Preview Changes: Round 11 vs GWS

[Vader]

Card stamped?

Pretty much.

 

[Golumless]

I don’t disagree with you. But I’m still asking, who the **** we gonna pick from SANFL side? A bunch of 0 game players?

All that's left is Murphy, and Himmelberg for this season.

 

[GreyCrow]

I don’t disagree with you. But I’m still asking, who the **** we gonna pick from SANFL side? A bunch of 0 game players?

Sometimes its not who you bring in but who goes out for them. If you drop a 3 game player to bring in a 0 game player it makes no sense in a developmental sense. But if you drop a 180-220 game player then it sends a message.

 

[Elite Crow]

Have we seen Hamptons card stamped? Fair enough if so.



Yeah, it's probably a season or two too early for that, seeing I have him being an A grade mid around 2021.

I'm kinda half ready to write off 2019 and just focus on 2021 onwards, I've lost a fair bit of trust in our 28+ year old group.

I’m not confident Galluci will ever an an A grade mid. At this stage I’d take a B.

The issue is due to losing players below our plus 28 year olds, if we don’t have a crack in 2019, we won’t be having a crack for a number of years until the next crop come through.

 

[Vader]

I expect he'll be delisted at the end of the year, but players have managed to save their spot on a list from worse positions before. It's unlikely, but stranger things have happened.

CEY has saved his position, by being more than competent and performing when required. Hampton hasn't gone close to doing that.

 

[Crow till I die]

And that's the exact same mistake the club is making. Only looking at the positives and just waving off the negatives "Oh, that's not like us", "That's not how we want to play". When the same negatives keep coming up again and again you can't just ignore it. What does it take? Do we need to have non-efforts for a month in a row before it's something they think is a problem? Just because it only happens occasionally doesn't make it any less of an issue.

I know where you are coming from but it is hard to expect perfection when you don't have your best kit on the park. Our last few years has seen steady improvement with the odd bad performance. I think that the club is on the right track. Compare things now with the ayres years or the sanderson years after 2012

 

[Golumless]

I’m not confident Galluci will ever an an A grade mid. At this stage I’d take a B.

The issue is due to losing players below our plus 28 year olds, if we don’t have a crack in 2019, we won’t be having a crack for a number of years until the next crop come through.

I'm quite confident he will as there is a lot to his game that'll translate very well to the position, and he showed an ability to learn how to accumulate last season (You don't hit 20 disposals as a predominately small forward without a lot of potential in this area). There is a possibility he ends up suffering the same problems Douglas ran into with his career though, seeing how similar they are though.

On that, I disagree. We could easily set up for 2021 to be the start of an assault seeing by then a lot of the 2018 draftees are in their third season which is usually the step up point. Defense is still very settled (seeing our oldest defender would be 29-30 by that period), and we already have the key forwards we're going to build around. The only real weakness is midfield and we have ample time to circumvent that.

 

[Crow till I die]

All that matters is the "L" everything else is an excuse

Sure..but do you think the club has a god given right to win every game they play especially without their best kit on the park?

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Did you not watch the Collingwood game?

That was bad but Sunday we had no fight , looked demoralised and unhappy to be out there

That was a picture of being completely demoralised and I blame the injury management to some degree for the mental state of the players right now

 

[FR0GGY]

I miss McLeod and stiffy

Those two words go together very well.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

I'm quite confident he will as there is a lot to his game that'll translate very well to the position, and he showed an ability to learn how to accumulate last season (You don't hit 20 disposals as a predominately small forward without a lot of potential in this area). There is a possibility he ends up suffering the same problems Douglas ran into with his career though, seeing how similar they are though.

On that, I disagree. We could easily set up for 2021 to be the start of an assault seeing by then a lot of the 2018 draftees are in their third season which is usually the step up point. Defense is still very settled (seeing our oldest defender would be 29-30 by that period), and we already have the key forwards we're going to build around. The only real weakness is midfield and we have ample time to circumvent that.

Galluci has so many more athletic traits than Douglas it's not funny

But he's an athlete playing football whereas Douglas is a footballer without the stand out athletic traits to allow him to be much better than what he is

Nevertheless despite his criticism Dougy has carved out a very nice career

 

[Jeffcrowe]

All that's left is Murphy, and Himmelberg for this season.

