Universal Love Pick #2 - Welcome Andrew Brayshaw - 2022 AFLPA MVP

[Joao]

You boys clearly get too carried away with stats, have a look at those highlights from Brayshaw and then compare them to these.

Clark went at 82% and was huge in the last qtr to get us over the line.

I watched that highlights package:

Hands in the back or at best an uncontested mark because the other Saints and Sun spuds read the flight wrong
Kick under zero pressure that makes Carlisle bust his chops just to make it
Involved in a 2v1 Saints way and the Saints win - wow
Slid to ground and had the ****iest tackle ever applied then a regulation hand ball
Arguably trips a bloke (or at best he falls over on his own) and gets an uncontested ground ball

I find it hard to believe that both Brayshaw and Battle didn't contribute more to their team.

Doesn't matter how you spin it, Clark won the participation award version of the rising star.

 

[muzzington]

Brayshaw wins the hair battle which is what really counts.

 

[_007_]

I watched that highlights package:

Hands in the back or at best an uncontested mark because the other Saints and Sun spuds read the flight wrong
Kick under zero pressure that makes Carlisle bust his chops just to make it
Involved in a 2v1 Saints way and the Saints win - wow
Slid to ground and had the ****iest tackle ever applied then a regulation hand ball
Arguably trips a bloke (or at best he falls over on his own) and gets an uncontested ground ball

I find it hard to believe that both Brayshaw and Battle didn't contribute more to their team.

Doesn't matter how you spin it, Clark won the participation award version of the rising star.

What did you make of Brayshaw's highlights?

 

[wayToGo_]

What did you make of Brayshaw's highlights?

I don't want to criticise the highlight video produced (because hats off for doing that for us) but it did miss a fair bit and imo didn't do Brayshaw's game justice - like for instance the couple of times he put his body completely on the line in the 1st half.

You can check out all the involvements using StatsPro on afl.com.au these days. I find it best to use the Full tab (instead of just Highlights) so you see everything as the highlights aren't always the best bits. Scroll down to the bottom and then just hit the play button...

http://www.afl.com.au/stats/stats-pro#/discover/CD_I1002232/Brayshaw-Andrew

 

[mike91]

I love how some are willing to criticise our player and say he probably didn't deserve it because he made some mistakes when they didn't even watch the nominee play to make a comparison - and then go on to claim those of us annoyed Brayshaw didn't win mustn't have watched it either (um wtf?).

Brayshaw's nomination is justified because:
(a) he got 3 coaches votes - either Ross or Bolton thought his impact was significant enough to give him those votes
(b) statistically it was one of the most balanced games by a first year player this season - 1 goal, 24 pressure acts, 8 score involvements and 352 metres gained is impressive for a first year player (especially so from only 69% TOG)
(c) yes he made a handful of mistakes (mainly by foot) but as has been said many times previously he was playing in congestion and often winning the ball from multiple opponents as an 18yo kid - we still did score more than a third of the times he touched the ball and it's not like all first year players aren't making similar numbers of mistakes
(d) he's shown consistent output over all 13 games this season, something we were informed was a critical piece for getting a nomination (unless it isn't apparently)

Hunter Clark is and will be a good player but he played off half back and much of what he did was in space with zero to no pressure and he still made plenty of mistakes - go watch the replay or his highlights, not surprisingly with only 93 metres gained from half back there aren't that many. If you compare his game to what Cerra did against Adelaide the week before it is chalk and cheese.

Goals - 0 Cerra, 0 - Clark
Disposals - 30 Cerra, 17 - Clark
Contested - 12 Cerra, 4 - Clark
Intercepts - 8 Cerra, 5 - Clark
Score Involvements - 5 - Cerra, 4 - Clark
Marks - 6 - Cerra, 6 - Clark
Contested Marks - 2 - Cerra, 0 - Clark
Metres Gained - 400m - Cerra, 93m - Clark
Clearances - 2 - Cerra, 0 - Clark
Tackles - 4 - Cerra, 6 - Clark
Inside 50s - 8 - Cerra, 1 - Clark

So Cerra smashed him in every statistic except tackles and marks (even). That metres gained difference blows my mind.

