Autopsy 8 point loss to Port

[Jimbo OZ]

I’m normally reasonably positive.

But the fact remains: over the past 20 games, we’ve lost as many as we’ve won.

At the moment, we are not a top 4 side & in fact, top 8 is questionable.

We had a brilliant first half of 2024, off the back of Heeney, Gulden and Warner all excelling. But we’re nowhere near that now.

Every loss as the moment seems to be “coulda woulda shoulda”. But the losses are mounting.

Agree that we are nowhere near the first half of 2024. We may never be again. The stats showed we were performing so far above average that it we were in a league of our own. Our form and game plan fell off but we still made it to the big dance and no one could deny our credentials for doing so.

This year is a new chapter. Huge injury issues and a lot of players out of form. It shouldn’t mean we throw the baby out with the bathwater. I’m not saying that we are contenders but I’d say 90% or more of posts in this thread are dread and gloom. I thought it necessary to provide at least some balance. If we had won by 8 points but lost clearance, contested ball, and ground ball gets we’d be equally pessimistic.

 

[wolftone57]

We could not have orchestrated a loss like this. How many times can you lose a match? The second quarter 1.5, in the last 5.8. Thirteen scoring shots in a quarter will win you a close match every day of the week. We also kicked OOF three times and dropped 5 marks in the forward 50. But why did we lose? We lost because certain players, Chad, Blakey etc decided to be heroes and didn't hit up targets because they were too busy going for goal. Very disappointing how selfishness has crept into our game when the disposal efficiency has deserted us.

 

[wolftone57]

I think it is too much to expect Jordon to tag the opposition's best player every week. It's quickly become very predictable as well.

Tagging Rosie was always going to be difficult for him as Rosie is incredibly fast. He is not. Wrong option in my opinion. I think Campbell on Rosie was the go but he didn't do that.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

We could not have orchestrated a loss like this. How many times can you lose a match? The second quarter 1.5, in the last 5.8. Thirteen scoring shots in a quarter will win you a close match every day of the week. We also kicked OOF three times and dropped 5 marks in the forward 50. But why did we lose? We lost because certain players, Chad, Blakey etc decided to be heroes and didn't hit up targets because they were too busy going for goal. Very disappointing how selfishness has crept into our game when the disposal efficiency has deserted us.

Port and Brisbane game were massively self-inflicted losses.

 

[wolftone57]

Geez Roberts had 30 disposals? Talk about getting a lot of the ball but being ineffective.

30 at 30% DE makes 10 that counted.

 

[sr20]

How in the blue moon in Hamling going out and yet somehow Lloyd, Florent, Corey Warner keep their spot? How is that even remotely rewarding performances? Enough is enough, a big call or two has to be made if I see the out Hanily in someone we all can say Cox is just as soft as can be and isn't true to his words pre season.

Whose performance do you want to Reward? Hamling's?

At the end of the day, you have to maintain (or bring back) structure - Lloyd, Florent, Corey Warner don't play in the same position as Hamling. You don't have anyone who is even knocking on the door to take the place of Florent, Lloyd or Corey Warner, let alone banging it down. Sheldrick is the only way that is remotely close to it, and he accumulates the ball and turns it over.

If McCartin is moving down back, someone has to go, and it sure as hell isn't going to be Melican. You could argue that it's Rampe instead of Hamling to go out?

That's how in the blue moon it happens.

 

[wolftone57]

These are only stats but in prior years they were normally in the negative when we lost.

However, we did well in winning clearances and contested possessions. We even had less turnovers although I felt our turnovers led to goals.

View attachment 2289655

Where it all falls apart is the forward line. Out of the top 10 Swans goal kickers from last year only 5 played today (1 being Wicks is now a defender). So that left McLean, Hayward, Heeney and Warner. The first three each kicked two a piece (McLean missed a few). Warner with Gulden missing role has changed.

The impact of the injuries concentrated to ten forwards line has hurt.

No excuse for the poor disposals but probably highlights our forward 50 issues.

The reality is, we should have won the game. 10 more scoring shots and these stats say so. We couldn't hit the side of a barn though. Our disposal and pressure in the first half were missing. We then got too fancy and players started trying to be Errol Flynn in Robin Hood to try to steal the game off their own bloody boot (Flynn stole all the scenes he was in, even when he wasn't meant to)

 

[wolftone57]

Should start some new stats:

1. Biggest panicker
2. Biggest mark spoiler
3. 3 talls up and spills out the back
4. Missed tackles
5. Soft ball gets
6. Should have rushed the behind
7. Kick scrubber
8. Hospital handballer
9. Turnover merchant
10. Jogger

If McLean takes the ball out in front he doesn't get spoiled or drop the mark. He tries to chest mark it every time. This is definitely a very bad choice by him.

