Review Good/Bad vs St Kilda, R9 2023

[Samcro24]

I think to the letter of the law play should have been stopped and the mark set. He gets a reprieve and any benefit of the doubt by virtue of not overstepping the mark. You're allowed to position your body to play on, be it by kick or handball. Its not play on until your called to play on, and play on should only be called once the player goes off the mark or disposes of the footy.

The instinctive “in the spirit of footy” call is to say bad luck, looks a lot like you were keen to continue play, went to kick with a player in the vicinity, took your chances, play on.

The fact that we have posters arguing either side shows how easy it is for an umpire to call it either way, even if they ultimately get it wrong (as they often do). They have to make the call on the spot without the luxury of replay. We've all watched it 50 times and with split interpretations.

 

[Mutineer]

Interesting read on Jack Steele

9

Jack Steele

Age

28

Ht

187cm

Wt

90kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.9

5star

K

8.7

3star

HB

12.2

5star

M

3.7

4star

T

6.8

5star

CL

3.6

5star

D

21.3

5star

K

10.0

4star

HB

11.3

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

5.8

5star

CL

4.6

5star

D

16.8

4star

K

5.0

2star

HB

11.8

5star

M

2.6

3star

T

6.4

5star

CL

3.6

5star

's take on our game in this article.

https://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/rossisms-saints-captain-says-lyon-needed-to-change/news-story/c9d5d021ea8186bc43b4c489ee5f95e5?amp

 

[FR0GGY]

How many more pages of shoulda coulda woulda?

As many as the list management/draft threads?

 

[GrommoT]

He goes to kick the ball and got pushed as he did it

Lack of awareness on his part

I don't know what the umpire would have ruled had the goal not been scored

Looks more like the Saints player pulls on Luke's right arm and causes him to step forward and then dislodges the ball

 

[FR0GGY]

This Pedlar/Keays goal piqued my interest on the weekend. There's a few different things at play that have been conflated a little in this discussion - 1. Pedlar's decision making, 2. The correct umpiring decision, 3. The actual umpiring decision.

First, whether Pedlar actually played on or not, it's clear that he intended to. That's a bad idea when you mark the ball one metre out, in the goal square. Just ask Nick Riewoldt. Go back and take the set shot Luke.

I should say good presence of mind by Keays to just kick the goal in case.

Second, what should the umpire have done? I reckon it's arguable whether or not Pedlar actually played on. He clearly was about to. But did he actually step past the mark beyond slowing his own momentum? Or go off his line? Or dispose of the ball? I think probably not, but it's arguable.

If he played on, then the ball spilled free. He wasn't tackled, so it's not holding the ball, it's just play on. Keays picks it up and goals and the right result happened.

If he didn't play on, then either Battle's contact is enough to justify a 50m penalty, or it's not. The only difference between those two options is whether the man on the mark ends up on the goal line or one metre out from it. Either way, it's Pedlar's kick. There can be no play on to advantage and Keays should not have been allowed to kick the goal.

The only way that the umpire's decision is right is if Pedlar played on.

Third, what did the umpire do? I haven't seen any footage that shows the arm signal to play on or audio of an umpire calling play on. On the reverse angle replay, it looks like the umpire is signalling a 50m penalty by making something similar to a signal for a 4 in cricket. Although there doesn't seem to be a particularly accepted signal for a 50m penalty.

If that's what he did, then it was clearly wrong to give the all clear for Keays to kick the goal. It should have been Pedlar's kick from the goal line.

It's all ultimately academic, but you'd hope the umpire's review picks up on this because next time it might matter. Edit: and there's a reasonable argument it might have cost Pedlar a Rising Star nom - 17 touches and 3 goals is harder to overlook than 16 and 2.

The umpire says advantage. I’ve got footage if you want.
It looks like the umpire signaled a mark and runs in as it’s unfolding.
Post the goal the st kilda player says “he played on”
Keays says “it’s a goal”
Umpire says “advantage.”

 

[Mutineer]

As many as the list management/draft threads?

Way way more variety on them...
Not all focused on one football incident that is now confined to history.

 

[cleanhands]

Looks more like the Saints player pulls on Luke's right arm and causes him to step forward and then dislodges the ball

I think this is the better of all cases put forward

 

[FR0GGY]

Way way more variety on them...
Not all focused on one football incident that is now confined to history.

Oh come on this is a thread about the game it’s all history.