Have you seen Himmelberg play ?

He's a player of great potential but a big lanky giraffe that is still a way off

 

[Jeffcrowe]

I'm quite confident he will as there is a lot to his game that'll translate very well to the position, and he showed an ability to learn how to accumulate last season (You don't hit 20 disposals as a predominately small forward without a lot of potential in this area). There is a possibility he ends up suffering the same problems Douglas ran into with his career though, seeing how similar they are though.

On that, I disagree. We could easily set up for 2021 to be the start of an assault seeing by then a lot of the 2018 draftees are in their third season which is usually the step up point. Defense is still very settled (seeing our oldest defender would be 29-30 by that period), and we already have the key forwards we're going to build around. The only real weakness is midfield and we have ample time to circumvent that.

Small goalkicking forwards and pressure forwards are also a massive weakness when you take out Betts

 

[FR0GGY]

Will Luke Brown wear a helmet this week?

I did laugh at this

 

[Golumless]

Galluci has so many more athletic traits than Douglas it's not funny

But he's an athlete playing football whereas Douglas is a footballer without the stand out athletic traits to allow him to be much better than what he is

Nevertheless despite his criticism Dougy has carved out a very nice career

Gallucci does possess a high skill level, and has shown in his short career that he has a decently good football brain (which is shown by how good his vision is in particular). Once he gets up to speed as a midfielder at AFL level (1 more preseason), you'll be decently surprised at how well he's suited to an in/out role. After all athletic traits are huge positives to have as a midfielder.

Dougy has carved a nice career, but one that could have been more; seeing he always stepped up when we were struggling. I'm willing to chalk it to mismanagement and then bad luck with injuries (that testicle injury pretty much killed his golden patch) then any issues on his end though.

 

[Golumless]

Have you seen Himmelberg play ?

He's a player of great potential but a big lanky giraffe that is still a way off

A couple of times, but i'm more thinking who is left that we'd use and Himmelberg is really it for forward depth now that hasn't been selected.

Small goalkicking forwards and pressure forwards are also a massive weakness when you take out Betts

I'm not sure if that's as much of a weakness as you make out. Murphy is definitely one piece of the puzzle, Knight if he gets fit is another.

It's really the case of draft one or two more with top end defensive traits (and ideally some skill, which is doable seeing usually permanent small forwards tend to slide like crazy), and it should be ok.

 

[dylan123]

Yeah, it's probably a season or two too early for that, seeing I have him being an A grade mid around 2021.

I'd love to put on the glasses you've been wearing to see Galluci come anywhere close to being an A grade midfielder of the comp from what he's shown so far.

 

[BunjiMac]

Sure..but do you think the club has a god given right to win every game they play especially without their best kit on the park?

Telling yourself that some losses are ok is just building a culture of mediocrity.

I want the players to hurt like hell about each and every loss.

I want them to hate and detest losing no matter what the circumstances.

I want winning to be like an addiction to them where all they think about is the next hit and when they don't have they are physically ill.

 

[Crow till I die]

Telling yourself that some losses are ok is just building a culture of mediocrity.

I want the players to hurt like hell about each and every loss.

I want them to hate and detest losing no matter what the circumstances.

I want winning to be like an addiction to them where all they think about is the next hit and when they don't have they are physically ill.

For sure but you have to be realistic as they are not machines and there are 17 other clubs who expect the same from their players. Take Port in the SANFL prior to the AFL. They were like that but there is a reason they didn't win every game and every flag..because the other clubs like norwood and sturt also were strong and tough to beat. No one accepts a lack of effort but you just have to be realistic on expectations when we are far from full strength

 

[BunjiMac]

For sure but you have to be realistic as they are not machines and there are 17 other clubs who expect the same from their players. Take Port in the SANFL prior to the AFL. They were like that but there is a reason they didn't win every game and every flag..because the other clubs like norwood and sturt also were strong and tough to beat. No one accepts a lack of effort but you just have to be realistic on expectations when we are far from full strength

If any of our players enters any game, without the mindset of expecting to win, then they should leave the club.

Am I being clear?

 

[Jack is Back]

We have to win on Sunday to keep our season alive. I expect that we will play fewer KIDS this week since not one of Fogarty, Gallucci, Poholke or Murphy have had a really influential game this year.