 

[mcs095]

We could not have orchestrated a loss like this. How many times can you lose a match? The second quarter 1.5, in the last 5.8. Thirteen scoring shots in a quarter will win you a close match every day of the week. We also kicked OOF three times and dropped 5 marks in the forward 50. But why did we lose? We lost because certain players, Chad, Blakey etc decided to be heroes and didn't hit up targets because they were too busy going for goal. Very disappointing how selfishness has crept into our game when the disposal efficiency has deserted us.

To be fair on Blakey - you'd back him to nail 2/3 of those shots in the second quarter every time. And with the way our forward line was 'functioning' at the time, it was more forgivable then the hero shots that both Warners had in the first half, which were very low percentage plays.

 

[wolftone57]

I’m normally reasonably positive.

But the fact remains: over the past 20 games, we’ve lost as many as we’ve won.

At the moment, we are not a top 4 side & in fact, top 8 is questionable.

We had a brilliant first half of 2024, off the back of Heeney, Gulden and Warner all excelling. But we’re nowhere near that now.

Every loss as the moment seems to be “coulda woulda shoulda”. But the losses are mounting.

We can't even kick for ****'s sake. Definitely not top eight. Hoe about Bottom 4. That is about it. We have a coach that won't admit when he is wrong, McCartin. We have a teams that is not using their skills. A Chad who is all but checked out. Lots of others who are resting on reputation. We have players who are playing for stats only. We have become a selfish, it's all aboutr ME team. We need to get these blokes to play for each other again. I'm not sure about Cox. His decision making at the selection table is baffling, and quite frankly, underwhelming. He needs to find and identity soon or we are going to flounder big time. He doesn't have a game plan different to Horse. That is a huge problem. He seemed to have a point of difference in the two matches we won and even in the ones we lost. We played well. But in the last two games we have played badly, coughed up the ball. Players seem lost as to what to do. They are not moving, are static. We just bomb down the line then, which is exactly what the opposition want us to do.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Whose performance do you want to Reward? Hamling's?

At the end of the day, you have to maintain (or bring back) structure - Lloyd, Florent, Corey Warner don't play in the same position as Hamling. You don't have anyone who is even knocking on the door to take the place of Florent, Lloyd or Corey Warner, let alone banging it down. Sheldrick is the only way that is remotely close to it, and he accumulates the ball and turns it over.

If McCartin is moving down back, someone has to go, and it sure as hell isn't going to be Melican. You could argue that it's Rampe instead of Hamling to go out?

That's how in the blue moon it happens.

McCartin was a million times worse than Hamling who was near or best defender the last 2-3. One average performance yes, that’s it. Rampe has had more poor outings this year

How about drop a player that has been coasting or in poor form all year start with Lloyd or Florent who have been beyond dreadful every game.

I’ve said for a while- Blakey to the wing for Corey. It gets the bloke out of defence and that in itself is a positive

 

[wolftone57]

Port and Brisbane game were massively self-inflicted losses.

But I think we played reasonably well compared to this weekend.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

But I think we played reasonably well compared to this weekend.

Definitely we seem to be regressing every week in terms of skills and efficiency

 

[wolftone57]

To be fair on Blakey - you'd back him to nail 2/3 of those shots in the second quarter every time. And with the way our forward line was 'functioning' at the time, it was more forgivable then the hero shots that both Warners had in the first half, which were very low percentage plays.

I think he over did it. Therev were leads. He ignored them all. The first one yes. Then in the last twice when he had alternatives. He had Francis leading and ignored him. I like to see him power away too but after missing a few it might have been better to lay it off to a player closer to goal. I know, the ball hit the post.

McCartin was a million times worse than Hamling who was near or best defender the last 2-3. One average performance yes, that’s it. Rampe has had more poor outings this year

How about drop a player that has been coasting or in poor form all year start with Lloyd or Florent who have been beyond dreadful every game.

I’ve said for a while- Blakey to the wing for Corey. It gets the bloke out of defence and that in itself is a positive

I want Blakey in the mids. Big, tall, strong. He will be our Bont.

