If the VFL/AFL greatest team of all time, was selected today, who is in, and who is out of the team of the century

[blaisee]

VFL/AFL Team of the Century

B:	Bernie Smith (Geelong, West Adelaide)	Stephen Silvagni (Carlton)	John Nicholls (Carlton)
HB:	Bruce Doull (Carlton)	Ted Whitten (Footscray) Captain	Kevin Murray (Fitzroy, East Perth)
C:	Francis Bourke (Richmond)	Ian Stewart (Hobart, St Kilda, Richmond)	Keith Greig (North Melbourne)
HF:	Alex Jesaulenko (Carlton, St Kilda)	Royce Hart (Richmond)	Dick Reynolds (Essendon)
F:	Leigh Matthews (Hawthorn)	John Coleman (Essendon)	Haydn Bunton Sr. (Fitzroy, Subiaco, Port Adelaide)
Foll:	Graham Farmer (Geelong, East Perth, West Perth)	Ron Barassi (Melbourne, Carlton)	Bob Skilton (South Melbourne)
Int:	Gary Ablett Sr. (Hawthorn, Geelong)	Jack Dyer (Richmond)	Greg Williams (Geelong, Sydney, Carlton)
Coach:	Norm Smith (Melbourne, Fitzroy, South Melbourne)

This was the team selected in 1996

What changes would you make to this team, to include players in and up to 2023?

For me, the only change is Jesaulenko is out, Dustin Martin is in

3 norm smiths, 1 brownlow, 3 Gary Ayres Medals, AFLCA, AFLPA, 4 AA jumpers, arguably the goat

The other ones to be considered are Buddy, and GAJ

That's it from the modern era

 

[Kreuuuzeurns]

You find a spot for Buddy and Ablett Jnr before you even consider Martin.

 

[Tiger2709]

So would it be for this century or just greatest team ever?

Buddy will not make the greatest team ever as good as he is, unless they do an AA and have him playing full back or something ridiculous, before Buddy gets in you need to fit in Lockett.

 

[Fadge]

You find a spot for Buddy and Ablett Jnr before you even consider Martin.

Carey and Plugger too.

They should also correct their historical error and include Gordon Coventry.

 

[Fadge]

Falcon, I mean STRONGandBALD - interested to hear your inclusions and omissions?

 

[Toump Ass]

Ablett Snr out on character grounds. Maybe his son can take his place.
Farmer out for Max Gawn

11

Max Gawn

Age

32

Ht

209cm

Wt

110kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.1

4star

K

7.4

3star

HB

6.7

4star

CL

2.8

4star

HO

35.3

5star

D

18.5

4star

K

11.5

4star

HB

7.0

4star

CL

3.5

4star

HO

29.2

5star

D

8.4

3star

K

3.6

2star

HB

4.8

4star

CL

1.0

3star

HO

15.6

5star

.

 

[Tiger2709]

Ablett Snr out on character grounds. Maybe his son can take his place.
Farmer out for Max Gawn.

Not sure about Gawn for Farmer, its tough to look back and recall how good some of the old payers were, agree on jnr for snr.

 

[Guardian Hawk]

Falcon, I mean STRONGandBALD - interested to hear your inclusions and omissions?

Why would you do that?

Are you a masochist?

 

[Guardian Hawk]

VFL/AFL Team of the Century

B:	Bernie Smith (Geelong, West Adelaide)	Stephen Silvagni (Carlton)	John Nicholls (Carlton)
HB:	Bruce Doull (Carlton)	Ted Whitten (Footscray) Captain	Kevin Murray (Fitzroy, East Perth)
C:	Francis Bourke (Richmond)	Ian Stewart (Hobart, St Kilda, Richmond)	Keith Greig (North Melbourne)
HF:	Alex Jesaulenko (Carlton, St Kilda)	Royce Hart (Richmond)	Dick Reynolds (Essendon)
F:	Leigh Matthews (Hawthorn)	John Coleman (Essendon)	Haydn Bunton Sr. (Fitzroy, Subiaco, Port Adelaide)
Foll:	Graham Farmer (Geelong, East Perth, West Perth)	Ron Barassi (Melbourne, Carlton)	Bob Skilton (South Melbourne)
Int:	Gary Ablett Sr. (Hawthorn, Geelong)	Jack Dyer (Richmond)	Greg Williams (Geelong, Sydney, Carlton)
Coach:	Norm Smith (Melbourne, Fitzroy, South Melbourne)

This was the team selected in 1996

What changes would you make to this team, to include players in and up to 2023?

For me, the only change is Jesaulenko is out, Dustin Martin is in

3 norm smiths, 1 brownlow, 3 Gary Ayres Medals, AFLCA, AFLPA, 4 AA jumpers, arguably the goat

The other ones to be considered are Buddy, and GAJ

That's it from the modern era

Wayne Carey in, Royce Hart out would be my first change (remembering Carey was only mid career when this was first selected).