 

[Mutineer]

Looks more like the Saints player pulls on Luke's right arm and causes him to step forward and then dislodges the ball

So there you have it, can that finally end the conjecture...

 

[dogs105]

So there you have, can that finally end the conjecture...

Yep. Thank you GrommoT

 

[GrommoT]

Was very squirrel brained.

Now, sure, there is a time and place for those kind of plays, but 30+ points up with around 40 minutes of play left isn't it. All it takes is an umpire to get the wrong impression and there goes a goal.

 

[dogs105]

What did y'all think about the Thilthorpe mark?

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

So there you have it, can that finally end the conjecture...

Keays reaction says everything

 

[GrommoT]

Yep. Thank you GrommoT

Actually, just saw Froggy's post and it's even clearer there.

 

[cleanhands]

What did y'all think about the Thilthorpe mark?

?

 

[GrommoT]

Interesting read on Jack Steele

9

Jack Steele

Age

28

Ht

187cm

Wt

90kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.9

5star

K

8.7

3star

HB

12.2

5star

M

3.7

4star

T

6.8

5star

CL

3.6

5star

D

21.3

5star

K

10.0

4star

HB

11.3

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

5.8

5star

CL

4.6

5star

D

16.8

4star

K

5.0

2star

HB

11.8

5star

M

2.6

3star

T

6.4

5star

CL

3.6

5star

's take on our game in this article.

https://www.news.com.au/sport/afl/rossisms-saints-captain-says-lyon-needed-to-change/news-story/c9d5d021ea8186bc43b4c489ee5f95e5?amp

Odd that I can open the article - they're usually paywalled.

 

[Vader]

Odd that I can open the article - they're usually paywalled.

news.com.au is free. It's their other sites - Advertiser, HUN, Telegraph, etc. that are all paywalled.

 

[FR0GGY]

What did y'all think about the Thilthorpe mark?

No mark

 

[arrowman]

The umpire says advantage. I’ve got footage of you want.
It looks like the umpire signaled a mark and runs in as it’s unfolding.
Post the goal the st kilda player says “he played on”
Keays says “it’s a goal”
Umpire says “advantage.”

Yes, I thought I heard the word "advantage" but it was hard to make out. Not sure what the "advantage" was supposed to be for, though.

 

[arrowman]

How many more pages of shoulda coulda woulda?

We've got until midnight Friday before it pollutes the game day thread.

 

[Jarman3]

Looks more like the Saints player pulls on Luke's right arm and causes him to step forward and then dislodges the ball

I don't think your theory is giving sufficient consideration to the possibility that there was a second Saints defender on the grassy knoll (or hill, whatever) who was actually responsible for knocking the ball out of Pedlar's hands.

 

[CrowBloke]

Looks more like the Saints player pulls on Luke's right arm and causes him to step forward and then dislodges the ball

ANOTHER interpretation above, making the post above by Samcro24 even more potent.

Here's what REALLY happened (I was there ) --- an alien spacecraft was at the Northern end, parked so that they could just peek over the Moreton Bay fig trees. Anybody else see'em??
Coincidentally, they are Saints fans (which explains the behaviour of Ross Lyons @ the presser later) and directed a Drop-O-beam @ Pedlar.
However, they did not count on the cat-like brilliance of Our Man Keays, who pounced for the goal.

<<looks for medication, due last night>>

 

[Jeffcrowe]

The umpire says advantage. I’ve got footage of you want.
It looks like the umpire signaled a mark and runs in as it’s unfolding.
Post the goal the st kilda player says “he played on”
Keays says “it’s a goal”
Umpire says “advantage.”

Doesn’t really make sense as can’t call advantage from a mark

It should have been 50m penalty or play on

 

[CrowBloke]

there was a second Saints defender on the grassy knoll (or hill, whatever) who was actually responsible for knocking the ball out of Pedlar's hands.

Out, and behind him.

Out, and behind him.

 

[GrommoT]

ANOTHER interpretation above, making the post above by Samcro24 even more potent.

Here's what REALLY happened (I was there ) --- an alien spacecraft was at the Northern end, parked so that they could just peek over the Moreton Bay fig trees. Anybody else see'em??
Coincidentally, they are Saints fans (which explains he behaviour of Ross Lyons @ the presser later) and directed a Drop-O-beam @ Pedlar.
However, they did not count on the cat-like brilliance of Our Man Keays, who pounced for the goal.

<<looks for medication, due last night>>