Although he was less noticeable this week (probably because of what he did the week prior), Cerra's game on the weekend was still better than Clark's. 14 Disposals, 5 Contested, 5 Intercepts, 6 Score Involvements, 8 Marks, 1 Contested Mark, 2 Marks inside 50, 259 Metres Gained, 3 Tackles. Beating him in every statistic except disposals and tackles. Even Giro had a bigger output than Clark on the weekend.

Cerra probably deserved to win over Cox last week. Banfield deserved to win one when he played as a tagger earlier in the season. Brayshaw did enough on the weekend imo (in addition to his previous games) to win this week.

Apparently we nailed the 2017 draft and yet we haven't had a single RS nomination for any of our players from it yet. I'm more annoyed at that than the selection this round to be honest. Is it too much to ask for a fair playing field? My post in the melt thread was tongue in cheek but I probably wouldn't be holding back if I got a hold of Gil's ear (Tyson style if it came to that).

I love how some people are so unbiased they actually voice an unpopular opinion. Did you watch the Saints game? Jimmy Bartel and Matthew Lloyd were talking up Clark's last quarter, said he basically lead them and his attack when the game was on the line was super impressive. Stats don't determine impact on games and consistency, when it comes to getting nominated means nothing. I stand by my opinion that Brayshaw's game was good, but not good enough to be nominated.

Fully aware Cerra got screwed the week before

Banfield probably a bit stiff, but taggers rarely get rewarded with these type of rewards, so I'm not too surprised.

 

[wayToGo_]

Did you watch the Saints game?

Yes I did, I think I made that perfectly clear in my earlier post.

Go watch Clark's and Brayshaw's involvements on StatsPro and then come back and explain to me again why Brayshaw's mistakes are the reason he didn't get a nom whereas Clark's mistakes (and there were just as many) can be completely ignored? Both players made mistakes, both players did some good things. Brayshaw had a **** load more impact (backed up by both the stats and watching the actual footage of the games) especially in the first half when the game was up for grabs. Clark was a good contributor to the Saint's last term but surely he'd have been in the coaches votes if he "basically led them" when the game was on the line?

 

[mike91]

I'll say it again, stats don't determine impact on games. I quoted former players, that wasn't my opinion. The whole 'Brayshaw contributed when it mattered' argument is questionable, it was over well before half time, Neale, Fyfe and Apeness were doing the damage. I'm extremely confident he'll get his nomination soon enough, last week just wasn't it for him.

 

[Kram]

I can't be the only one that wonders why people care so much about these nominations.

 

[blue shark]

I can't be the only one that wonders why people care so much about these nominations.

Yeah, individual honours take care of themselves, premiership is all that matters. At the end of the day our youth stack
up very well compared to other clubs who have been rebuilding for years.

 

[Scatter]

To be fair, the AFL probably realised that the Saints are unlikely to win another game this year so very hard to give a RS nomination to someone on a team that loses. On the other hand, fully expecting us to win our last 9 games so plenty of opportunity to give 3 or 4 RS nominations to Brayshaw, Cerra, Banfield & Giro/Crowden/Darcy

 

[Tonga Bob]

does anyone know who chooses the nominees each week, and what criteria (as opposed to eligibility) they use to make their decision?

 

[Tbonefreo]

Ha ha you say we are too carried away with stats. Then quote the meaningless 82% DE Do you want to know what the retention rate was on Clark's 17 disposals? He had 5 disposals that you retained possession of. Hence why his metres gained was so tiny for someone playing at half back. Long kicks are treated as effective kicks even if the opposition ends up with the ball. He is going to be a good player for you but if you watch the worts and all package in ProStats you would see why comparing Brayshaw's video to his highlights video is silly. Even this video you can see where they cut off and Gold Coast gain possession on a few of the plays - like the great 1%er he does, give and go and then kicks straight to a GC player.

