Preview Changes Rd 8 vs Port Power

[Clayton Lamb]

Jones looked good in the SANFL today. Time to bring him in - maybe playing the Showdown will fire him up.

So which of Port's small forwards will he shut down - Robbie Gray, Connor Rozee or Orazio Fantasia?

 

[crows dude]

INJURED - CROUCH, TALIA, GOLLANT, HINGE, MILERA

IN LYNCH, MCASEY, SLOANE,O'CONNOR, WORRELL
OUT ROWE, MURPHY, MCADAM BERRY MACPHERSON


SANFL
F ROWE FRAMPTON WRIGHT
HF MURPHY FOGARTY MCADAM
C COOK BOYLE NEWCHURCH
HB JONES BORLASE MACPHERSON
B L MATTHEWS MERRETT LATCHFORD
RUCK
STRACHAN
PEDLAR
BERRY
INTER - DAVIS JACKSON CLARKE COOK MARINI


AFL
F LYNCH HIMMELBERG SCHOENBERG
HF THILTHORPE WALKER MCHENRY
C SHOLL KEAYS SEEDSMAN
HB BROWN MURRAY SMITH
B MCASEY BUTTS DOEDEE
RUCK
O'BRIEN
LAIRD
SLOANE
INTER
O'CONNOR, HATELY MACKAY WORRELL KELLY

 

[Bearded Clam]

Frampton was played in position, fog was not.

Its getting to the point where it almost worth ignoring every comment Vader makes on Fogarty..

Fogarty mustve run over vaders dog in the past..

The mismangement of Fog by the club since he arrived at the end of 2017 has been an utter disgrace.

in 2018 the lad showed a heap.. what did the club do?... gave him a few games but mostly played him in the sanfl.. preferring to play a clearly injured and out of form Walker and a mentally checked out and, at times, completely out of form Jenkins.

in 2019 Don Pyke and the genius’s that he had in his assistant coaching panel decided that the best place Fog should spend the year was in the SANFL in defense!... brilliant strategy!.. again preferring to play Jenkins in the forward line.. a bloke who no longer even wanted to be at the club and was possibly leaking crap to the media.

in 2020... well yet again a clearly out of form and injured Tex walker was granted game after game. In a completely pointless exercise.. what shouldve happened was tex told to go away and get his body right and the forward line given over to Fogarty for the year.. instead we had a shit midfield kicking sky balls into our forward 50 and tex walker jumping up in packs with one arm trying to take miraculous marks all season. Fog played 10 games.

this year we’ve decided to try and turn him into a midfielder!.. which I actually dont mind, but some of our supporters beleive isnt gonna work because... he’s already played 3 games there now and hasnt immediately turned into Christian Petracca.

what next?

 

[DJ75]

INJURED - CROUCH, TALIA, GOLLANT, HINGE, MILERA

IN LYNCH, MCASEY, SLOANE,O'CONNOR, WORRELL
OUT ROWE, MURPHY, MCADAM BERRY MACPHERSON


SANFL
F ROWE FRAMPTON WRIGHT
HF MURPHY FOGARTY MCADAM
C COOK BOYLE NEWCHURCH
HB JONES BORLASE MACPHERSON
B L MATTHEWS MERRETT LATCHFORD
RUCK
STRACHAN
PEDLAR
BERRY
INTER - DAVIS JACKSON CLARKE COOK MARINI


AFL
F LYNCH HIMMELBERG SCHOENBERG
HF THILTHORPE WALKER MCHENRY
C SHOLL KEAYS SEEDSMAN
HB BROWN MURRAY SMITH
B MCASEY BUTTS DOEDEE
RUCK
O'BRIEN
LAIRD
SLOANE
INTER
O'CONNOR, HATELY MACKAY WORRELL KELLY

Not sure if you are aware, but you seem to have Caps Lock stuck on.

That or you think we are all deaf...

Oh and you have also managed to pick our biggest and slowest side possible. Against a team whose pace always kills us. In a game expected to be wet.
Good work.

