Analysis If Dustin Martin wins a 4th Norm Smith medal and premiership will he be regarded as the greatest player of all time?

If Dustin Martin wins a 4th Norm Smith medal and premiership will he be regarded as the greatest pla


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blaisee

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 11, 2004
8,062
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I won't speak for the Geelong Supporters, but as I've stated before, he's been an awesome player.

One of the best players of his generation, top 10 since the turn of the century and around top 50 in the history of the game.

Fantastic player with an outstanding career.

thanks man, that means alot:thumbsu:
 

Aristotle Pickett

Premium Platinum
Oct 19, 2020
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Comfortably behind Ablett Jr, Franklin, Judd and Goodes, behind Fyfe, Buckley and Voss, competing with the likes of Dangerfield, Pendlebury, Cousins, Pavlich, N Reiwoldt and many more for a spot in the top 10. May have forgotten some names.
He's not comfortably behind those players. None of them dominated an entire season and won every award like in 2017. Judd never did that. No one has dominated finals like him ever bar Barassi , so he's in the group with Franklin and Ablett jnr and can easily surpass them and others by the end of his career.
 

Fadge

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 4, 2007
11,552
10,278
Melbourne
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Collingwood
He's not comfortably behind those players. None of them dominated an entire season and won every award like in 2017. Judd never did that. No one has dominated finals like him ever bar Barassi , so he's in the group with Franklin and Ablett jnr and can easily surpass them and others by the end of his career.
'An entire season'.

He's been rated in the top handful of players in the competition for 4 years and you're comparing him to players like Ablett, Franklin and Judd who have been regarded as the top 2 to 3 players in the competition consistently over a decade?!?

And what about the finals he didn't dominate? Oh that's right, he was either young, injured or they didn't count because they weren't required to win to eventuate in a premiership.

Wowee.
 
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Noidnadroj

Premiership Player
Dec 8, 2020
3,028
10,900
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It's not only insulting to compare such players, it's blasphemy and the poll voting says it all. I'm pretty confident in saying Martin's not winning another norm smith medal as Richmond are no longer the champion team they once were.

And just put this into perspective for those who are doing their best to downplay Ablett as a great finals performer, take away his epic 1989 final series and the bloke was still good for 3.1 goals per game.

Take away Martin's best final series (2019) and he was only good for 1 goal per final.

2019 was Martin’s ‘worst finals series’ of the 3. Hahaha… but thanks for thinking it was his best - shows how brilliant 2017 and 2020 were.



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Noidnadroj

Premiership Player
Dec 8, 2020
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Let's see how Martin goes when he's 33/34 ... As a forward in a side that was smashed.

How on earth is Ablett’s age relevant? He played his best and most consistent footy in 1993/94/95 - so why does he all of a sudden get some form of ‘age based compensation’ ?? Makes zero sense to use this as some form of excuse for non-existent GF shows in 94 and 95.


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Jack The Godfather

07, 09, 11, 22
Feb 16, 2007
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How on earth is Ablett’s age relevant?


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I'm not sure why I need to explain that to you, it's fairly easy to understand.

He played his best and most consistent footy in 1993/94/95 - so why does he all of a sudden get some form of ‘age based compensation’ ?? Makes zero sense to use this as some form of excuse for non-existent GF shows in 94 and 95.
No he never.
 

JackOutback

Brownlow Medallist
Sep 15, 2011
27,929
40,699
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He's not comfortably behind those players. None of them dominated an entire season and won every award like in 2017. Judd never did that. No one has dominated finals like him ever bar Barassi , so he's in the group with Franklin and Ablett jnr and can easily surpass them and others by the end of his career.
Correct, they dominated for a decade or more. That's why they are greater.
 

catscollector

Norm Smith Medallist
Jun 30, 2018
6,353
8,121
AFL Club
Geelong
2019 was Martin’s ‘worst finals series’ of the 3. Hahaha… but thanks for thinking it was his best - shows how brilliant 2017 and 2020 were.



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Was Martin ever the focal point in any of those games?
He is an opportunist. 1 mark in two of the grand finals is exactly what he's all about. He's a brilliant opportunist in the same vein as Darren Jarman and Jason Akermanis.

Opposition teams know full well you beat Richmond by stopping their tall timber. In 2017, it was Alex Rance who proved this by completely annihilating Adelaide's key forwards.
I don't even know why I am having this discussion with you anymore. You are deluded.

Martin isn't fit to tie Carey, Matthews or Ablett's bootlaces. He's beneath such players and wouldn't even be the equal of Buddy Franklin.
 

Noidnadroj

Premiership Player
Dec 8, 2020
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You won't have many rating him higher than Judd, but those who don't factor in the importance of leadership would likely have him on the next rung immediately under those 3.

I’m intrigued with your ‘leadership’ scale. Judd loves the ‘cash’ …. everyone knows that. He loved the rivers of gold promised him from Pratt, that’s why he chose Carlton … everyone knows that. He led Carlton to precisely zero flags, and never even a top-4 finish.

