Traded Ryan Burton [traded with #15, #35 and future 4th for Wingard and future 3rd]

[Mr Meeseeks]

Mate, I said it earlier in this thread. The backflip on Burton by Hawks fans is incredible.

Well anybody can focus on the vocal idiots I suppose... Although it seems lazy IMO.

Myself and the Hawks fans I know personally are really disappointed he has gone, no "incredible backflip" from me. He is a good kid with a great build and loads of promise. He is/was my 5 year-olds favourite player too.

You have to give quality to get quality and Wingard is quality, no doubt about it. I dont think there would of been anyone else on our list that would of satisfied Port anyway.

Disappointed, but I have no issues with the trade. We need proven X-factor more than we need a promising kid.

 

[KermitJagger]

Cyril won his Norm Smith off of an 18 disposal, 2 goal game. That's just an average day at the office for Chad Wingard.

Cyril won his Norm Smith off an 18 disposal, 2 goal game with 4 goal assists and 11 score involvements and one run down tackle Wingard wouldn't even think about attempting let alone make. In total he was part of the chain in about half of our scoring for the day whilst sitting out about 21% of the game.

Say what you want about Cyril, but if he didn't have so many hamstring troubles and need to literally re-learn the way he ran mid career he would be close to the consensus best small forward in the history of the AFL.

I'm glad to have Wingard and I think he's a freak, but he's had 3 poor years with no real excuse. Every full uninjured year after 2012 Cyril played he made the AA team.

 

[Wargreymon90]

People rating Rioli higher than wingard would make a good twilight zone episode.

Edit: it would actually be terrible

 

[KermitJagger]

People rating Rioli higher than wingard would make a good twilight zone episode.

Edit: it would actually be terrible

A twilight zone episode where almost every single knowledgeable football person and commentator, besides Port Adelaide fans and Kane Cornes and Warren Tredrea, rate Cyril higher than Wingard?

Gee I thought that was just real life, must be difficult for you blokes living it.

 

[Apex36]

People rating Rioli higher than wingard would make a good twilight zone episode.

Edit: it would actually be terrible

Wingard has a long way to go before he reaches Rioli’s level.

 

[Wargreymon90]

Wingard has a long way to go before he reaches Rioli’s level.

yep, with some hard work and good coaching hopefully he can eventually average half a goal less and 6 less touches a game

 

[KermitJagger]

yep, with some hard work and good coaching hopefully he can eventually average half a goal less and 6 less touches a game

Who knows, maybe he'll average 7 more disposals a game and become as good as Michael Barlow.

 

[Wargreymon90]

Who knows, maybe he'll average 7 more disposals a game and become as good as Michael Barlow.

Don’t know why you are arguing. You got chad at a bargain.

You’ll see within a month what we are talking about.

 

[Schulzenfest]

Don’t know why you are arguing. You got chad at a bargain.

You’ll see within a month what we are talking about.

I can't predict yet whether Hawthorn fans seeing Chad in the flesh every week and finally realising how good he actually is in comparison to the most overrated player of all time that they're constantly talking up is going to vindicate me or infuriate me. Probably both.

The most likely scenario is he plays exactly as well for Hawthorn as he did for Port Adelaide, but because he's now doing it for a big Victorian club he'll suddenly become twice the player in the eyes of the media. Aka the Shaun Burgoyne theory. Who by the way has less All-Australians AND less B&F's now at the age of 35 than Chad had by the age of 22.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Wingard is a gun, and will quite possibly go to another level now that he’s got a decent coach....but geez, Port fans, if you think he’s been better than Rioli you’re living in an alternate reality.

 

[Wargreymon90]

I can't predict yet whether Hawthorn fans seeing Chad in the flesh every week and finally realising how good he actually is in comparison to the most overrated player of all time that they're constantly talking up is going to vindicate me or infuriate me. Probably both.

The most likely scenario is he plays exactly as well for Hawthorn as he did for Port Adelaide, but because he's now doing it for a big Victorian club he'll suddenly become twice the player in the eyes of the media. Aka the Shaun Burgoyne theory. Who by the way has less All-Australians and less B&F's now at the age of 35 than Chad had by the age of 22.

There will be an element of that no doubt. But my bigger frustration will be when they see the finished product of chad the midfielder which we have been developing for the past two years. My anger will be more directed at our club though

 

[Schulzenfest]

Wingard is a gun, and will quite possibly go to another level now that he’s got a decent coach....but geez, Port fans, if you think he’s been better than Rioli you’re living in an alternate reality.

