Mega Thread Port Forum 'General AFL Talk' Thread Part 11

[PAFC27]

This has got to be on tape.

https://www.essendonfc.com.au/news/2015-05-27/the-story-so-far-dustin-fletcher
22nd July 2001 – After the Bombers come from 69 points behind to beat the Kangaroos, Fletcher is fined $600 for shaking the goal post.

If it's not online, it's worth tweeting the front bar for their 'from the archives' segment for sure

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

If it's not online, it's worth tweeting the front bar for their 'from the archives' segment for sure

I think the whole game is on line but I'm not going to watch that, to find it. It hasn't been cut into a specific youtube video.

 

[It Just Is]

Appeal on what grounds though?

There was clearly high contact in the bump, so he can't get that wiped out.

He was rated as careless. So he can't get it downgraded fight that to get the offence down graded.

And the clash of heads took Gary Rohan out of the game, so he's not going to be able to argue its low impact.

I think the argument is that it shouldn’t even be graded as careless. Durdin took every care to get low and had no reasonable alternative course of action. The head clash was an unforeseeable and accidental football collision.

 

[GremioPower]

Had a rethink about Rampe and the shaking of the goal post issue.

17.11 SHAKING GOAL POST OR BEHIND POST 17.11.1 Free Kicks - Shaking Goal Post or Behind Post Unless Law 17.11.3 applies, a Free Kick shall be awarded against a Player or Official who intentionally shakes a goal or behind post (either before or after a Player has disposed of the football).

The more I think about that, the more I reckon Rampe has a case of not intentionally shaking a goal post. Trying to climbing the goal post isn't intentionally shaking the post. Shaking a goal post is a reportable offence

21.2 REPORTABLE OFFENCES
.....
21.2.2 Specific Offences Any of the following types of conduct is a Reportable Offence:
(a) intentionally or carelessly;
..................
(z) intentionally shaking a goal or behind post;

So if Rampe was intentionally shaking the goal post, he had to get reported as well as give away a free kick.

So if this ended up at the tribunal, Rampe's QC would argue how is trying to climb a goal post to get an advantage to some how touch a ball going thru for a goal, intentionally shaking the post?

These are some eamples of intentional shaking of the post not just climbing it. From a 2014 article of 10 bizarre reasons for going to the tribunal

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/...l/news-story/7f4ee887fa0d4870cdbbcfe326e0385f

4. GOAL POST SHAKING
Six players, including Essendon’s Dustin Fletcher (fined $600), former Saint Stewart Loewe (fined $1000) and former Lion Darren Wheildon (fined $600), have been charged with the unusual offence of goal post shaking. Wheildon was dumbfounded when he was reported in 1993 after shaking the post while a teammate was shooting for goal. His coach Robert Shaw laughed: “He’s come up with another one, ‘Doc’. It was either going to be the 60-metre drop kick goal at the 29-minute mark or a report for shaking the goal post. I wasn’t sure which one. But God bless him, he’s an entertainer.”


And in 2018 the rule was 15.9.1. Plenty of new rules added since last year.

Where can I find the rule book? It was never "shaking the post," but it certainly was an unsportsmanlike conduct. I am not sure whether it would be punishable with a free kick, though.

 

[RussellEbertHandball]

Where can I find the rule book? It was never "shaking the post," but it certainly was an unsportsmanlike conduct. I am not sure whether it would be punishable with a free kick, though.

https://s.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL Tenant/AFL/Files/2019 Laws of Australian Football.pdf

 

[GremioPower]

https://s.afl.com.au/staticfile/AFL Tenant/AFL/Files/2019 Laws of Australian Football.pdf

Thanks.

It can be argued that the umpires and the MRO acted well, but I personally think that it wasn't the best interpretation of the rules.

There is no rule against climbing the posts. Hence, the case is not clear-cut. Still, I believe that the umpires should have applied these rules: 18.1; 18.2-f; 17.12-g (underlined).