 

[Adnico26Parker]

COACHES VOTES

10 Zak Butters

9

Zak Butters

Age

25

Ht

181cm

Wt

77kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.3

4star

K

7.7

3star

HB

6.7

4star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.6

4star

CL

0.8

3star

D

14.7

4star

K

8.9

4star

HB

5.9

3star

M

3.9

4star

T

2.9

4star

CL

1.1

3star

D

17.0

5star

K

9.0

4star

HB

8.0

5star

M

3.6

4star

T

1.6

4star

CL

0.6

3star

(PORT)
8 Connor Rozee

1

Connor Rozee

Age

25

Ht

185cm

Wt

79kg

Pos.

D/M

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.6

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

7.0

4star

M

3.3

3star

T

3.6

5star

MG

189.2

3star

D

12.8

3star

K

7.4

3star

HB

5.3

3star

M

2.9

3star

T

2.4

3star

MG

189.2

3star

D

16.4

4star

K

8.0

3star

HB

8.4

5star

M

4.2

4star

T

3.4

5star

(PORT)
6 Kane Farrell

6

Kane Farrell

Age

26

Ht

182cm

Wt

80kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.8

2star

K

6.4

3star

HB

3.4

3star

M

2.6

3star

T

2.1

4star

MG

259.5

4star

D

12.5

3star

K

7.8

3star

HB

4.8

3star

M

3.3

3star

T

2.5

3star

MG

259.5

4star

D

9.6

3star

K

7.0

3star

HB

2.6

3star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.0

4star

(PORT)
2 Brodie Grundy

4

Brodie Grundy

Age

31

Ht

202cm

Wt

105kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.5

4star

K

8.0

3star

HB

9.6

5star

CL

4.1

5star

HO

32.0

5star

D

16.4

4star

K

6.8

3star

HB

9.6

5star

CL

4.0

5star

HO

34.6

5star

D

13.8

4star

K

5.2

2star

HB

8.6

5star

CL

2.6

5star

HO

20.6

5star

(SYD)
2 Matthew Roberts (SYD)
1 Isaac Heeney

5

Isaac Heeney

Age

29

Ht

185cm

Wt

88kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.2

5star

K

10.4

4star

HB

7.7

5star

M

4.9

5star

T

4.1

5star

CL

2.2

4star

D

14.3

3star

K

8.8

4star

HB

5.5

3star

M

4.8

4star

T

2.5

3star

CL

0.8

3star

D

10.4

3star

K

7.2

3star

HB

3.2

3star

M

2.8

3star

T

2.4

4star

CL

0.8

3star

(SYD)
1 James Rowbottom

8

James Rowbottom

Age

25

Ht

186cm

Wt

82kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.0

4star

K

8.1

3star

HB

5.9

4star

M

2.2

2star

T

4.3

5star

CL

2.0

4star

D

14.6

4star

K

9.0

4star

HB

5.6

3star

M

1.5

2star

T

3.4

4star

CL

2.5

4star

D

14.4

4star

K

7.8

3star

HB

6.6

4star

M

3.0

3star

T

3.6

5star

CL

1.2

4star

(SYD)

 

[wolftone57]

They had a large part of the turf die .

So parasite or something.

Super unusual for the SCG.
Usually one of the best outfield in the world

They had the Andre Boceli concert there and had to relay the turf because it was dying out of the sun.

 

[sr20]

McCartin was a million times worse than Hamling who was near or best defender the last 2-3. One average performance yes, that’s it. Rampe has had more poor outings this year

How about drop a player that has been coasting or in poor form all year start with Lloyd or Florent who have been beyond dreadful every game.

I’ve said for a while- Blakey to the wing for Corey. It gets the bloke out of defence and that in itself is a positive

My opinion - I thought Hamling was good against North Melbourne (to be fair, who wasn't good against North) and then terrible against Collingwood, and was moved away from position on the weekend, so hard to grade.

My original post noted that in my opinion, Melican and McCartin as a defensive duo was one of our key pillars in a successful outfit last season. Let's stop the tinkering with what worked and get that back first. We haven't seen them together yet this season (aside from a quarter here or there).

Structure wise - you could keep Hamling, and move Blakey up the ground, and one of those three out of the side. Happy with that as it maintains the structure.

And believe me, if we had anything in the twos to replace some of these guys, I would be all for it, it's just that we don't at the moment. As someone said previously, our best players in the VFL have been non-listed players, so the pickings are slim.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

COACHES VOTES

10 Zak Butters (PORT)
8 Connor Rozee (PORT)
6 Kane Farrell (PORT)
2 Brodie Grundy (SYD)
2 Matthew Roberts (SYD)
1 Isaac Heeney (SYD)
1 James Rowbottom (SYD)

Did they just look at Roberts disposals

 

[Wheresbuddy]

Re Hamling, I thought he was pretty good. Had that one moment where he was caught out of position in a one on one with Lord, although the kick was well directed to Lord's advantage. Otherwise he was pretty solid in defence, competing well in the air. Once swung forward, again he competed well and didn't allow his opponent to play loose and take intercepts.