You just seem to rate media skills or something weird, I’m just not sure. But at least you’re consistent rating zero flags Pendles and zero top-4 finish Judd (at Carlton) with some weird leadership rating that puts them above triple finals MVP, triple NS and triple flag Martin … who turned down millions to stay at Richmond.

Must be the tatts ….


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Fadge

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 4, 2007
11,552
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I’m intrigued with your ‘leadership’ scale. Judd loves the ‘cash’ …. everyone knows that. He loved the rivers of gold promised him from Pratt, that’s why he chose Carlton … everyone knows that. He led Carlton to precisely zero flags, and never even a top-4 finish.

You just seem to rate media skills or something weird, I’m just not sure. But at least you’re consistent rating zero flags Pendles and zero top-4 finish Judd (at Carlton) with some weird leadership rating that puts them above triple finals MVP, triple NS and triple flag Martin … who turned down millions to stay at Richmond.

Must be the tatts ….
Nah, Judd was far better for far longer than Martin. His leadership traits not even considered to have him comfortably ahead of Martin.

Pendlebury's very best not quite at the level of Martin, but he's also been doing what he does for longer and to be considered worthy of captaining your club for circ 200 games gives him the edge over Martin.

Whilst my rating of Judd would be consistent with 99.9% of non-Richmond supporters, my view on Pendlebury is personal opinion which I expect would be in the minority, but each to their own.
 

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Aristotle Pickett

Premium Platinum
Oct 19, 2020
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Nah, Judd was far better for far longer than Martin. His leadership traits not even considered to have him comfortably ahead of Martin.

Pendlebury's very best not quite at the level of Martin, but he's also been doing what he does for longer and to be considered worthy of captaining your club for circ 200 games gives him the edge over Martin.

Whilst my rating of Judd would be consistent with 99.9% of non-Richmond supporters, my view on Pendlebury is personal opinion which I expect would be in the minority, but each to their own.
Can you please start a Judd vs Martin thread.
 

Fadge

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 4, 2007
11,552
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Can you please start a Judd vs Martin thread.
Wouldn't waste my time.

I can tell you what the poll results would be - identical to this one.

Richmond supporters flooding thread and creating burner accounts to overstate the pro-Martin numbers;

99.5% of non-Richmond supporters voting for Judd.
 
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Noidnadroj

Premiership Player
Dec 8, 2020
3,028
10,900
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'An entire season'.

He's been rated in the top handful of players in the competition for 4 years and you're comparing him to players like Ablett, Franklin and Judd who have been regarded as the top 2 to 3 players in the competition consistently over a decade?!?

And what about the finals he didn't dominate? Oh that's right, he was either young, injured or they didn't count because they weren't required to win to eventuate in a premiership.

Wowee.

When being adjudged BOG in 9 x finals over 4-years, winning 3 x finals MVP’s and 3 x Norm Smiths isn’t enough on your finals resume, you know someone is impossible to please and being deliberately mischievous. Kudos to you Fadge. But in fairness, you’re probably not that familiar with what finals dominance looks like.


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Fadge

Brownlow Medallist
Mar 4, 2007
11,552
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When being adjudged BOG in 9 x finals over 4-years, winning 3 x finals MVP’s and 3 x Norm Smiths isn’t enough on your finals resume, you know someone is impossible to please and being deliberately mischievous. Kudos to you Fadge. But in fairness, you’re probably not that familiar with what finals dominance looks like.
Which 9 finals was he BOG in?

I'll give 7, which is about the same number he's been a non-factor in.
 

VinnieB

Premiership Player
Oct 28, 2021
3,417
4,510
AFL Club
Collingwood
Was Martin ever the focal point in any of those games?
He is an opportunist. 1 mark in two of the grand finals is exactly what he's all about. He's a brilliant opportunist in the same vein as Darren Jarman and Jason Akermanis.

Opposition teams know full well you beat Richmond by stopping their tall timber. In 2017, it was Alex Rance who proved this by completely annihilating Adelaide's key forwards.
I don't even know why I am having this discussion with you anymore. You are deluded.

Martin isn't fit to tie Carey, Matthews or Ablett's bootlaces. He's beneath such players and wouldn't even be the equal of Buddy Franklin.
Jason Akermanis probably one of the most underrated stars of the game. He may have had a big mouth, but he delivered.
 

Trav 20

Brownlow Medallist
Oct 5, 2004
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You just seem to rate media skills or something weird, I’m just not sure. But at least you’re consistent rating zero flags Pendles and zero top-4 finish Judd (at Carlton) with some weird leadership rating that puts them above triple finals MVP, triple NS and triple flag Martin … who turned down millions to stay at Richmond.


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What sort of football follower doesn't think Pendlebury is a premiership player ?

It explains a lot.
 

Cdog71

Premiership Player
Sep 21, 2017
4,300
10,022
AFL Club
Richmond
Yet if you were doing a list of your top 5 players in the comp going into 2015, 2016 and likely 2017, he would be included. Comfortably.
He didn’t win the BnF 15,16 played 14 games in 17 and he won because they were rubbish.