18.1 SPIRIT AND INTENTION
After a Mark or Free Kick has been awarded to a Player, a Fifty Metre Penalty will be awarded against the opposing Team that unduly delays or impedes the play, or behaves in an unsportsmanlike manner.

18.2 WHEN IMPOSED
Where a field Umpire has awarded a Mark or Free Kick to a Player, the field Umpire shall also award a Fifty Metre Penalty in favour of that Player if the field Umpire is of the opinion that any Player or Official from the opposing Team:
(f) engages in any other conduct for which a Free Kick would ordinarily be awarded.

17.12 OTHER
A Free Kick shall be awarded against a Player who:
(g) engages in misconduct;

Thus, they should have called a fifty-meter penalty against Rampe for misconduct — unsportsmanlike behavior (attempt to gain unfair advantage) delaying the play. He also has put his own safety and of others in risk while breaking the law.

The conduct could also be considered as a reportable offense, under 21.2.2-y; -cc.

21.2 REPORTABLE OFFENCES
21.2.2 Specific Offences
Any of the following types of conduct is a Reportable Offence:
(y) interfering with a Player Kicking for Goal;
(cc) engaging in any other act of misconduct or serious misconduct.

I also believe that Rampe should be reported and fined for climbing the goal post.

Not surprising, nothing of this has actually happened.

 

[Ishikawa]

This has got to be on tape.

https://www.essendonfc.com.au/news/2015-05-27/the-story-so-far-dustin-fletcher
22nd July 2001 – After the Bombers come from 69 points behind to beat the Kangaroos, Fletcher is fined $600 for shaking the goal post.

It was on AFL360 last night. I think there's still a guy (Jake Best) who uploads the following day.

Basically Sinclair was taking a shot on the angle with Fletcher manning the mark, Fletcher somewhat subtly hitting the post with his arse a few times as Sinclair was walking in. Put it through so no impact.

 

[Ishikawa]

Richmond were a joke of a side that made finals only to lose the Elimination Final when Lade was there and then there was the really pathetic 2016 season. Lade left to go to Port in 2017. Richmond won the flag in 2017.

Didn't he return there this off-season?

Edit - Ah, it was the Saints sorry not sure why I thought that he was back at the Tigers. They do seem to have developed young Marshall well over the off-season though.

 

[philthy05]

Had a rethink about Rampe and the shaking of the goal post issue.

17.11 SHAKING GOAL POST OR BEHIND POST 17.11.1 Free Kicks - Shaking Goal Post or Behind Post Unless Law 17.11.3 applies, a Free Kick shall be awarded against a Player or Official who intentionally shakes a goal or behind post (either before or after a Player has disposed of the football).

The more I think about that, the more I reckon Rampe has a case of not intentionally shaking a goal post. Trying to climbing the goal post isn't intentionally shaking the post. Shaking a goal post is a reportable offence

21.2 REPORTABLE OFFENCES
.....
21.2.2 Specific Offences Any of the following types of conduct is a Reportable Offence:
(a) intentionally or carelessly;
..................
(z) intentionally shaking a goal or behind post;

So if Rampe was intentionally shaking the goal post, he had to get reported as well as give away a free kick.

So if this ended up at the tribunal, Rampe's QC would argue how is trying to climb a goal post to get an advantage to some how touch a ball going thru for a goal, intentionally shaking the post?

These are some eamples of intentional shaking of the post not just climbing it. From a 2014 article of 10 bizarre reasons for going to the tribunal

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/...l/news-story/7f4ee887fa0d4870cdbbcfe326e0385f

4. GOAL POST SHAKING
Six players, including Essendon’s Dustin Fletcher (fined $600), former Saint Stewart Loewe (fined $1000) and former Lion Darren Wheildon (fined $600), have been charged with the unusual offence of goal post shaking. Wheildon was dumbfounded when he was reported in 1993 after shaking the post while a teammate was shooting for goal. His coach Robert Shaw laughed: “He’s come up with another one, ‘Doc’. It was either going to be the 60-metre drop kick goal at the 29-minute mark or a report for shaking the goal post. I wasn’t sure which one. But God bless him, he’s an entertainer.”