Whack

 

[masai]

I can't be the only one that wonders why people care so much about these nominations.

Exhibit A :- Rhys Palmer

In the scheme of things it is minor, the team is more important.

 

[masai]

does anyone know who chooses the nominees each week, and what criteria (as opposed to eligibility) they use to make their decision?

Laslo from the Coffee Shop in Brighton ?.

 

[wayToGo_]

I'll say it again, stats don't determine impact on games. I quoted former players, that wasn't my opinion. The whole 'Brayshaw contributed when it mattered' argument is questionable, it was over well before half time, Neale, Fyfe and Apeness were doing the damage. I'm extremely confident he'll get his nomination soon enough, last week just wasn't it for him.

Can you please explain to me why Brayshaw got coaches votes if he had no impact on the game until it was already over? Where did you get this idea I quoted just stats? I also gave the opinion of a current AFL coach - ie 3 coaches votes + links to the footage showing every involvement of each player so you can compare them side by side. Look, if you've watched the full involvements and still think I'm just being biased, I won't lose any sleep over it I promise.

I can't be the only one that wonders why people care so much about these nominations.

True, it's a bit of a waste of space, I'm just annoyed from the player's and club's perspective. Getting recognition from outside the club would surely be a nice thing for a youngster (and our development team) to reinforce their hard effort is paying off you'd think?... so long as they keep their ego in check unlike a past player of ours, GWS and Carlton seems to have done.

 

[Alfonz]

I can't be the only one that wonders why people care so much about these nominations.

Yep. I actually would prefer that none of our players get nominated so they can continue to fly under the radar. It is a meaningless award.

 

[Nodgey]

I'll ask Tim if players do or can get a bonus for one of these nominations. Because if there is $ involved, then it affects the hip pocket of those being ****ed over.

 

[mightymouse75]

How was Rhys Palmer. From hero to zero in 1 season

 

[One_Wing]

How was Rhys Palmer. From hero to zero in 1 season

An ACL will do that.

 

[nurries]

An ACL will do that.

I reckon when he took Micky B's leg out that was the beginning of the end. Lost his nerve and confidence after that.

 

[scon]

Walked differently after Harves kicked him in the goolies too.

I don't think there's reason to worry over Brayshaw's kicking.
Technique's solid, the rest will come as he settles and works it all out.
I remember he launched a 45 m pearler in an earlier game which was 'centimetre perfect' to the player's advantage negating his marker and leading to an inside 50 and score.
Vision and execution personified and he'll do it more as he develops.

 

[wayToGo_]

Ok so Mark Duffield (or one of his minions) clearly reads my BigFooty posts... From his latest podcast...

We have 4 players of the top 12 best odds on Sports Bet for Rising Star and only one of them has been nominated yet. Hunter Clark way back @ $101. Either we are going to have a flurry of nominations in the second half of the season or Sports Bet's algorithm is not configured correctly for Victorian bias.

https://thewest.com.au/sport/the-ga...tting-overlooked-in-rising-star-ng-b88871075z

Four Dockers are in the top-12 betting favourites for the rising star, but only Cox has received a nomination to date.

They really should have referenced my post in the melt thread instead though...

 

[One_Wing]

I reckon when he took Micky B's leg out that was the beginning of the end. Lost his nerve and confidence after that.

After the ACL he lost his main weapon which was pace. He was a speedy player with lots of stamina. Could have been Ben Cousin's esq. But once he lost the speed well he was basically done in the midfield at AFL level. And he just wasn't a very good forward, lacked the skill to be a decent linking player.

 

[Righteo]

G'day guys,

Someone requested an Andrew Brayshaw highlight compilation, so here you go



Hoping to make a Stefan Giro compilation soon, I like what I've seen so far from him.

Cheers

You’re a god

 

[Righteo]

You boys clearly get too carried away with stats, have a look at those highlights from Brayshaw and then compare them to these.

Clark went at 82% and was huge in the last qtr to get us over the line.

Good for you. liking all the negative Brayshaw posts on here is pretty sad though don’t you think?