Has Kruezer been terribly disappointing?

[Zacka11]

[youtube]6MUc6hXYBSM[/youtube]

That was the only game he played as a first ruck last year due to Hampson's injury

NOT BAD, but at the end of the clip u looked like a bunch of Caelic Gunts!!!!!

 

[Call Me Cake]

Carlton's Gumbleton.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

He's a ruckman. Give him time. Looks the goods, he wouldn'tbe #1 pick for nothing and has shown a bit when he's played. Cant expect too much yet despite what Carlton supporters may think.

Will look great in brown and gold in 2/3 years time.....

 

[bulletproof]

In an open draft of all AFL players he'd go in top 5.

 

[mediumsizered]

Simple really. Cotchin >>> Kruezer. Carlton got this pick wrong.

If that helps Richmond supporters sleep at night, go with it.

 

[pantskyle]

Look I don't like Carlton one bit. But Kreuzer was the first player on my Supercoach team for this season. Without the injury he would be on par or better then Naitanui.

Just on his nickname "Humphrey" where did that come from. Personally I would have called him Freddy (Kreuzer/Krueger) also he had the acne that resembled Kruegers face.

 

[Slattery_20]

Good player, but I don't think he'll ever be a top three ruck.

Me either.
Good player though, moves well, just don't get the massive hype.

 

[La Vache]

No he hasn't been disappointing. I thought he was ordinary last year but of course Carlton supporters were probably just glad to see him get through it.

Has shown he is capable of sensational performances just needs continuity in position and in staying on the park.

 

[pantskyle]

Bit overrated imo.

One solid game against Sydney means nothing. Until he regularly starts tearing it up against decent opposition and finals, I can't see him being a player I would worry about.

I'm always a bit concerned going up against a Nic Nat, Cox, Sandilands, Mumford, Jolly etc because they can hurt you.

Do you often ruck against them?

 

[pantskyle]

Simple really. Cotchin >>> Kruezer. Carlton got this pick wrong.

They needed a ruckmen more then they needed a midfielder. They had just picked up the best one in the game.

 

[Slattery_20]

If that helps Richmond supporters sleep at night, go with it.

Cotchin's a better footballer - comfortably.

Whether or not he'd have been the right pick, for Carlton, is subjective; but Cotchin's a star.
Kreuzer might become one. Big difference.

 

[pantskyle]

Slatts how can anyone compare a small mid to a ruckmen? Sure Cotchin will get more of the ball but then Kreuzer will get more hit outs, goals, marks.

I think as far as importance to a team Kreuzer is in front.

 

[Jables]

Slatts how can anyone compare a small mid to a ruckmen? Sure Cotchin will get more of the ball but then Kreuzer will get more hit outs, goals, marks.

I think as far as importance to a team Kreuzer is in front.

Cotchin has 34 goals from 64 games, Kreuzer 38 from 68. About the same despite one playing as a key forward. Carlton also need a player like Cotchin, while they had to trade a talented ruck in Jacobs because he can't get game time.

On needs Kreuzer wasn't the right pick for Carlton IMO but he is probably a deserving pick 1.

 

[Slattery_20]

Slatts how can anyone compare a small mid to a ruckmen? Sure Cotchin will get more of the ball but then Kreuzer will get more hit outs, goals, marks.

I think as far as importance to a team Kreuzer is in front.

I don't even know how someone can say that.

Cotchin is Richmond's most important player. He plays poorly (or misses) = they have to put Tuck or Grigg on ball all day = they get creamed.

Kreuzer would barely be in Carlton's 10 most important (and yes, they're a stronger side, but not by too much in the talls). He plays poorly or misses = Warnock continues as the #1 ruck and Hampson gets a run @ FF or CHF.

I definitely agree that a good big man is worth more than a small guy of equal ability, but it's far from equal. Far from it.

 

[pantskyle]

But it would be equal if Kreuzer didn't have the injury setback. A year out is a long time for any player. Carlton essential got Judd and Kreuzer why would they pick Cotchin?

 

[Richo83]

this is not an issue for carlton.

And ruck depth is not an issue either. If Carlton were searching for rucks then they would probably have done more to hold Jacobs. Obviously they thought that Warnock was good enough, and he is. I mean he averaged nearly 30 hitouts last year which is about where the elite ruckmen averaged, and never got less than 20 hitouts. He's a gun.

I don't think Kreuzer is a forward. Secondly, I see Warnock and Hampson as a more than capable ruck duo. Hampson averaged over 20 hitouts last year. I think Carlton would be better served by an improving young quality KPP.

As for goals, it's hard to say who will kick more goals, but I think Cotchin is a more natural forward than Kreuzer. Cotchin almost kicked two goals within his first few kicks.

