Review Round 3, 2021 vs West Coast

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bomberclifford

Importer/Exporter
Sep 2, 2005
28,192
84,643
Cerebral Cortex
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Other Teams
Port Adelaide Magpies
The umpires don't want defenders having an arm around at any point in a marking contest.

Our players need to get better at this. It's a simple fix - just don't do it.
That’s the thing though, Aliir didn’t do it. Ryan stepped into him, grabbed his arm, held it to his chest, and then got the free.

It’s no different to Shuey lifting his arm to force a high tackle.
 

chickentendies

Club Legend
Mar 26, 2017
1,828
6,914
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Hey everyone, I have some fun cool coaching facts for you all

Coaches that have been a senior coach for 7 or more years out of the current coaches without making a GF
- Ken Hinkley (Now coached 8 full seasons, into his 9th currently)

Coaches that have:
- Leon Cameron (L1)
- John Longmire (W1)
- Nathan Buckley (L1)
- Chris Scott (W1 L1)
- Alistair Clarkson (W4 L1)
- Damien Hardwick (W3)
- Luke Beveridge (W1)
- Adam Simpson (W1)

More cool facts
- Lyon is criticized significantly for losing premierships, but at least he took the Saints to a GF twice and Freo once in 8 years.
- Rodney ******* Eade, a coach who pisses mediocrity, at least got the Swans there once.
- Ken Hinkley (coached 172 games has now overtaken Neil Crag (coached 168 games) and will soon overtake Brad Scott for most games without making a GF.

Terry Wallace holds the title - with 240 games without making a GF. Hinkley, once his contract ends if this trajectory continues, will narrowly miss this record. I challenge you to find any supporter who believes Terry Wallace was a good coach.
The only good argument I've seen so far is that Damien Hardwick did so in 8 years and honestly it's pretty weak because that's one coach out of so many who show more than that by this point.
 

JUSTWORK

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 25, 2013
13,276
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I think everyone else just assumed that you would work out those obvious alternatives for yourself.

On what basis does he deserve 2 more years if he fails again in 2021?

Why don't other clubs (even the basket cases) endure a lack of success for so long?

10 years with no flags does not deserve more years at a club that claims it "exists to win premierships"

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He has had more than his fair share of chances.

This year should be his last chance.
 

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RussellEbertHandball

Flick pass expert
Nov 16, 2004
65,050
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Not as much red for Ports as I thought there would be but plenty of white average to below average but not 30% below average type outcomes. 2nd half fightback obviously helped. Obviously plenty of green for WCE.

X score its the first time we haven't been in front this year when comparing both teams outcome
Port Xscore 68 v Actual 71....... 40 inside 50's, 17 shots, scored 11.5 inc a rushed behind, Rozee takes ball thru.
WCE Xscore 91 v Actual 108 .... 57 inside 50's, 28 shots for 16.12 inc a rushed behind at start of 2nd qtr.

Marks inside 50 we took 9 and WCE took 15. We kicked 6.1 they kicked 11.3
Marshall 3 for 2.1
Fantasia 3 for 2.0 + a centering ball that Marshall end up soccering thru
Gray..... 2 for 1.0 + 1 didn't score
Drew.... 1 for 1.0

Frees I50 for us 3 Georgi and Robbie kicked a goal, Wines was 48m out and didn't score. WCE 3, Darling kicked a goal and other 2 didn't score.

Nit Nat got 26 Hit outs for 12 to advantage ie 46% normal for main ruckman is about 35%-40%. It was those taps into space where the Eagles mids that were the first to run onto them that was the real killer. Lycett 24 HO and 9 to advantage ie 37.5%.

Looked up the stats on AFL website, here is the link that comes out after I sorted the data after 3 games

Nick Nat has attend 166 ruck contests won 88, win % 53%, Hit out to advantage 37 out of 88 HOAdv % = 42%
Lycett has attend 143 ruck contests won 78, win % 54.5%, Hit out to advantage 28 out of 78 HOAdv % = 35.9%

So last night's main rucks
Nick Nat attend 46, win 26 ie 56.5%, HOA 12 HOAdv % 46.2%
Lycett... attend 52, win 24 ie 46.2%, HOA 9 HOAdv % 37.5%
was pretty standard sort of night and it was our mids who were flat footed and asleep and made the advantage Nick Nat gave them, look greater than it actually was.


