Academy players football opportunities at QAFL level playing with seasoned QAFL players, the team that would benefit most would be the Suns AFL Squad. With all three teams playing weekly footy, players could gain opportunities for promotion (depending on eligibility). Academy guys would have regular football and opportunities to be blooded in the NEAFL instead of draft in because of injury and made to play seniors before they are ready. Rookies would have an opportunity at Southport to play with some of the best State-based talent, eventually staking claims for AFL squad selection, again, not because of injury but because starting in the QAFL then pushing for selection in the NEAFL and playing against high quality opposition is a far better preparation for AFL football than the current set up where 12 injuries to the 47 AFL listed players means that more than half the NEAFL team has to be made up from raw 17-year-old Academy players.

 

[Mini GF]

Yep, good memory there, mate. Ultimately, it didn't really work out for any number of reasons and Brisbane went with the Reserves formula. They've had a number of nicknames and a few trophies too - Bears Reserves (coached by Rodney Eade, '91 premiership), Lion Cubs, Suncoast Lions QAFL - 2001 premiership, Lions2 NEAFL - '12, '13, '17 premierships.

Considering the Lions2 success in the NEAFL, you'd reckon if the Suns lined up all their ducks and played their fringe AFL players in the NEAFL along with seasoned State players at the Sharks, while giving Academy players football opportunities at QAFL level playing with seasoned QAFL players, the team that would benefit most would be the Suns AFL Squad. With all three teams playing weekly footy, players could gain opportunities for promotion (depending on eligibility). Academy guys would have regular football and opportunities to be blooded in the NEAFL instead of draft in because of injury and made to play seniors before they are ready. Rookies would have an opportunity at Southport to play with some of the best State-based talent, eventually staking claims for AFL squad selection, again, not because of injury but because starting in the QAFL then pushing for selection in the NEAFL and playing against high quality opposition is a far better preparation for AFL football than the current set up where 12 injuries to the 47 AFL listed players means that more than half the NEAFL team has to be made up from raw 17-year-old Academy players.

Yes Sir, I love this post.

 

[Brenton87]

I have no doubt you are right. The more I ask around the more i find that the actual GC residents are in the minority

I'm from Perth but couldn't be more passionate supporting the Suns. I visited GC when I was a teenager, I had a mate who lived in Paradise Point and fell in love with the place ever since

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[SunnerSS]

Oh come on!!! How did you interpret it that I think out of towners on here is a bad thing.
What I’m saying is it concerns me there are just a handful of us GC residents that are on here, the pick up locally is dismal.
Although Suns of Anarchy made a great point last night when he said that if he lived here he wouldn’t have time to be on here.

Sorry I didn't mean it to be a crack at you mate.
I was just highlighting the support we've got from other parts of the country. Which quite frankly surprise me. The up take is probably greater then you think as the promoting from the club has been targeted towards families and youth. I suspect this platform of a website forum is for an ageing demographic. These days I'm sure you could find several Facebook groups or the like that would attract the younger generation.

 

[SunnerSS]

Yep, good memory there, mate. Ultimately, it didn't really work out for any number of reasons and Brisbane went with the Reserves formula. They've had a number of nicknames and a few trophies too - Bears Reserves (coached by Rodney Eade, '91 premiership), Lion Cubs, Suncoast Lions QAFL - 2001 premiership, Lions2 NEAFL - '12, '13, '17 premierships.

Considering the Lions2 success in the NEAFL, you'd reckon if the Suns lined up all their ducks and played their fringe AFL players in the NEAFL along with seasoned State players at the Sharks, while giving Academy players football opportunities at QAFL level playing with seasoned QAFL players, the team that would benefit most would be the Suns AFL Squad. With all three teams playing weekly footy, players could gain opportunities for promotion (depending on eligibility). Academy guys would have regular football and opportunities to be blooded in the NEAFL instead of draft in because of injury and made to play seniors before they are ready. Rookies would have an opportunity at Southport to play with some of the best State-based talent, eventually staking claims for AFL squad selection, again, not because of injury but because starting in the QAFL then pushing for selection in the NEAFL and playing against high quality opposition is a far better preparation for AFL football than the current set up where 12 injuries to the 47 AFL listed players means that more than half the NEAFL team has to be made up from raw 17-year-old Academy players.

