List Mgmt. List Management Discussion for 2021

[dermott]

Our midfield should be much better than it is with the ball winning talent that is in there.

We still need to strengthen it with some pace and polish, but I think we also need to have a good look at the direction they’re receiving from the coaches box because the way we’ve folded at the centre bounce for long stretches in games is deplorable.

Agreed. With emphasis on pace, polish AND versatility.

 

[Blackhawk42]

Agreed. With emphasis on pace, polish AND versatility.

All it takes is a Moneyball trade for a current midfielder with a bit of class (that's why Lipinski and Narkle keep being mentioned) plus a Sonsie/Callaghan type in the draft and suddenly that dynamic is added instantly.

 

[Billyc]

All it takes is a Moneyball trade for a current midfielder with a bit of class (that's why Lipinski and Narkle keep being mentioned) plus a Sonsie/Callaghan type in the draft and suddenly that dynamic is added instantly.

The hopeful thing is that young midfielders can have an immediate or early impact. We need to pile up picks and nail a couple guns and the midfield can quickly improve. Hopefully Newcombe can be the first injection to help us

 

[H00t]

Hardwick’s a good player. Getting a lot of the ball as part of our high possession rebound game. He’s tough and never takes a backward step.

Only thing he struggles with is speed. It means he can find it challenging on the really speedy forwards (Papley last year). Unfortunately it’s a problem throughout our team with Moore, Morrison, Greaves etc. good players but limited by foot speed. Especially as the speed is vital nowadays.

Hardwick and Greaves as our back pockets especially is concerning. Will be opened up by quicker teams

 

[dermott]

All it takes is a Moneyball trade for a current midfielder with a bit of class (that's why Lipinski and Narkle keep being mentioned) plus a Sonsie/Callaghan type in the draft and suddenly that dynamic is added instantly.

I am optimistic that over the next two drafts we have the opportunity of adding the required talent. Unfortunately we may experience a bit of pain in losses during the rebuild but without pain, no gain.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

All it takes is a Moneyball trade for a current midfielder with a bit of class (that's why Lipinski and Narkle keep being mentioned) plus a Sonsie/Callaghan type in the draft and suddenly that dynamic is added instantly.

The Narkle opportunity is gone and I’m not sure that Lipinski really adds class.

 

[Blackhawk42]

The Narkle opportunity is gone and I’m not sure that Lipinski really adds class.

Cleaner disposal at least.

 

[Suntory Boss Coffee]

We really are a slow team. Only last years draft have we shown to draft quick players. Will take a bit of turnover

 

[Rocket72]

No he hasn’t - that wasn’t the point. The point is there’s a reasonable jump between being a solid player in a middle of road side vs a contributer in a flag side. As solid/good as Hardwick has been he probably still wouldn’t get a game in Richmond’s backline or maybe Melbourne’s either. Is not saying at all Hardwick isnt any good, is more an example of the contenders having genuinely good players across the park and the talent level we need to aim for.

oh right, not sure about that. I suspect he’d get a game if he was there. A club with established players in his position would not trade for him of course. I obviously rate him higher, that’s fine.

 

[Walshawk]

I wouldn't give him one for the simple fact it gifts him life membership for 10 years service, how shambolic if he survives 10 years on your list.

Pretty sure life membership is 150 games.

 

[Rocket72]

Pretty sure life membership is 150 games.

You are both right:


Criteria for Life Membership
The Constitution currently provides for Life Membership to be granted to Directors with 9 years’ or any player who has completed 10 years’ service with the Club or 150 senior games with the Club.

 

[Bardo State]

Who is the next parish of the comp? Wrong position or bad coaching who could explode in their proper role. Sparkle narkle is another one doing it at the moment who was available last year. Ideas?

I see Dylan Stephens, Jordan Clark, Rhylee West and Jeremy Sharp as good candidates for what Hawthorn needs right now.

Tom Berry is being played as a small forward for Brisbane despite coming through as a midfielder and defender. Their midfield depth is great and he's competing with some other good smalls so he's in and out. Him along with Constable, Brodie and Fiorini are other options that could do better at another club and would be good depth but aren't the 'classy' types I'd be hoping for.