 

[WeedsMullet84]

Its getting to the point where it almost worth ignoring every comment Vader makes on Fogarty..

Fogarty mustve run over vaders dog in the past..

The mismangement of Fog by the club since he arrived at the end of 2017 has been an utter disgrace.

in 2018 the lad showed a heap.. what did the club do?... gave him a few games but mostly played him in the sanfl.. preferring to play a clearly injured and out of form Walker and a mentally checked out and, at times, completely out of form Jenkins.

in 2019 Don Pyke and the genius’s that he had in his assistant coaching panel decided that the best place Fog should spend the year was in the SANFL in defense!... brilliant strategy!.. again preferring to play Jenkins in the forward line.. a bloke who no longer even wanted to be at the club and was possibly leaking crap to the media.

in 2020... well yet again a clearly out of form and injured Tex walker was granted game after game. In a completely pointless exercise.. what shouldve happened was tex told to go away and get his body right and the forward line given over to Fogarty for the year.. instead we had a sh*t midfield kicking sky balls into our forward 50 and tex walker jumping up in packs with one arm trying to take miraculous marks all season. Fog played 10 games.

this year we’ve decided to try and turn him into a midfielder!.. which I actually dont mind, but some of our supporters beleive isnt gonna work because... he’s already played 3 games there now and hasnt immediately turned into Christian Petracca.

what next?

Truth hurts!

 

[Crow till I die]

INJURED - CROUCH, TALIA, GOLLANT, HINGE, MILERA

IN LYNCH, MCASEY, SLOANE,O'CONNOR, WORRELL
OUT ROWE, MURPHY, MCADAM BERRY MACPHERSON


SANFL
F ROWE FRAMPTON WRIGHT
HF MURPHY FOGARTY MCADAM
C COOK BOYLE NEWCHURCH
HB JONES BORLASE MACPHERSON
B L MATTHEWS MERRETT LATCHFORD
RUCK
STRACHAN
PEDLAR
BERRY
INTER - DAVIS JACKSON CLARKE COOK MARINI


AFL
F LYNCH HIMMELBERG SCHOENBERG
HF THILTHORPE WALKER MCHENRY
C SHOLL KEAYS SEEDSMAN
HB BROWN MURRAY SMITH
B MCASEY BUTTS DOEDEE
RUCK
O'BRIEN
LAIRD
SLOANE
INTER
O'CONNOR, HATELY MACKAY WORRELL KELLY

Looking at the outs and ins, 5 smalls are out and 3 more talls are in. Port are a fast side....

 

[GROTTO]

Waether Update.

There will be a lot of slipping and slopping on Saturday night by the Crows. Lets not forget flopping too by Wobbie Gray.

The wetter, the better they say at Crazy Horse.

 

[GROTTO]

Looking at the outs and ins, 5 smalls are out and 3 more talls are in. Port are a fast side....

We need speed around the ball and strong bodies given the conditions.

Fogarty fulfills that criteria of strong bodies, has to be a lock this week.

 

[Johnny Rutten]

We need speed around the ball and strong bodies given the conditions.

Fogarty fulfills that criteria of strong bodies, has to be a lock this week.

Happy for Fog to come back in. Despite a few clangers, he was pretty good yesterday.

 

[Mego Red]

Its getting to the point where it almost worth ignoring every comment Vader makes on Fogarty..

Fogarty mustve run over vaders dog in the past..