Perhaps Gary Ablett Jnr into the vacant 4th interchange position.

 

[blaisee]

If you want to put someone in, you have to take someone out

Gawn for farmer is a no for me

Farmer re-invented the game and is an all time great

 

[blaisee]

So would it be for this century or just greatest team ever?

Buddy will not make the greatest team ever as good as he is, unless they do an AA and have him playing full back or something ridiculous, before Buddy gets in you need to fit in Lockett.

All Time

I am working on the assumption that the work was done properly for all players prior to 96

So from this team in 96, what players with their careers since 96, would make the all time team

If you add someone in, you need to take someone out

 

[DapperDon]

Gary Jnr for Bourke
Carey for Hart
Judd for Dyer

 

[blaisee]

Wayne Carey in, Royce Hart out would be my first change (remembering Carey was only mid career when this was first selected).

Perhaps Gary Ablett Jnr into the vacant 4th interchange position.

Carey is someone to consider for sure, but Hart has 4 flags vs 2, and the there is the matter of Carey tearing apart the fabric of the club, which can't be ignored obviously

 

[blaisee]

Gary Jnr for Bourke
Carey for Hart
Judd for Dyer

triggered

 

[DapperDon]

triggered

snowflake

 

[Roby]

acotch8n

VFL/AFL Team of the Century

B:	Bernie Smith (Geelong, West Adelaide)	Stephen Silvagni (Carlton)	John Nicholls (Carlton)
HB:	Bruce Doull (Carlton)	Ted Whitten (Footscray) Captain	Kevin Murray (Fitzroy, East Perth)
C:	Francis Bourke (Richmond)	Ian Stewart (Hobart, St Kilda, Richmond)	Keith Greig (North Melbourne)
HF:	Alex Jesaulenko (Carlton, St Kilda)	Royce Hart (Richmond)	Dick Reynolds (Essendon)
F:	Leigh Matthews (Hawthorn)	John Coleman (Essendon)	Haydn Bunton Sr. (Fitzroy, Subiaco, Port Adelaide)
Foll:	Graham Farmer (Geelong, East Perth, West Perth)	Ron Barassi (Melbourne, Carlton)	Bob Skilton (South Melbourne)
Int:	Gary Ablett Sr. (Hawthorn, Geelong)	Jack Dyer (Richmond)	Greg Williams (Geelong, Sydney, Carlton)
Coach:	Norm Smith (Melbourne, Fitzroy, South Melbourne)

This was the team selected in 1996

What changes would you make to this team, to include players in and up to 2023?

For me, the only change is Jesaulenko is out, Dustin Martin is in

3 norm smiths, 1 brownlow, 3 Gary Ayres Medals, AFLCA, AFLPA, 4 AA jumpers, arguably the goat

The other ones to be considered are Buddy, and GAJ

That's it from the modern era

What about Luke Hodge before Martin?

The guy led his team to 4 premierships. Could you imagine if Cotchin had won ANOTHER flag in 2021 and two Norm Smith's what you'd be saying? Which could also mean Dusty had only one Norm Smith.


As for people putting Franklin up there, Buddy wasn't even in the top two best players at Hawthorn. Hodge and Rioli were ahead of him. You could also make arguments that Mitchell and Roughy might be too, but personally I had Buddy as third best.

 

[blaisee]

acotch8n

What about Luke Hodge before Martin?

The guy led his team to 4 premierships. Could you imagine if Cotchin had won ANOTHER flag in 2021 and two Norm Smith's what you'd be saying? Which could also mean Dusty had only one Norm Smith.


As for people putting Franklin up there, Buddy wasn't even in the top two best players at Hawthorn. Hodge and Rioli were ahead of him. You could also make arguments that Mitchell and Roughy might be too, but personally I had Buddy as third best.

have the ultimate respect for Hodge

what is working against him is the fact that he was neither a midfielder, or a forward .

So if he comes in, it is for a defender

 

[Roby]

have the ultimate respect for Hodge

what is working against him is the fact that he was neither a midfielder, or a forward .

So if he comes in, it is for a defender

He can play ANY position. That's what makes him a four time premiership player. If he was limited player like Judd or Ablett he'd have less premierships.

If Hawthorn had Judd or Ablett instead of Hodge there's NO DOUBT they wouldn't have won 4 premierships. Certainly less, maybe even none.

 

[Guardian Hawk]

If I could pick a team to play the original...(VFL/AFL only)..it might look something like:

FB: G. Wanganeen, M. Scarlett, J. Reagen
HB: A. McLeod, P. Roos, L. Hodge
C: R. Flower, M. Voss, P. Matera
HF: D. Martin, W. Carey, L. Franklin
F: P. Daicos, T. Lockett, P. Hudson
R: D. Cox, C. Judd, G. Ablett Jnr
I: K. Bartlett, J. Hird, A. Goodes, M. Pavlich

Modern bias but think this team would fair alright. Personally prefer Dunstall to Lockett but recognise Lockett is the popular choice.