Thanks again Garibaldi Red for the digital version of Champion Data tables.

1617595814621.png


1617596064777.png
 

Pickett4GOAT

Debutant
May 27, 2020
126
332
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
I think everyone else just assumed that you would work out those obvious alternatives for yourself.

On what basis does he deserve 2 more years if he fails again in 2021?

Why don't other clubs (even the basket cases) endure a lack of success for so long?

10 years with no flags does not deserve more years at a club that claims it "exists to win premierships"

On SM-G960F using
BigFooty.com mobile app
On the basis that when you bring in another coach you have to start all over again in terms of building relationships and determining a suitable game style. On the basis that changing the coach doesn't guarantee you a premiership. This is not England. Port Adelaide don't have unlimited reserves of cash they can throw at manager after manager looking for immediate success. I probably didn't work out those obvious alternatives because in my mind they slow down our chances of winning a premiership rather than speeding it up.
 

Enviable Tradition

Professional Procrastinator
Oct 12, 2007
20,935
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On the basis that when you bring in another coach you have to start all over again in terms of building relationships and determining a suitable game style. On the basis that changing the coach doesn't guarantee you a premiership. This is not England. Port Adelaide don't have unlimited reserves of cash they can throw at manager after manager looking for immediate success. I probably didn't work out those obvious alternatives because in my mind they slow down our chances of winning a premiership rather than speeding it up.
That argument only holds water if we are on our way to winning a premiership.

If we don't win one this year, after 10 years under Ken, then it is impossible to argue that we are IMO.

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BigFooty.com mobile app
 

Portology

Cheap, fast, safe: pick two, or juggle three.
Sep 27, 2007
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That wrap around free against Aliir was bullshit.
Ryan grabbed his arm and held it to his chest.
Bit later, Georgiades gets basically the same one paid his way. Mitch a tad more subtle than Ryan in holding onto the tackler's wrap around arm - lets it go a nanosecond before ump blows the whistle.
 

GremioPower

Taking notes of policy re: bikini/lingerie images
May 26, 2017
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Thank you for offering solutions rather than problems. I think Ken deserves to have his contract honoured and if we haven't won a premiership by the end of 2023, we unequivocally move on.
Mate, this speech would be great in 2017; but that was 4 years ago.
 

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sobrave

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 15, 2015
15,847
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42° south
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Hey everyone, I have some fun cool coaching facts for you all

Coaches that have been a senior coach for 7 or more years out of the current coaches without making a GF
- Ken Hinkley (Now coached 8 full seasons, into his 9th currently)

Coaches that have:
- Leon Cameron (L1)
- John Longmire (W1)
- Nathan Buckley (L1)
- Chris Scott (W1 L1)
- Alistair Clarkson (W4 L1)
- Damien Hardwick (W3)
- Luke Beveridge (W1)
- Adam Simpson (W1)

More cool facts
- Lyon is criticized significantly for losing premierships, but at least he took the Saints to a GF twice and Freo once in 8 years.
- Rodney ******* Eade, a coach who pisses mediocrity, at least got the Swans there once.
- Ken Hinkley (coached 172 games has now overtaken Neil Crag (coached 168 games) and will soon overtake Brad Scott for most games without making a GF.

Terry Wallace holds the title - with 240 games without making a GF. Hinkley, once his contract ends if this trajectory continues, will narrowly miss this record. I challenge you to find any supporter who believes Terry Wallace was a good coach.
The only good argument I've seen so far is that Damien Hardwick did so in 8 years and honestly it's pretty weak because that's one coach out of so many who show more than that by this point.
you forgot big bill stephen

Most games coached without reaching a grand final in afl/vfl history:
1. Bill Stephen
2. Terry Wallace
3. Brad Scott
4. Ken Hinkley
 

sobrave

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 15, 2015
15,847
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42° south
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Port Adelaide
With the 6 month maximum payout rule having been brought in, we absolutely should be moving Hinkley on if we don't make the 8 this year. We arguably should be doing so if we don't make a prelim.
flag or bust. he can probably have another year if we make the gf.

another prelim loss is not a pass and anything lower should result in a sack hinkley.

we have zero injuries, and probably near the last hurrah of a few (boak, gray, big dixie, hartlett is already cooked)
 

Pickett4GOAT

Debutant
May 27, 2020
126
332
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Mate, this speech would be great in 2017; but that was 4 years ago.
We were closer under Hinkley than we ever have been last year. If anything 2017 would have been a far more fitting time to part ways. Why stop now that we have a genuine chance of winning the premiership? I just try to temper my frustration with the team on individual performances as every team has bad days. Also, over the past 12 months the team and coaching staff have proved enough times that deserve to be trusted for the rest of this year at least. If we revert back to 2018-19 form this year, a change will have to be made.
 