This was in direct contrast with McCartin who had a stinker. He was constantly caught behind Ratugolea when in attack then in defence, gave away a free that lead to a goal. Also hacked a kick out of defence to no one which lead to a goal. If Cox was rewarding form at the selection table and is opting to drop a tall, Tom has to go.

 

[davidyoung]

Heaps of negativity here. Most of it fair. Some usual posters who are never positive. Bad kicking is bad football so I’ll agree with everything being said about our skills. On the other hand, not much being said about our dominance in contested possessions, ground ball gets, clearances. xScore we should’ve won comfortably. Some of our best kicks had bad days. Blakey, Bice, Campbell all missing many gettable goals that I’d back them in to kick in the future. If we can continue to keep winning contested ball, clearance, and groundballs our skills will turn around and we will be okay.

So this is where our scoring will come from ? Heeney ? Warner ? Because sure as shit it won't be coming from the current forward set up regardless of contested footy, clearance or ground ball dominance. All accept for the Pies game we should have won and pissed it up against the wall when having a chance to win it. Also all games where we were particularly poor in areas of the game for long periods. This says we are certainly capable but dying at our own hand as well.

 

[wolftone57]

It was the peak of the list injury free and everything clicked our median form was something towards the latter stages of the season with Heeney/Warner utterly carrying wins against Collingwood and GWS.

I think we should stop blaming injury. There is nothing wrong with the players we have on the park this year. I think the ones who have come in have done well. It is the ones who were there that have not.

 

[Jimbo OZ]

So this is where our scoring will come from ? Heeney ? Warner ? Because sure as shit it won't be coming from the current forward set up regardless of contested footy, clearance or ground ball dominance. All accept for the Pies game we should have won and pissed it up against the wall when having a chance to win it. Also all games where we were particularly poor in areas of the game for long periods. This says we are certainly capable but dying at our own hand as well.

We had 27 scoring shots in this game. That would normally be enough.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

My opinion - I thought Hamling was good against North Melbourne (to be fair, who wasn't good against North) and then terrible against Collingwood, and was moved away from position on the weekend, so hard to grade.

My original post noted that in my opinion, Melican and McCartin as a defensive duo was one of our key pillars in a successful outfit last season. Let's stop the tinkering with what worked and get that back first. We haven't seen them together yet this season (aside from a quarter here or there).

Structure wise - you could keep Hamling, and move Blakey up the ground, and one of those three out of the side. Happy with that as it maintains the structure.

And believe me, if we had anything in the twos to replace some of these guys, I would be all for it, it's just that we don't at the moment. As someone said previously, our best players in the VFL have been non-listed players, so the pickings are slim.

It hasn’t been successful since the mid break last season this thing that it was so successful is weird. No way should Hamling be dropped ahead of every defender bar Melican. The whole lot have been poor. How about we not play a winger that’s good for 10-12 possessions every week…just an idea. How Corey kept his spot this week was farcical let alone his usual performance this week, enough. Blakey to the wing.

 

[LukeParkerno1]

Did they just look at Roberts disposals

Surprised Blakey didn’t get one on that regard

Roberts lol

 

[wolftone57]

Re Hamling, I thought he was pretty good. Had that one moment where he was caught out of position in a one on one with Lord, although the kick was well directed to Lord's advantage. Otherwise he was pretty solid in defence, competing well in the air. Once swung forward, again he competed well and didn't allow his opponent to play loose and take intercepts.

This was in direct contrast with McCartin who had a stinker. He was constantly caught behind Ratugolea when in attack then in defence, gave away a free that lead to a goal. Also hacked a kick out of defence to no one which lead to a goal. If Cox was rewarding form at the selection table and is opting to drop a tall, Tom has to go.

McCartin playing so badly is all on Cox. It was Cox's decision to send him forward. It has been an abject failure. Why? Because McCartin plays back shoulder. You can't play back shoulder as a forward. You have to play in front or run back to goal. He has no forward craft. Put him back where he belongs. So, he let one get through. He is probably thoroughly confused at this time.

Cox gets things wrong but won't admit it. This is not a good sign. I think the players know he had it wrong too. That does not inspire confidence in the players.