And in 2018 the rule was 15.9.1. Plenty of new rules added since last year.

As I’ve said before the intentional wording in the shaking the post rule is clearly there to differentiate between someone interfering with the post and someone who hits the post by accident like getting knocked or falling into it.

Not to split hairs whether a guy climbing it meant to shake it or not.


When they wrote the rules they assumed common sense to those that would later have to apply them.

Unfortunately we now know you cannot trust people to apply common sense because people are always stupider than you think they are.

Which is why the afl had a great opportunity here to say the umpire got it wrong and to then clarify the rule book so it wouldn’t happen again.

But they’re idiots.

 

[OneGreatClub]

 

[OneGreatClub]

So now they are excusing Ablett using his elbow as he is trying to protect his shoulder?

 

[Holden Hillbilly]

The crows would have to get rid of one of their overpaid forwards to get him. Port no chance.

 

[dav3]

So now they are excusing Ablett using his elbow as he is trying to protect his shoulder?

Perhaps Nat Fyfe should start using his fist to protect his elbow

 

[dav3]

The crows would have to get rid of one of their overpaid forwards to get him. Port no chance.

The Crows would have to throw out their amazing pay structure too, wonder how they'd spin that one.

 

[PAFC_1870]

If Jenkins and Betts move on, that should cover a fair chunk surely....

 

[dav3]

If Jenkins and Betts move on, that should cover a fair chunk surely....

Betts has another year to go on his contract and on current form shouldn't go around again, but Jenkins is signed on till the end of 2021. I can't see them getting anyone to pick up his salary for that length of time, or for the picks the Crows would demand for a contracted player. They'd need to move Jacobs (and probably Douglas) on too

 

[PAFC_1870]

Betts has another year to go on his contract and on current form shouldn't go around again, but Jenkins is signed on till the end of 2021. I can't see them getting anyone to pick up his salary for that length of time, or for the picks the Crows would demand for a contracted player. They'd need to move Jacobs (and probably Douglas) on too

Oh I thought this was Betts last... that's awkward, he's gonna be a real liability.

Jenkins they COULD move on a chunk of the salary, like Lobbe.

Douglas/McKay would be 2 others I guess that could contribute, Jacobs too?

But yeah this still goes against their salary cap structure... and maybe on the weekend they may have shown they don't need Grundy as much as they may have thought a few months ago...

 

[OneGreatClub]

The Crows would have to throw out their amazing pay structure too, wonder how they'd spin that one.

Especially when Tex apparently took unders to keep the gang together. Then again, he has all those juicy media ads to line his pockets with.

 

[Nelson051]

Rumour is Essendon are going to take former Port Adelaide player Jimmy Toumpas in the mid season draft.... what ******* idiots!

 

[OneGreatClub]

Rumour is Essendon are going to take former Port Adelaide player Jimmy Toumpas in the mid season draft.... what ******* idiots!

Meh. Good luck to him.

 

[dav3]

Rumour is Essendon are going to take former Port Adelaide player Jimmy Toumpas in the mid season draft.... what ******* idiots!

The way they're playing at the moment he'd probably be a walk-up start.

 

[chachi11]

Shaun Grigg has retired...

 

[AwwThatsApples]

With Jonas set to miss this week as far as I'm concerned, I question whether or not Bonner comes back in or if we try our luck with Mayes in the absence of Burton.

 

[PAFC27]

There's something so funny about white middle aged facebook mums and dads defiantly arguing about which indigenous guernsey design is best. Finger on the pulse of the culture.

 

[GremioPower]

There's something so funny about white middle aged facebook mums and dads defiantly arguing about which indigenous guernsey design is best. Finger on the pulse of the culture.

Foreigners are even worse, mate. They have no idea what they are talking about. Still, they talk about it. It is unbelievable...