The mismangement of Fog by the club since he arrived at the end of 2017 has been an utter disgrace.

in 2018 the lad showed a heap.. what did the club do?... gave him a few games but mostly played him in the sanfl.. preferring to play a clearly injured and out of form Walker and a mentally checked out and, at times, completely out of form Jenkins.

in 2019 Don Pyke and the genius’s that he had in his assistant coaching panel decided that the best place Fog should spend the year was in the SANFL in defense!... brilliant strategy!.. again preferring to play Jenkins in the forward line.. a bloke who no longer even wanted to be at the club and was possibly leaking crap to the media.

in 2020... well yet again a clearly out of form and injured Tex walker was granted game after game. In a completely pointless exercise.. what shouldve happened was tex told to go away and get his body right and the forward line given over to Fogarty for the year.. instead we had a sh*t midfield kicking sky balls into our forward 50 and tex walker jumping up in packs with one arm trying to take miraculous marks all season. Fog played 10 games.

this year we’ve decided to try and turn him into a midfielder!.. which I actually dont mind, but some of our supporters beleive isnt gonna work because... he’s already played 3 games there now and hasnt immediately turned into Christian Petracca.

what next?

Jesus, I've never seen a player get forgiven for their lack of impact like Fog gets forgiven by this board.

I'm not saying Vader is right - those words will never pass my lips - but he's the only person around here saying that Fog needs to take some responsibility for the fact he's maybe played three or four good games in total across AFL and SANFL since he arrived at the club.

It's ridiculous to keep blaming others for the fact that Fog just doesn't get involved.

Hopefully settling him down in a role and working to change his body shape will help him, but he has to own it himself too

 

[hey shorty]

We need more pace in the side, however there's not much to pick from in that department. Newchurch isn't ready and I'd like to see a bit more from Jones but wouldn't be unhappy if he was picked.

Based on yesterday's SANFL game you'd have Jones, Worrell, McAsey, Fog and ROC amongst the possible ins which again illustrates the lack of speed we've got. Hamill if he's fit does bring a lot of it but Sloane assuming he plays does not. Then theres Lynch.......

And none are small forwards to replace our faltering small brigade which means probably only one is facing the axe.

We have so many underperforming players we HAVE to make changes. Do we bring all those guys in and try to win the contest but risk getting cut up on the outside even worse than last week ??

 

[Crow till I die]

We need speed around the ball and strong bodies given the conditions.

Fogarty fulfills that criteria of strong bodies, has to be a lock this week.

I think with it possibly being wet this weekend, I would bring in Fogarty, O'Connor and Sloane (if fit enough to play). Offers more grunt in the midfield and Sloane could swing forward for spells and we know he can kick goals if he gets the chance. I would drop McAdam, Himmelberg (for this game if it is wet - we will be too top heavy otherwise up forward). Not sure who else comes out and I am saying this as Rowe seems like the obvious one..but again, if it is wet and the ball is on the deck, I just fancy it might suit him and he is a bit of a grub so may do well on the night

 

[hey shorty]

Its getting to the point where it almost worth ignoring every comment Vader makes on Fogarty..

Fogarty mustve run over vaders dog in the past..

The mismangement of Fog by the club since he arrived at the end of 2017 has been an utter disgrace.

in 2018 the lad showed a heap.. what did the club do?... gave him a few games but mostly played him in the sanfl.. preferring to play a clearly injured and out of form Walker and a mentally checked out and, at times, completely out of form Jenkins.

in 2019 Don Pyke and the genius’s that he had in his assistant coaching panel decided that the best place Fog should spend the year was in the SANFL in defense!... brilliant strategy!.. again preferring to play Jenkins in the forward line.. a bloke who no longer even wanted to be at the club and was possibly leaking crap to the media.

in 2020... well yet again a clearly out of form and injured Tex walker was granted game after game. In a completely pointless exercise.. what shouldve happened was tex told to go away and get his body right and the forward line given over to Fogarty for the year.. instead we had a sh*t midfield kicking sky balls into our forward 50 and tex walker jumping up in packs with one arm trying to take miraculous marks all season. Fog played 10 games.

this year we’ve decided to try and turn him into a midfielder!.. which I actually dont mind, but some of our supporters beleive isnt gonna work because... he’s already played 3 games there now and hasnt immediately turned into Christian Petracca.

what next?

Fogarty himself was VERY underdone in 2018..... Came off a very limited prep.