I don't really see what the deal is here.
I'm aware of sharks impact on securing the gc17 licence but aren't they really just a glorified sponsor now? Their marketing is everywhere on game day. They are the official away game hangout spot and every sun's member is given a sharks membership. Essentially that's a lot of potential for the sharks to get people into the club for meals, drinks or gaming. And then the sun's obviously need a reserves side they can dictate tactics and game time for its players hence a reserve side.
Southport are still their own identity as a football club and the evenness among the competition is surely a good thing with afl growing in SEQ now sides like palm Beach and broadbeach are competing at the top of the QAFL. While Labrador and Southport help represent us in NEAFL.
It almost seems like your saying with Southport having some poor seasons the Gold Coast can't handle so many successful clubs and we need to downsize the sun's to spread the talent.
But like I said I'm not really sure what your angle is.

 

[GcSunsfan]

I think there is only one ignorant person in this debate and that is you, Sunraysia. I do not think you are stupid, so that leaves ignorant or willfully ignorant.
Southport Sharks were instrumental in getting GC17 an AFL License and launched the Suns in 2010. They are Patron Partners, which is unique to the AFL. This information is pretty easy to come by, buddy, probably more so for me because I was living on the Gold Coast while it was happening, having been born there in 1976. I've got an encyclopedic knowledge of AFL history in Queensland and Victoria, so your pathetic repudiation is so far off the mark that you do actually look a bit stupid after all.

My contention that the Suns and Sharks are paying too much money to field 3 sides and maintain competitiveness in all 3 is a valid argument for any number of reasons. The main reason is that no other club in the AFL does it, either fielding their own reserves or entering an agreement with a State based club, whereas our unique partnership would mean we could avoid either of those outcomes given that the AFL isn't going to implement a reserves comp and that the rocky affiliations of interstate teams aren't a prospect in our case. Evans has just said that he is trying to recoup massive losses from previous seasons, so it will be interesting to see how he handles this expensive and, in my opinion, untenable situation.

No need to get so personal mate.
Think 99% off people agree with what Sunraysia said

 

[Sunraysia]

I think there is only one ignorant person in this debate and that is you, Sunraysia. I do not think you are stupid, so that leaves ignorant or willfully ignorant.
Southport Sharks were instrumental in getting GC17 an AFL License and launched the Suns in 2010. They are Patron Partners, which is unique to the AFL. This information is pretty easy to come by, buddy, probably more so for me because I was living on the Gold Coast while it was happening, having been born there in 1976. I've got an encyclopedic knowledge of AFL history in Queensland and Victoria, so your pathetic repudiation is so far off the mark that you do actually look a bit stupid after all.

My contention that the Suns and Sharks are paying too much money to field 3 sides and maintain competitiveness in all 3 is a valid argument for any number of reasons. The main reason is that no other club in the AFL does it, either fielding their own reserves or entering an agreement with a State based club, whereas our unique partnership would mean we could avoid either of those outcomes given that the AFL isn't going to implement a reserves comp and that the rocky affiliations of interstate teams aren't a prospect in our case. Evans has just said that he is trying to recoup massive losses from previous seasons, so it will be interesting to see how he handles this expensive and, in my opinion, untenable situation.

Agree Southport assisted in the Suns obtaining its AFL licence but were not instrumental.
The Patron Partnership you refer to has been been acknowleged by me previously . Your understanding of it is incorrect - it is a commercial, sponsorship support agreement its not a football operations agreement.
As stated before the Suns are an AFL licensed club with a squad of 40+ contracted players. Like most other AFL clubs nowadays the lower list players should play together in a reserves side employing like workpractises as the senior team. (ie Suns Reserves) Also - Suns Reseves each week has 4 places reserved for Academy players which are taken up by players on a rotating basis - those deemed to to be able to step up to NEAFL. All the other Academy members play at QAFL level with their feeder clubs ( or allocated QAFL club for those from up North) No Academy members play at NEAFL level unless with the Suns .
I'm pretty sure Mark Evans will only be looking at the Suns commercial relations with Southport ( Patron Partership arrangements) No football operation relationship exist to discuss.
I think it is great that Gold Coast has 2 NEAFL teams. Several strong NEAFL teams are required outside of the 4 AFL clubs to comprise that league . Southport is one.
Finally , yes I'm ignorant ( my wife tells me all the time...)

