Recommitted Darcy MacPherson [contracted and staying at Gold Coast]

[Jirik13]

Suns has picks 3,19,22,43,55,58,66,76 and you said that the Suns will be only selecting 2 players in the draft.

Do you think that Gold Coast will do more salary dumps, upgrade picks or swap for future picks?

I would expect 2 dumps. Cameron talked about a couple of deferrals Yes, I also expect trading current picks for future ones. No pick concession next year. There are clubs that need points to match bids. Quite possibly, I could see most picks to be used in dumps and future picks swaps except pick 3. I can foresee splitting pick 3 into 2. Let's say trade pick 3 for Tigers 7 and 15 with some later pick coming back and use those 2 picks in the draft.

 

[halfback dasher]

It's as simple as this - there are 16 other clubs that would like to deal this deal with Gold Coast

Your 100% right but there’s also enough of us who have had enough of the blatant and obvious manipulation of the AFL to achieve an outcome they want or see as beneficial to the detriment of the integrity of the competition.

 

[Jirik13]

Worth noting too when the AFL gave GC 19 it WAS NON TRADE-able

That rule was only for the last year. AFL assess Suns concessions every year.

 

[halfback dasher]

That rule was only for the last year. AFL assess Suns concessions every year.

And you don’t see that right there as a concern ?

 

[eastfreo75]

I would expect 2 dumps. Cameron talked about a couple of deferrals Yes, I also expect trading current picks for future ones. There are clubs who need points to match bids. Quite possibly, I could see most picks to be used in dumps and future picks swaps except pick 3. I can foresee splitting pick 3 into 2. Let's say trade pick 3 for Tigers 7 and 15 with some later pick coming back and use those 2 picks in the draft.

Do you think that the Suns downgrading pick 2 is because the players around that mark are flight risks?

Rumours of Brodie going to the Dockers.

 

[Jirik13]

Your 100% right but there’s also enough of us who have had enough of the blatant and obvious manipulation of the AFL to achieve an outcome they want or see as beneficial to the detriment of the integrity of the competition.

I don't think there is any integrity and equality in the competition.

The most obvious issue interstate fans in non-traditional areas have and Suns specifically is the 3rd party deals, sponsorship, commercial deals available to players in Melbourne. No chance to compete with that. Add that to TPP and it's a new world.

 

[buttox]

The worst outcome here for GC would be.
AFL refuses the trade, No other club has cap space to take on GC's contract.
GC breaches the salary cap and losses next years draft picks.
+ lose King, Rankin and Luco next year with no room to move.
Now I don't know how close GC are to going over, that seems unlikely. But it would totally have an effect on retention.

 

[Jirik13]

And you don’t see that right there as a concern ?

It pretty obvious to me that Suns are expansion team in growing market and AFL is trying to assist them to succeed. AFL actually owns Suns. How they go about it is another issue. Starting a club in metal sheds for 8 years tells all you need to know about how incompetent AFL is.

 

[Jirik13]

The worst outcome here for GC would be.
AFL refuses the trade, No other club has cap space to take on GC's contract.
GC breaches the salary cap and losses next years draft picks.
+ lose King, Rankin and Luco next year with no room to move.
Now I don't know how close GC are to going over, that seems unlikely. But it would totally have an effect on retention.

Considering that Suns did not go with salary cut across the list after TPP reduction as some other clubs did (e.g., Eagles, St Kilda) I don't think Suns are in danger of going over the cap. But that is just my speculation.

 

[halfback dasher]

I don't think there is any integrity and equality in the competition.

The most obvious issue interstate fans in non-traditional areas have and Suns specifically is the 3rd party deals, sponsorship, commercial deals available to players in Melbourne. No chance to compete with that. Add that to TPP and it's a new world.

Look I agree 100% , my dissatisfaction comes from ALL aspects of manipulation carried out by the AFL , not just specifically to and for any specific club .
We sit and watch them lift the struggling ( Dee’s a perfect example when the AFL dragged Roos and others in to sort out their mismanagement).
Then their also content to drag back the successful ( capping off field spending which impacts clubs like Hawthorn , WC etc )

its corrupt.......

 

[buttox]

It pretty obvious to me that Suns are expansion team in growing market and AFL is trying to assist them to succeed. How they go about it is another issue. Starting a club in metal sheds for 8 years tells all you need to know about how incompetent AFL is.

1.5 x the soft cap until you make the finals would be what I would do.
I think the big rookie list you guys got as part of the concessions is underrated.
It is great for a developing team.
And has minimal damage on other teams.
There is plenty the AFL could give GC without it being great draft picks.

 

[eastfreo75]

I don't think there is any integrity and equality in the competition.

The most obvious issue interstate fans in non-traditional areas have and Suns specifically is the 3rd party deals, sponsorship, commercial deals available to players in Melbourne. No chance to compete with that. Add that to TPP and it's a new world.

Salaries should be made public like the NBA.

The reason they are not because people would ask more questions about 3rd party deals.

I think we should introduce some of the ideas from the NBA.

Maybe something-like These:
1. Revised Larry Bird rule - Your top paid player if drafted by the team is outside the cap.
2. Revised Maxi deals - 10% bonus (outside the cap) for players re-signing and 20% for players re-signing with the club were drafted by.

 

[buttox]

Salaries should be made public like the NBA.

The reason they are not because people would ask more questions about 3rd party deals.

I think we should introduce some of the ideas from the NBA.