I don't mind him in the midfield either but I want to see more than yesterday to convince me he can do it at AFL level. Leave him there for a month and see if he can do that on a consistent basis.

I like the kid, he's got game but he gets sooooo many excuses from people here.

 

[hey shorty]

We need speed around the ball and strong bodies given the conditions.

Fogarty fulfills that criteria of strong bodies, has to be a lock this week.

But he fails miserably at the first bit.

If you're going to pick a new midfielder, bearing in mind Sloane should be fit.... It's O'Connor.

 

[CrowinNT]

Waether Update.

There will be a lot of slipping and slopping on Saturday night by the Crows. Lets not forget flopping too by Wobbie Gray.

The wetter, the better they say at Crazy Horse.

View attachment 1117626

Where are the Crouch Bros when we need them ?

 

[hey shorty]

Where are the Crouch Bros when we need them ?

1 might play SANFL soon.....

 

[Scorpus]

Last year McAdam had tricks and speed on a lead. Now he has nothing. Has to be hampered surely.

In the SANFL did Rowe go up the ground much? Is he lost outside of F50?

Based on his involvements in the game, Rowe actually got most of his disposal outside F50. His issue was not being an effective crumber at the contest anywhere on the ground but especially inside F50

 

[WeedsMullet84]

Based on his involvements in the game, Rowe actually got most of his disposal outside F50. His issue was not being an effective crumber at the contest anywhere on the ground but especially inside F50

You know you're in trouble when the opposition talls are crumbing the ball better than your small forwards.

 

[SellarStardom]

Midfield I would look to add something different by playing Murphy up on the ball and having Doedee in there as well. Bring in Worrell for the third man role.

Machperson is offering nothing down back and Rowe is the same up flrward. Drop Rowe and bring Macpherson up as small forward or drop him as well.

Worrell for Rowe
Sloane for Berry (if fit)
O'Connor or Jones for Macpherson

 

[Vhaluus]

Its getting to the point where it almost worth ignoring every comment Vader makes on Fogarty..

Fogarty mustve run over vaders dog in the past..

The mismangement of Fog by the club since he arrived at the end of 2017 has been an utter disgrace.

in 2018 the lad showed a heap.. what did the club do?... gave him a few games but mostly played him in the sanfl.. preferring to play a clearly injured and out of form Walker and a mentally checked out and, at times, completely out of form Jenkins.

in 2019 Don Pyke and the genius’s that he had in his assistant coaching panel decided that the best place Fog should spend the year was in the SANFL in defense!... brilliant strategy!.. again preferring to play Jenkins in the forward line.. a bloke who no longer even wanted to be at the club and was possibly leaking crap to the media.

in 2020... well yet again a clearly out of form and injured Tex walker was granted game after game. In a completely pointless exercise.. what shouldve happened was tex told to go away and get his body right and the forward line given over to Fogarty for the year.. instead we had a sh*t midfield kicking sky balls into our forward 50 and tex walker jumping up in packs with one arm trying to take miraculous marks all season. Fog played 10 games.

this year we’ve decided to try and turn him into a midfielder!.. which I actually dont mind, but some of our supporters beleive isnt gonna work because... he’s already played 3 games there now and hasnt immediately turned into Christian Petracca.

what next?

Petracca was a shit midfielder for a long time too, people forget that.

Melbourne copped a lot of flack for not just playing him as a forward by their supporters.

 

[Redline]

Personally I am happy to stick with Himmelberg ahead of Frampton. Neither will be there long term but I feel Himmelberg could have more improvement. He needs to be the back up ruck though, I don't want Thilthorpe in the ruck.

McAdam goes before Rowe based on effort and output. Rowe won't be a superstar but I am happy to give him a few more games being the younger player.

Not sure moving Murray up forward was the right move. Happy to keep him in defence for this week.

I am not really sure what to do with Fogerty. Maybe play him in the midfield again given lack of options.