 

[DoItForCaptBlood]

I don't really see what the deal is here.
I'm aware of sharks impact on securing the gc17 licence but aren't they really just a glorified sponsor now? Their marketing is everywhere on game day. They are the official away game hangout spot and every sun's member is given a sharks membership. Essentially that's a lot of potential for the sharks to get people into the club for meals, drinks or gaming. And then the sun's obviously need a reserves side they can dictate tactics and game time for its players hence a reserve side.
Southport are still their own identity as a football club and the evenness among the competition is surely a good thing with afl growing in SEQ now sides like palm Beach and broadbeach are competing at the top of the QAFL. While Labrador and Southport help represent us in NEAFL.
It almost seems like your saying with Southport having some poor seasons the Gold Coast can't handle so many successful clubs and we need to downsize the sun's to spread the talent.
But like I said I'm not really sure what your angle is.

After being here on the Coast for 10 years and being involved through juniors with my son, and know quite a few of the academy kids now coming through, I see arguments for both sides.
With all the injuries, Suns NEAFL have over the last few years played kids nowhere near ready for the level. But couple of years ago I know one kid played in multiple teams - basically rotated regularly between 3 teams (Suns|Sharks NEAFL and QAFL), which is not good either. Like VFL, I think Suns would be better with quality senior bodies in the ressies that play QAFL when not required. As 17er suggested, the academy kids play if they are ready (not the 16 year olds!).

I differ with 17er with Southport, they should drop back to QAFL, and senior bodies/academy kids are listed with a QAFL club and play Suns NEAFL when needed. They all train with the Suns to learn the game plan.

 

[17er]

Agree Southport assisted in the Suns obtaining its AFL licence but were not instrumental.
Finally , yes I'm ignorant ( my wife tells me all the time...)

So, you have nothing new to say. You're just continuing to argue because the more you words you type out the better you think your argument sounds. As I've said before, you aren't adding anything to the conversation by repeating yourself ad nauseum, you're just trying to kill the discussion by continually replying with the status quo.

As I also demonstrated in my reply about the Bears players in the 80s QAFL, the Brisbane Franchise has tried several different models with generally high success. They are killing us in NEAFL and I believe merging Suns2 with the Sharks NEAFL side is the way we can get the best value from the partnership.

 

[GcSunsfan]

 

[Sunraysia]

So, you have nothing new to say. You're just continuing to argue because the more you words you type out the better you think your argument sounds. As I've said before, you aren't adding anything to the conversation by repeating yourself ad nauseum, you're just trying to kill the discussion by continually replying with the status quo.

As I also demonstrated in my reply about the Bears players in the 80s QAFL, the Brisbane Franchise has tried several different models with generally high success. They are killing us in NEAFL and I believe merging Suns2 with the Sharks NEAFL side is the way we can get the best value from the partnership.

Maybe there is a reason for the status quo .......perhaps its the adopted framework going forward and issues you raise are fictitious.
Regards our reserves not beating Brisbane - I'm sure if we fielded 18 listed 4 Academy each week we would beat them - hasn't been possible in last couple of years due to injuries. Even with that Suns finished in finals last 2 years.

 

[GcSunsfan]

Maybe there is a reason for the status quo .......perhaps its the adopted framework going forward and issues you raise are fictitious.
Regards our reserves not beating Brisbane - I'm sure if we fielded 18 listed 4 Academy each week we would beat them - hasn't been possible in last couple of years due to injuries. Even with that Suns finished in finals last 2 years.

Yeah I don't know where 17er Gets his info from but our neafl record against Brisbane over the past two seasons has been ok with some very close game and some blow outs for both teams.

2016 Suns 2 wins 1 loss
2017 Suns 1 win 2 losses

 

[Sunraysia]

Yeah I don't know where 17er Gets his info from but our neafl record against Brisbane over the past two seasons has been ok with some very close game and some blow outs for both teams.
2016 Suns 2 wins 1 loss
2017 Suns 1 win 2 losses

Sure to be from his ..."encyclopedic knowledge of AFL history in Queensland and Victoria" ...

 

[Mini GF]

FFS you blokes it’s been a great discussion up till now.

 

[17er]

Maybe there is a reason for the status quo .......perhaps its the adopted framework going forward and issues you raise are fictitious.
Regards our reserves not beating Brisbane - I'm sure if we fielded 18 listed 4 Academy each week we would beat them - hasn't been possible in last couple of years due to injuries. Even with that Suns finished in finals last 2 years.

You're missing the point, again, and this time the ignorance is willful. I was not referring to Suns2 vs Lions2 head to head, I was referring to the 3 NEAFL premierships the Lions2 side have won.

As for your argument about injuries affecting the Suns2 side from fielding their best 22, it just further proves my argument that the Suns list is too exposed to have a Reserves team and that playing non-selected players for Southport would see a vast increase in the level of quality teams playing on any given week during the season. And actually, when the Suns2 side had its maximum number of AFL listed players they didn't gel too well against top NEAFL sides because of a lack of continuity.