Maybe something-like These:
1. Revised Larry Bird rule - Your top paid player if drafted by the team is outside the cap.
2. Revised Maxi deals - 10% bonus (outside the cap) for players re-signing and 20% for players re-signing with the club were drafted by.

If I was a footy player I would hate that idea.
It is there private business. How much they are getting paid is none of ours. IMO.

 

[Jirik13]

1.5 x the soft cap until you make the finals would be what I would do.
I think the big rookie list you guys got as part of the concessions is underrated.
It is great for a developing team.
And has minimal damage on other teams.
There is plenty the AFL could give GC without it being great draft picks.

Yeah, extra soft cap would be a good way to assist and it seems acceptable to other clubs. AFL did the opposite, as they did not allow Suns to spend even the reduced soft cap in 2021. Sun had to cut back welfare, development, academy. No point to have extended list if you don't have resources to develop it.

 

[eastfreo75]

If I was a footy player I would hate that idea.
It is there private business. How much they are getting paid is none of ours. IMO.

Sure they wouldn’t like it as it brings more accountable to high paid players and list managers would hate it as well because it more expose bad deals.

Sometimes the players should be serving the game instead of the game serving them.

They are in the public.

 

[buttox]

Yeah, extra soft cap would be a good way to assist and it seems acceptable to other clubs. AFL did the opposite, as they did not allow Suns to spend even the reduced soft cap in 2021. Sun had to cut back welfare, development, academy. No point to have extended list if you don't have resources to develop it.

soft cap
added rookie list sizes.
state league players.
I think are all more palatable for other clubs.
I don't think anyone is saying GC shouldn't have got anything from the AFL.
Its just the AFL need to think rather than just offer the world in draft picks.

 

[halfback dasher]

soft cap
added rookie list sizes.
state league players.
I think are all more palatable for other clubs.
I don't think anyone is saying GC shouldn't have got anything from the AFL.
Its just the AFL need to think rather than just offer the world in draft picks.

And stop doing it while flipping the bird to the rest of the comp and it’s loyal supporters who in some cases have been supporting their clubs for decades both physically and financially.

 

[Mjs94]

You're right. 16 other clubs would like to buy first round picks. But that doesn't mean its good for the health of the game to go down that path.

Do 16 other clubs have the cap space to do so?
With COVID cut downs I'd suggest most don't.

There are clubs that have a space in the cap supposedly - Hawks, Essendon? I am sure they can contact Suns if they are willing to take on Macpherson or Brodie.

Your 100% right but there’s also enough of us who have had enough of the blatant and obvious manipulation of the AFL to achieve an outcome they want or see as beneficial to the detriment of the integrity of the competition.

I have bunched all your responses together because they are all similar in nature. I don't disagree that it isn't really in the spirit of trading, but from our point of view if we can exploit something for our benefit, we should. If the roles were reversed I'd be annoyed that your club got a leg up, but I wouldn't expect your club not to take advantage of it.

Really, the AFL needs to either veto this trade (which I hope they don't do) or forfeit all rights to intervene with clubs trading (which they won't do) on the basis that Salary Cap and the draft are both a part of list management. The likelihood is they'll tick this off and continue as per normal

 

[Foucault1989]

I have bunched all your responses together because they are all similar in nature. I don't disagree that it isn't really in the spirit of trading, but from our point of view if we can exploit something for our benefit, we should. If the roles were reversed I'd be annoyed that your club got a leg up, but I wouldn't expect your club not to take advantage of it.

Really, the AFL needs to either veto this trade (which I hope they don't do) or forfeit all rights to intervene with clubs trading (which they won't do) on the basis that Salary Cap and the draft are both a part of list management. The likelihood is they'll tick this off and continue as per normal

Until another team wants to do this and they block it.

 

[michaelk]

I'd be if the AFL block this deal.
After all it favours the Northern Golden Child and the Child they pity the most in North.

But watch it change from next year. Where's Hocking, the Agent of Change , when you need him most.

 

[eastfreo75]

Until another team wants to do this and they block it.

I don’t get the AFL.

Deals like this happens all the time in the NBA.

OKC thunders are currently amassing a lot of future first round picks because of salary dumps.

Say Tasmania came into the competition and GWS trade Cogs and a first round pick for nothing.

GWS get their salary cap in order and retain other players.

Tasmania gets an experienced player with leadership and first round pick for the long term.

Win Win deal.

 

[Wild Bill]

Initially this looks a great deal for North but I am worried that in the long run it may bight us on the ass. As most north supporters and other clubs know we have a number kids coming out out of contract who will attract plenty of interest. A 500k deal for a middle of the road player and pick #19 might actually cost us in 12 months.

It’s for 1 year.


Getting pick 19 is a massive win looking at this years draft. Especially with teams looking to trade out of the 1st round next year due to father/sons. Also teams have come out and stated they want more top 25 picks this year.

We could really play this well.

 

[Wild Bill]

Look I agree 100% , my dissatisfaction comes from ALL aspects of manipulation carried out by the AFL , not just specifically to and for any specific club .
We sit and watch them lift the struggling ( Dee’s a perfect example when the AFL dragged Roos and others in to sort out their mismanagement).
Then their also content to drag back the successful ( capping off field spending which impacts clubs like Hawthorn , WC etc )

its corrupt.......

Lol Corrupt.

That’s a fair over reaction.

 

[Mjs94]

Until another team wants to do this and they block it.

Which is what I said so I am not sure what your point is

 

[halfback dasher]

Lol Corrupt.

That’s a fair over reaction.

Really , is it ?