RussellEbertHandball

Flick pass expert
Nov 16, 2004
65,050
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AFL Club
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1. Beaten in the contest, beaten on the scoreboard
After the disappointing performance, Port coach Ken Hinkley said his side was a good side when it played its game, built on hunt, aggression and pressure on the ball. But much of that was missing in Perth when Port went down in some of the key indicators. Port lost the contested possession battle 152-135 and gave West Coast too much time to possess the ball uncontested, finishing down 270-211. Despite being just down 32-30 in the hit-outs, Port was smashed in the clearances 41-27 including 19-10 out of the centre. Those numbers translated to the scoreboard with the Eagles’ 57 inside 50s to 40 proving telling.

In Rucci's Monday Review.

At half-time, even with Scott Lycett winning the hit-out count 14-13 on Naitanui, West Coast's midfielders had a 23-13 advantage on clearances, 9-4 at centre. The most-telling note from this dominance was Port Adelaide having just 19 inside-50 entries [WCE 32] and most of these built up from rebound at half-back rather than with dynamic run from inside the centre square. [CP 1/2 time Port down 89-67 and UP down 140-97]
 

Daylight2nd

Debutant
Mar 6, 2011
98
138
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Not as much red for Ports as I thought there would be but plenty of white average to below average but not 30% below average type outcomes. 2nd half fightback obviously helped. Obviously plenty of green for WCE.

X score its the first time we haven't been in front this year when comparing both teams outcome
Port Xscore 68 v Actual 71....... 40 inside 50's, 17 shots, scored 11.5 inc a rushed behind, Rozee takes ball thru.
WCE Xscore 91 v Actual 108 .... 57 inside 50's, 28 shots for 16.12 inc a rushed behind at start of 2nd qtr.

Marks inside 50 we took 9 and WCE took 15. We kicked 6.1 they kicked 11.3
Marshall 3 for 2.1
Fantasia 3 for 2.0 + a centering ball that Marshall end up soccering thru
Gray..... 2 for 1.0 + 1 didn't score
Drew.... 1 for 1.0

Frees I50 for us 3 Georgi and Robbie kicked a goal, Wines was 48m out and didn't score. WCE 3, Darling kicked a goal and other 2 didn't score.

Nit Nat got 26 Hit outs for 12 to advantage ie 46% normal for main ruckman is about 35%-40%. It was those taps into space where the Eagles mids that were the first to run onto them that was the real killer. Lycett 24 HO and 9 to advantage ie 37.5%.

Looked up the stats on AFL website, here is the link that comes out after I sorted the data after 3 games

Nick Nat has attend 166 ruck contests won 88, win % 53%, Hit out to advantage 37 out of 88 HOAdv % = 42%
Lycett has attend 143 ruck contests won 78, win % 54.5%, Hit out to advantage 28 out of 78 HOAdv % = 35.9%

So last night's main rucks
Nick Nat attend 46, win 26 ie 56.5%, HOA 12 HOAdv % 46.2%
Lycett... attend 52, win 24 ie 46.2%, HOA 9 HOAdv % 37.5%
was pretty standard sort of night and it was our mids who were flat footed and asleep and made the advantage Nick Nat gave them, look greater than it actually was.


Thanks again Garibaldi Red for the digital version of Champion Data tables.

View attachment 1094378

View attachment 1094384
Some interesting analysis but the Nic Nat factor was more than the quantity of his hit outs. It was the way he hunted the ball/player immediately afterwards, and generally contributed to Port being panicky and rushed. Also the relative quality of his hitouts v Lycett or Ladhams made it very difficult for Port's mids who admittedly seemed slow to adjust. Credit to Lycett for never giving in though. Ladhams has a day to forget and coaches agreed - got only about 63% game time. Will be very surprised if picked this week.
 

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