Had about 1000 different names for the bench but removed my favourites and went with versatility.

 

[Fadge]

If I could pick a team to play the original...(VFL/AFL only)..it might look something like:

FB: G. Wanganeen, M. Scarlett, J. Reagen
HB: A. McLeod, P. Roos, L. Hodge
C: R. Flower, M. Voss, P. Matera
HF: D. Martin, W. Carey, L. Franklin
F: P. Daicos, T. Lockett, P. Hudson
R: D. Cox, C. Judd, G. Ablett Jnr
I: K. Bartlett, J. Hird, A. Goodes, M. Pavlich

Modern bias but think this team would fair alright. Personally prefer Dunstall to Lockett but recognise Lockett is the popular choice.

Had about 1000 different names for the bench but removed my favourites and went with versatility.

Great team, though D. Martin surely borderline at best?

 

[Guardian Hawk]

Carey is someone to consider for sure, but Hart has 4 flags vs 2, and the there is the matter of Carey tearing apart the fabric of the club, which can't be ignored obviously

I personally think there are other better ways to differentiate players than "flags won", otherwise the likes of Skilton would get nowhere near these sides.

I chose to include Carey for his on field performances only which in my view, surpasses that of even the great Royce Hart.

I can make my argument but I don't wish to denigrate a champion in Hart and I think most footy pundits have Carey amongst the top 5 players of al time whilst Hart, as good as he was, is not quite in that echelon.

On 'character'? Definately Hart.

 

[Guardian Hawk]

Great team, though D. Martin surely borderline at best?

Thank you.

To be honest, there's been so many greats that all but a couple of spots are 'borderline' given the quality of alternatives available.

I had Bartlett there originally, considered Hird and ended up with Martin (shoehorning the aforementioned 2 onto the bench). That's not even mentioning Akermanis, Jarman and a handful of others.

I too find the posting of Martin by Richmond supporters nauseating at times but if I take a step back and evaluate his whole career pragmatically, he deserves to be "in the conversation". For a one off game against the best of the best, I think he could be particularly suited. With that said, I still rate Bartlett as the greater of the two Richmond champs.

 

[Fadge]

Thank you.

To be honest, there's been so many greats that all but a couple of spots are 'borderline' given the quality of alternatives available.

I had Bartlett there originally, considered Hird and ended up with Martin (shoehorning the aforementioned 2 onto the bench). That's not even mentioning Akermanis, Jarman and a handful of others.

I too find the posting of Martin by Richmond supporters nauseating at times but if I take a step back and evaluate his whole career pragmatically, he deserves to be "in the conversation". For a one off game against the best of the best, I think he could be particularly suited. With that said, I still rate Bartlett as the greater of the two Richmond champs.

I reckon a third team with the likes of Dunstall, Pendlebury, Selwood, R. Harvey, N. Riewoldt, G. Jakovich, Rance, etc. wouldn't be too far behind this one either.

 

[Power Raid]

If you want to put someone in, you have to take someone out

Gawn for farmer is a no for me

Farmer re-invented the game and is an all time great

I was talking to an "old timer" recently who played 4 games for the pies before moving to Perth and playing with Farmer in 56 (if I recall correctly). He's obviously seen some great players over the years in the VFL and WAFL either as a player or a supporter.

I questioned him on Farmer, as although highly regarded by many, as to his lack of height. His response was simple, "he was the greatest player he'd ever seen"....."better than lethal"......."and what he lacked in height, he made up with leap, knew where the ball was going, had wonderful body work and his hand ball was like no other".

I then rattled off names from the WAFL like rioli, stephen michael etc, then AFL greats like Ablett Snr, jnr, carey; and he remained firm the Farmer was the best he'd seen.


I wish I'd seen farmer play in his prime, as those lucky enough to see him play celebrate his abilities

 

[Guardian Hawk]

I reckon a third team with the likes of Dunstall, Pendlebury, Selwood, R. Harvey, N. Riewoldt, G. Jakovich, Rance, etc. wouldn't be too far behind this one either.

Yes, agreed.

Something like this would still hold their own...

G. Southby, A. Rance, C. Enright
B. Hutchison, P. Knights, N. Buckley
C. Bradley, S. Mitchell, B. Cousins
D. Jarman, N. Riewoldt, J. Akermanis
G. Coventry, J. Dunstall, E. Betts
S. Madden, R. Harvey, S. Pendlebury
M. Ricciuto, J. Selwood, S. Black, G. Dempsey

and that's with some biases and off the top of my head, recognising there were many champions before my time that don't immediately spring to mind.

Very tough to do.