And it's a year too early, but I'm definitely keeping an eye on Fraser Rosman. I really like him and he'll struggle to crack that Melbourne side in the next 2 seasons.

 

[CHUBBSS]

I see Dylan Stephens, Jordan Clark, Rhylee West and Jeremy Sharp as good candidates for what Hawthorn needs right now.

Tom Berry is being played as a small forward for Brisbane despite coming through as a midfielder and defender. Their midfield depth is great and he's competing with some other good smalls so he's in and out. Him along with Constable, Brodie and Fiorini are other options that could do better at another club and would be good depth but aren't the 'classy' types I'd be hoping for.

And it's a year too early, but I'm definitely keeping an eye on Fraser Rosman. I really like him and he'll struggle to crack that Melbourne side in the next 2 seasons.

If we could berry I would be wrapped

 

[burner1]

Carlton keep playing stocker as a defender- which he’s not very good at. If we are retooling our midfield is worth a look as was rated as a junior mid.

 

[Brant]

Is it true that Edwards would go very early in national draft if not taken in MSD? Heard that today

Probably not 'very early'.

He's a developing FF/Ruck with heaps of potential - exactly what MSD & Rookie Lists are for.

I think he still probs goes 1st Round, but not Top 5. A lot of NAB footy + Championships still to come though - lots could happen.

 

[Brant]

As a rebuilding side that has been bottom 4 for two years now and has the least effective midfield in the competition, the misuse and stunted development of Worpel has been our biggest coaching failure. The determination to persevere with what obviously doesn’t work in the midfield is extremely frustrating. The Mitchell/JOM/Shiels led midfield has taken us to 17th. It has been a complete failure and needs a reset. Start by giving the one proven young midfielder we have the role he had in his second season when he won the B&F.

If our objective was to win a many games as possible in 2021 & we saw 2021 in isolation, then maybe.

But it isn't & we don't.

As you started, we're a rebuilding side - building toward 2023/2024. Stands to reason that we want our players to hit their potential in those years & beyond - not now.

So spending time developing Worpel's game so that he's ready for 2023/4 makes perfect sense.

We're likely to have JO'M (C), Wingard, Worpel, at least 2x 1st Round Picks (2021 + 2022) in the midfield by then, with any combo of Tom Mitchell, Howe, some 2nd Round draftees, Scrimshaw/Day, whomever we trade in (incl. FA), guys like Newcome & some small forwards in Brockman to rotate through. Our number of contributing mids will likely get back to ~10 when we're contending again, which means EVERYONE needs to be able to rest elsewhere.

I reckon your focus on Worpel playing HFF is short-sighted.

 

[Teamwork Talks]

Our midfield should be much better than it is with the ball winning talent that is in there.

We still need to strengthen it with some pace and polish, but I think we also need to have a good look at the direction they’re receiving from the coaches box because the way we’ve folded at the centre bounce for long stretches in games is deplorable.

You not a fan of Bolton, SYL?

 

[HODGEYROAD]

Pretty sure life membership is 150 games.

That or 10 years service can see it awarded, Shoenmakers got it for 10 years service for eg.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

I wonder if we’ll have another look at Connor Blakely.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

You not a fan of Bolton, SYL?

Not a fan of how our midfield has performed as we should be much better with some of the ball winning talent we have in there, and without knowing exactly what the instructions are or the roles of each player are, I think the way in which we’ve been almost noncompetitive for large periods during games has to be at least addressed by the coach of that area, and rectified.

That it is a reoccurring theme most weeks is a major concern.

 

[play2win]

Do players picked up in the MSD effectively become unrestricted FA when their initial contract ends?

 

[Blackhawk42]

I wonder if we’ll have another look at Connor Blakely.

I hope not. I'm not exactly sure what he would offer to our list that would improve it.

 

[The Spirit of Cricket]

I wonder if we’ll have another look at Connor Blakely.

to be honest I reckon he's like Tom Phillips but substantially worse

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

to be honest I reckon he's like Tom Phillips but substantially worse

Better disposal, more inside, doesn’t get it as much.

Was probably vying for the list spot Phillips ultimately took.

 

[rei154]

Do players picked up in the MSD effectively become unrestricted FA when their initial contract ends?

I think so, which means Moyle could come to us regardless depending on the contract offer.