I live in the reality where he's a 15 disposal, 1.5 goal a game averaging player with a good highlights package. It's yourselves and his mates in the Vic media who are living in the alternate reality.

If you want to take the Port bias out of it, Rioli doesn't hold a candle to Eddie Betts at the Crows either.

 

[Wargreymon90]

Wingard is a gun, and will quite possibly go to another level now that he’s got a decent coach....but geez, Port fans, if you think he’s been better than Rioli you’re living in an alternate reality.

Why? Because reasons?

If crows fans said that betts was better than wingard, I doubt you would get that many arguments from port fans as at least there is a strong justification.

The only reason Rioli is rated so highly was that he was one of the favourites of the channel 7 boys club.

 

[TazHawk15]

I live in the reality where he's a 15 disposal, 1.5 goal a game averaging player with a good highlights package. It's yourselves and his mates in the Vic media who are living in the alternate reality.

Of course there is no such thing as SA bias is there?

 

[TazHawk15]

The only reason Rioli is rated so highly was that he was one of the favourites of the channel 7 boys club.

Speaking of Boys clubs.

Give us the lowdown on the Tredrea/Cornes Hawk Envy, Boys club.

We get that you rate Chad, we really do.

However stop posting s**t about Cyril, he is a 3X AA and a NSM and a 4 time Premiership player.

I could go the lazy way that you have and say "Chad is a good player but he is incredibly overrated by some people in SA"

Its a lazy way, but you seem to favour it.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

I live in the reality where he's a 15 disposal, 1.5 goal a game averaging player with a good highlights package. It's yourselves and his mates in the Vic media who are living in the alternate reality.

If you want to take the Port bias out of it, Rioli doesn't hold a candle to Eddie Betts at the Crows either.

Only clowns try to encapsulate what Rioli has ever done with his possession numbers.

And that’s being polite.

 

[KermitJagger]

Why? Because reasons?

If crows fans said that betts was better than wingard, I doubt you would get that many arguments from port fans as at least there is a strong justification.

The only reason Rioli is rated so highly was that he was one of the favourites of the channel 7 boys club.

I've explained why and you just ignore it. Wingard has had 3 poor seasons, Cyril on the other hand has had no poor seasons, only injury ridden seasons. Every year from 2012 where he has played every game or close to it, he has made All Australian. In 2016 when he was required to do more, he went to another level with his goal kicking and still averaged 6 tackles for the season.

Both Betts and Wingard have been in environments where they're required to be the leading goal kicker, or take more of an attacking mindset around their football. That was never Cyril's role - he had Roughead, Gunston, Breust and earlier Franklin kicking the goals. His direction was to pressure and to tackle, and historically he is the best Forward 50 pressure player in the competition, averages almost double the tackles of both Wingard and Betts and still managed to sneak more than his share of goals in.

Cyril played the ultimate team game, and his ability to pressure, keep the ball in and set up goals was more important to us scoring than Wingard kicking them. That's exactly why Hawks supporters and most people who actually watch football have rated Cyril as a better player to date than Wingard. That's not to say he won't exceed Cyril as he could, and if he stays fit probably will in individual accolades at least, but he's not there yet.

 

[Wargreymon90]

I've explained why and you just ignore it. Wingard has had 3 poor seasons, Cyril on the other hand has had no poor seasons, only injury ridden seasons. Every year from 2012 where he has played every game or close to it, he has made All Australian. In 2016 when he was required to do more, he went to another level with his goal kicking and still averaged 6 tackles for the season.

Both Betts and Wingard have been in environments where they're required to be the leading goal kicker, or take more of an attacking mindset around their football. That was never Cyril's role - he had Roughead, Gunston, Breust and earlier Franklin kicking the goals. His direction was to pressure and to tackle, and historically he is the best Forward 50 pressure player in the competition, averages almost double the tackles of both Wingard and Betts and still managed to sneak more than his share of goals in.

Cyril played the ultimate team game, and his ability to pressure, keep the ball in and set up goals was more important to us scoring than Wingard kicking them. That's exactly why Hawks supporters and most people who actually watch football have rated Cyril as a better player to date than Wingard. That's not to say he won't exceed Cyril as he could, and if he stays fit probably will in individual accolades at least, but he's not there yet.