 

[Monkey King]

Loving this thread, all the Carlton fans claiming Kreuzer will be elite. Based on what evidence? That he was a high draft pick? He's shown about as much as Lachie Hansen has and Hansen is an absolute whipping boy on these boards.

They've both had injuries, both had one superstar game, both done some nice things, but both have shown they have miles to go to make it.

Not sure why some posters are pretending Kreuzer had shown nothing before his injury.

For those with short memories of Kreuzer's actual pre-injury form, check out this thread from just prior to his knee injury. It asks who the best 5 ruckmen of 2010 were to that point; and you'll find Kreuzer in more lists than not. The thread also shows Kreuzer's CD ranking among ruckmen to that point for those wanting a more objective take. Also just before his injury, the same question was posed on Footy Classified's and Kreuzer was one of four ruckmen mentioned. Not bad at all for 20-21yo ruckman to have been roundly considered in such equations.

The only thing disappointing about Kreuzer to date has been his injury and probably his centre-bounce work. Other than that, opposite to being a disappointment, he's actually exceeded my expectations in so many ways. The most impressive talent I've seen at the Blues for probably 20 years.

 

[Richo83]

Kreuzer would barely be in Carlton's 10 most important (and yes, they're a stronger side, but not by too much in the talls). He plays poorly or misses = Warnock continues as the #1 ruck and Hampson gets a run @ FF or CHF.

This is my point, that Carlton don't really rely on, or need Kreuzer. I think he's the least required number one pick for a while. I'm not sure whether that says more about Kreuzer or Carlton's form, but number one picks generally play a key part of the team. Riewoldt, Hodge, Cooney, Deledio, Murphy and Gibbs. Melbourne see Watts as key to their future, so do GWS with Scully. But overall, if Kreuzer plays say 11 middling games this year, I don't think that's too much of an issue.

 

[Slattery_20]

But it would be equal if Kreuzer didn't have the injury setback.

Ridiculous statement!
What if Cotchin didn't have the injury setbacks he suffered in 08, 09 and '10 ???

A year out is a long time for any player. Carlton essential got Judd and Kreuzer why would they pick Cotchin?

Hypothetically it boils down to Cotchin and Jacobs, or Ellard and Kreuzer.

I know which pair I'd take (I rate the big ranga very highly)

 

[pantskyle]

I didn't realise Cotchin suffered a year long injury with the added 12 months to get back to his best.

I'm not saying Kreuzer is better or worse but for need Carlton picked the better option at 1.

 

[Monkey King]

Carlton's Gumbleton.

Injury troll or ignoramus?

Prior to tearing his ACL - an unfortunate injury far removed from the repetitive soft tissue injuries Gumbleton suffered - Kreuzer had played 56 consecutive games from debut and was reasonably well ranked by pundits. Nothing like Gumbleton!

 

[markm106]

Gee you guys can be harsh. Have a look at the top ruckmen. Most took till 24-25 to hit peak. Some earlier I grant. Any way I don't think it matters if a ruck is picked up at 1 or 20 or even 50 on the rookie draft. It will take time for development. Kreuzer knee reco also has set him back. I'm gonna go with him being one of the tops rucks in a season or two.

 

[entourage]

Money King, I think you may've taken it too far with the most impressive talent comment.

However, Krezuer is a good player. Knee reco's are a tough recovery, and last year he showed glimpses of what he could do, throw in a full pre-season and he'll be raring to go and hopefully increase those glimpses into a regular showing. He was good before his knee injury, he was decent last season and I feel this year he will show what he is capable of.

Some of you are being way too harsh. When have you ever seen a ruckman take the game by the scruff at 22?!

Dean Cox's first 4 years: 851 disp, 311 marks, 24 goals, 1335 hit outs

Kreuzer: 814 disp, 188 marks, 38 goals, 964 hitouts

Sandilands: 764 disp, 287 marks, 20 goals, 1756 (holy ****!!!)

Point is, not only does it take a while for ruckmen to get into, but every ruckman/big man plays a different style of game. Those stats are very comparable especially when you consider Kreuzer's ACL injury.

You should be asking this question in a couple of years time.

 

[pavilion103]

In an open draft of all AFL players he'd go in top 5.

lol my sarcasm detector just exploded.

 

[BLue_Bloys]

Cotchin has 34 goals from 64 games, Kreuzer 38 from 68. About the same despite one playing as a key forward. Carlton also need a player like Cotchin, while they had to trade a talented ruck in Jacobs because he can't get game time.

On needs Kreuzer wasn't the right pick for Carlton IMO but he is probably a deserving pick 1.

Kreuzer has played less than a hand full of games as a key forward. He is a ruckman that rests forward. There's a huge difference.