 

[CrowBloke]

But you neglect the one thing that we’ve never done with him, given fog an uninterrupted run as the key lead up forward without Tex. Give him a run of 10 games like that and let’s see how he does.

Are you suggesting --- seriously --- that the Crows drop one of their 3 current best players (who is leading the Coleman Medal count)?
Drop Tex, to give Fogarty 10 games as the key lead-up forward?
Nah, mate.

 

[DJ75]

Happy for Fog to come back in. Despite a few clangers, he was pretty good yesterday.

Fog is not a mid - yet.

The issue with Fog as a midfielder, is that he doesn't have the quick hands required. He reads the ball well enough and can get his hand on it, but his one and only move is to try and bulldoze the tackling opponent. That simply isn't going to work often enough.
He also lacks the evasiveness to avoid the tackler.
If he wants to play as a mid, then we need to develop his ability to give a quick handball, or to get ball to boot quicker. Both are far too slow for an inside mid.

If he can develop these areas, then it could work. But right now, trying to pick the ball up and barge his way through is going to end up in more HTB decisions than clearances.

 

[Vader]

Nah, mate, you're losing credibility with that kind of hyperbole.
(Edit: for starters, Fog is a better mark on a lead when our mids are ON, and can pot goals from 45-55m out. Himmelberg has hands of concrete and can barely kick 40m, sprays too many gettable shots at goal)

You're right.. 10x is an exaggeration. Even so, Himmelberg has consistently outperformed Fogarty at AFL level.

It is abundantly clear that Fogarty has the greater potential, but it remains a frustratingly unfulfilled potential. Himmelberg is far more "blue collar", is less talented, has "concrete hands", and a poor goal kicking technique, which I believe will limit his future at the AFL level. Even so, at this early stage in their career, Himmelberg has the runs on the board compared with Fogarty.

Consider the following stats:

	Himmelberg	Fogarty
Games Played	20	27
Disposals per game	9.62	8.04
Games < 10 Disposals	11 (55%)	20 (74%)
Marks per game	3.24	2.89
Goals per game	0.95	1.07
Behinds per game	0.76	0.18
Scoring Shots per game	1.71	1.25
0 Goal games	7 (35%)	9 (33%)
2+ Goal games	6 (30%)	7 (26%)
0 Score games	1 (5%)	6 (22%)

sources:
https://afltables.com/afl/stats/players/E/Elliott_Himmelberg.html
https://afltables.com/afl/stats/players/D/Darcy_Fogarty.html
** I have excluded Fogarty's game vs GWS, where he was the non-activated sub.

Himmelberg has more scoring shots, more disposals, more marks, and goes MIA in games less often (games with < 10 disposals). The only area where Fogarty has him covered is in goals scored - due to his elite goal scoring accuracy (which I have never questioned).

Even with his "hands of concrete", he still takes more marks than Fogarty - because he gets to so many more contests. Even with his poor kicking technique, there's still only 0.12 goals per game between them, and Himmelberg hits the scoreboard more often, failing to score only once to date.

Fogarty's problem is that he just doesn't get involved in enough contests. He doesn't get enough of the pill, consistently enough, to have a consistent impact on games in which he's selected. Yes, he has the ability to kick accurately from long ranges and wide angles - and yes, this is an important "point of difference" - but he doesn't do it often enough to justify his selection.

If Fogarty had Himmelberg's work rate, then he would be a gun player. If Himmelberg had Fogarty's right boot, then he would be a gun player. Sadly, what we have in reality, is one unfulfilled potential and one decidedly blue collar forward/ruck.

 

[CrowBloke]

Forward line just isnt working at the moment. Change it up. McAdam, Berg and Rowe out. Newchurch, Fog and Sloane in, TT and Fog to rotate mid time.

The forwards depend upon supply from the mids/wingmen and running half-backs and have been starved the last 3 weeks of decent ball.
Even so, McAdam and Rowe have contributed least in terms of crumbing, second efforts, and defensive pressure.