I’m ignoring it because it’s completely made up. At worst he’s had one poor year. And it’s called poor because wingard is held to a standard that Rioli never was.

And so you are saying that Rioli should be more highly regarded because he didn’t have as much responsibility? And that he could afford to be the icing on the cake in one of the best forward lines of all time?

 

[TazHawk15]

I’m ignoring it because it’s completely made up. At worst he’s had one poor year. And it’s called poor because wingard is held to a standard that Rioli never was.

Typical SA bias.

Or does it not work both ways?

Look we all get how much you rate Chad we really do, now he is at a proper club he may live up to how high you rate him.

However your continued port shots at Cyril just shows how ignorant you are on the subject.

 

[Crow till I die]

A twilight zone episode where almost every single knowledgeable football person and commentator, besides Port Adelaide fans and Kane Cornes and Warren Tredrea, rate Cyril higher than Wingard?

Gee I thought that was just real life, must be difficult for you blokes living it.

As good as Cyril is, I am going to reserve judgement as I get the ominous feeling that under your coach, Wingard is going to go to another level and it is going to make port fans feel sick in the stomach that they had him and just could not get him to recapture his best form under Hinkley. Cyril is one of the very best, but Wingard can be that too

Edit. Hawks fans as a point of interest - if you had to choose who has been the better player for your club - is it Rioli or Burgoyne? I say this as I think Wingard can become a better player than Burgoyne for you if he gets it right

 

[KermitJagger]

I’m ignoring it because it’s completely made up. At worst he’s had one poor year. And it’s called poor because wingard is held to a standard that Rioli never was.

And so you are saying that Rioli should be more highly regarded because he didn’t have as much responsibility? And that he could afford to be the icing on the cake in one of the best forward lines of all time?

Alright, simply put:

Wingard kicked more goals because he was targeted more, not because he had more responsibility. They're different responsibilities.

In a forward line where forward pressure and repeat entries were essential, he was the best player at making sure that happened. His forward 50 pressure is why our defense could press up so high and still be effective, because the pressure that he typified never allowed meaningful rebound 50s.

That's more responsibility than Wingard had to kick goals.

As good as Cyril is, I am going to reserve judgement as I get the ominous feeling that under your coach, Wingard is going to go to another level and it is going to make port fans feel sick in the stomach that they had him and just could not get him to recapture his best form under Hinkley. Cyril is one of the very best, but Wingard can be that too

I agree, I said as much in a later comment. Career to date Cyril is still the better player, but Wingard has the talent to overtake him. Cyril could have been more had his body held up better, but it leaves the door open.

 

[TazHawk15]

As good as Cyril is, I am going to reserve judgement as I get the ominous feeling that under your coach, Wingard is going to go to another level and it is going to make port fans feel sick in the stomach that they had him and just could not get him to recapture his best form under Hinkley. Cyril is one of the very best, but Wingard can be that too

Now that he is away from the poisoned Tredrea and that dickhead Cornes boys club, he may very well go to another level.

Those Cornes boys are a special breed

Take this idiot Cornes dude (not sure which one is Kane and which one is Chad) who stated "Hawks losing out on Lynch and Shiel means they will become a bottom 4 team"

Followed less than a few days later by "The AFL should step in and stop a Top 4 club from getting Scully for nothing"

No wonder Wingard wanted out of the place and the chance to go on and be as good as Cyril.

 

[Wargreymon90]

Typical SA bias.

Or does it not work both ways?

Look we all get how much you rate Chad we really do, now he is at a proper club he may live up to how high you rate him.

However your continued port shots at Cyril just shows how ignorant you are on the subject.

Sigh. Hence why Cyril will always be regarded as the most overrated player of all time.

Good luck with Chad. You’ll see what us port fans are on about. I give it half a season

 

[TazHawk15]

Sigh. Hence why Cyril will always be regarded as the most overrated player of all time.

That silly statement confirms how stupid you are.

You are not one of the Cornes boys are you?

 

[Crow till I die]

That silly statement confirms how stupid you are.

You are not one of the Cornes boys are you?

From watching him when he played against us and in finals, Cyril was a player that got the maximum use from each possession. He didn't need to have 30 touches to kill you. I remember the 2012 prelim final V you guys and we got in front late in the game and Cyril turned it back on its head and chimed in with a goal and an assist and we could not reel it back with the time left. Nah..he is one of the freak players of this era