Providing all 26 players named are “fit”, I expect O’Brien, Poholke and two out of Fogarty, Gallucci and Murphy to miss out. The #Vaderlist says ROB, Poholke, Otten and Murphy will miss. Will we change our selection procedures?

 

[Crow till I die]

If any of our players enters any game, without the mindset of expecting to win, then they should leave the club.

Am I being clear?

Do you really think they don't go out there to win..really?

 

[FantasticShirt]

Sometimes its not who you bring in but who goes out for them. If you drop a 3 game player to bring in a 0 game player it makes no sense in a developmental sense. But if you drop a 180-220 game player then it sends a message.

So who are your ins and outs? Keeping in mind this is still a team that could push top 4-6 if we get players back from injury, so throwing the GWS game isn’t an option. We need to field a team that can win.

It’s hard to even pick our worst from Melbourne game but I’ll have a go and also try replace them with someone marginally in form in the SANFL.

Mackay out for Seedsman
Poholke out Murphy
Jacobs out for O’Brien

Then....

Kelly out for Cheney?
CEY/Douglas out for Wilson?
Hartigan out for Otten?
Atkins out for Edwards?

 

[Mismatched]

Personally I see no benefit in us scraping into the 8 if we’ve got injuries, we won’t win it and we will just get a shittier draft pick. So then if Sloane goes we have 2 quality picks.

But I don’t want to write off 2019 when we’ve still got a quality side. We would need to find a player or two. Pity Galluci won’t be an A grade mid, if he was quality 3 years in he could provide a decent contribution. With Smith back, we would also need Milera to become a mid.

On one hand I tend to agree with you.

Last year seemed to take a lot out of us, and to an extent it feels like the way the loss went down traumatized us. It was kind of like all the shit the players had put up with in the last few years had led to that moment and we failed. I’m talking the death of Bailey and then Walsh, the sacking of Sando, the Tippett departure, the loss of Dangerfield, multiple players struck down by appendicitis, the knee injury to Smith on the eve of the GF...

We’d done so well to be where we were, but then the GF finally broke us. The side was then battered from pillar to boost in the media, Lever left and dragged us through the mud, then Charlie left. Teague and Pods left. The side has seems very much burned out and functioning off fumes. Still good enough to play some decent footy, but struggling when genuinely challenged.

We almost need a down year, a reboot of such, where the players finish the season early, then get an extra 4-5 weeks of preseason to prepare. A bad year might also force a few tougher decisions to be made and a few hard truths to be realized. Send a few guys off for surgery before the season finishes so they’re tip top from the get go. Now that’s without even factoring in draft position.

On the flip side, it’s a really tough year to read. Richmond aren’t unbeatable, especially away from home, West Coast also haven’t beaten anyone of note outside of WA. Melbourne are up now, but can they sustain it? They flopped massively last year. Sydney have had some horrible losses at home. Geelong are similarly struggling, GWS are in danger of missing finals. Port are Port.

If we were to get our injuries right come August/September, I feel we’d be every chance of giving the premiership a red hot shot. Trouble is, I’m not sure “just making finals and hoping for a miracle” is the way to go.

Either way, I think without trying too hard, we’ll find ourselves in finals. As bad as we were on Sunday, if we run at 50% for the rest of the year, we finish with 12 wins and make finals, 11 would probably be enough too.

 

[GreyCrow]

So who are your ins and outs? Keeping in mind this is still a team that could push top 4-6 if we get players back from injury, so throwing the GWS game isn’t an option. We need to field a team that can win.

It’s hard to even pick our worst from Melbourne game but I’ll have a go and also try replace them with someone marginally in form in the SANFL.

Mackay out for Seedsman
Poholke out Murphy
Jacobs out for O’Brien

Then....

Kelly out for Cheney?
CEY/Douglas out for Wilson?
Hartigan out for Otten?
Atkins out for Edwards?

Jacobs and Mackay do me.

Mackay for that balls up. Sure mistakes happen but it was a bad one. Sends the message to the group that some mistakes can cost you plenty. Jacobs for the rest and recovery.

As you suggest its about needing to win so making too many changes becomes counter-productive.