 

[Sunraysia]

You're missing the point, again, and this time the ignorance is willful. I was not referring to Suns2 vs Lions2 head to head, I was referring to the 3 NEAFL premierships the Lions2 side have won.

As for your argument about injuries affecting the Suns2 side from fielding their best 22, it just further proves my argument that the Suns list is too exposed to have a Reserves team and that playing non-selected players for Southport would see a vast increase in the level of quality teams playing on any given week during the season. And actually, when the Suns2 side had its maximum number of AFL listed players they didn't gel too well against top NEAFL sides because of a lack of continuity.

OK OK I give up in best interests of sanity on this board....

 

[GcSunsfan]

For F*** sake give it a rest.
How many times do you want to state your opinion

 

[GcSunsfan]

OK OK I give up in best interests of sanity on this board....

It's like talking to a brick wall mate haha

 

[Stroppy]

So who are we going to take at pick 19?
You know, the kid who will probably play in our NEAFL team for a lot of next year.

Going to be some interesting players around at that spot.

Might take a flyer on a high risk high return type, knowing we picked up Weller this year and have another 4 picks inside 40 next year. We need some high impact players as well as solid players. Players like Ainsworth who can really do stuff when they get near the ball. We lost one of those with Saady leaving and need a few more who have a very high ceiling.

Someone like Balta maybe. Bonar would have been ideal but he got too good at the end of the year.

 

[Iva Bigun]

So who are we going to take at pick 19?
You know, the kid who will probably play in our NEAFL team for a lot of next year.

Going to be some interesting players around at that spot.

Might take a flyer on a high risk high return type, knowing we picked up Weller this year and have another 4 picks inside 40 next year. We need some high impact players as well as solid players. Players like Ainsworth who can really do stuff when they get near the ball. We lost one of those with Saady leaving and need a few more who have a very high ceiling.

Someone like Balta maybe. Bonar would have been ideal but he got too good at the end of the year.

It’s so far down the order and so many scenarios can happen that speculative thinking just doesn’t seem worth the efffort

 

[TheSunGod]

So who are we going to take at pick 19?
You know, the kid who will probably play in our NEAFL team for a lot of next year.

Going to be some interesting players around at that spot.

Might take a flyer on a high risk high return type, knowing we picked up Weller this year and have another 4 picks inside 40 next year. We need some high impact players as well as solid players. Players like Ainsworth who can really do stuff when they get near the ball. We lost one of those with Saady leaving and need a few more who have a very high ceiling.

Someone like Balta maybe. Bonar would have been ideal but he got too good at the end of the year.

Finally a post that relates to the thread

Take all the other stuff to the NEAFL thread. Agree stroppy. Was thinking the same thing the other day. Someone who is good at winning a one V one and can use the ball well. Was originally thinking a midfielder but we aren’t exactly rolling in KPPs either so a Balta would have to be a chance around there. Would love Bonar but those 2 recos are a concern. One more knee and we’ve wasted a Pick.
Very interested to see who we take with our second and third picks - mature bodies from the SANFL / WAFL? Clayton, the heat is on. And no skinny flankers.

 

[SunsBhoy]

Finally a post that relates to the thread

Take all the other stuff to the NEAFL thread. Agree stroppy. Was thinking the same thing the other day. Someone who is good at winning a one V one and can use the ball well. Was originally thinking a midfielder but we aren’t exactly rolling in KPPs either so a Balta would have to be a chance around there. Would love Bonar but those 2 recos are a concern. One more knee and we’ve wasted a Pick.
Very interested to see who we take with our second and third picks - mature bodies from the SANFL / WAFL? Clayton, the heat is on. And no skinny flankers.

Was thinking Clayton has a good record with players with pick 20s recently , fiorini , touk , Leslie has been a slow burn but coming good so I’m confident he will nail that one but after that I agree with you the later pick has to be a mature plus crossley , my dog would have a better record with late picks on young players than Clayton.


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[Ben Drever]

19 - zac bailey/ jack Higgins

40 - jack pertrucelle

50- Tom North

54 -Tom Aitkins/Liam Ryan

Throw in Crossley somewhere. As late as possible

Its like throwing a dart into the ocean and hoping it hits a fish

 

[Ben Drever]

Is big Cam Loersch still training with us?
Were obviously going to need a NEAFL based FF going forward