Prediction Team: R1 2023

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whattagun07

whattagun07

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May 8, 2007
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Assuming no injuries, name your starting 22 for Round 1 2023.

Add in the players you think we will recruit

Leave out the players we will cut/trade or who will exercise their FA rights.

Round 1, 2023

FB Doedee Butts Worrell

HB Hinge Murray Laird

C Dawson Berry Cook

HF Keays Walker Rachele

FF Rankine Fogarty McAdam

R Thilthorpe Schoenberg Soligo

INT Smith Gollant Milera Parnell

EMG Taylor Hamill Hately Jones Pedlar McHenry


Tall Def: Butts and Murray are the incumbents. They need another season playing together. Although I'm not the biggest Murray fan, he has upside, and could definitely fit into a 'system'. Showed great intensity as a chop out ruck, and could evne swing forward given his pre-AFL experience. I'm keeping Frampton on the list as depth height and flexibility, but he doesn't make the Emergencies. Worrell takes the 3rd tall role, and can be used on a dangerous marking small-med forward if required (Toby Greene, Jamie Elliott)

Small/Med Def: Doedee (VC) is freed up to play his more natural role. He can float in and take uncontested marks. He needs to be our Tom Stewart. Laird returns to his AA role to free up space for development of our young mid. Lairdy still pinch hits in the middle. Hinge to be the main distributer from def 50, and given license to take risk going back into the corridor on the 45. Milera provides support off the bench as an attacking HBF/distributor.

Wings: Our best player needs to stay away from Def 50, and start leading our team in i50s. Cook needs to be blooded in this position, get him fit as f*** in the off season and encourage him to study Ed Langdon's game.

Mids: Out with the old, in with the nucleus. Berry is our best mid besides Laird, but needs to become our leader and heart and soul mid moving forward. Soligo and Schoenberg given first crack as followers. The days of Laird, Crouch, Keays, Sloane as first choice mids are over. Sloane retired, Crouch traded, and Laird and Keays given other primary roles. Rotating through the middle depending on the week will be Rachele, Rankine, Keays, Laird, Hately, Taylor, Pedlar.

Tall Fwd: Fog, Tex with McAdam as the flying third. Thilthorpe to drift forward and expose oppo rucks. Hopefully we can draft a 197cm plus Key Forward to develop.

Small Fwd: Rachele and Rankine are the silk, x-factors that we have been longing for in the forward line. Keays will play the defensive forward role better than McHenry, and has greater ability to hit the scoreboard. He can be our new Joe-the-goose with his elite tank. Milera is banned from playing as a small forward. If he doesn't make it as a HBF/Wing, he is out. Taylor and Pedlar as pinch hitters / backups as they develop their midfield game.

Best of the rest: The bench is lead by Smith, Gollant, Milera, Parnell, with heat coming from Jones, Hately, Hamill, Pedlar, Taylor and i guess McHenry.

Who's not there? Rowe/Murphy (they've had their chances. Trade, delist or SANFL / 26-36 type players). I could easily have McHenry in this group.
McAsey - delist
Borlase - delist
Turner - delist
Davis - delist
Seedsman - retired
Brown - traded/delist/FA whatever
Himmelberg - traded
Sholl - traded
Crouch - traded
ROB - traded (pipe-dream i know)
Strauchan - break glass
Frampton - break glass
Sloane - rehab then SANFL - retire end of 2023
McPherson - contracted for 1 more year. SANFL all year then delist

Still developing: Nankervis, Newchurch

Recruit needs - developing KPF (197cm+), developing KPD (with size), young developing ruck, Max Michelanney as developing 3rd tall/intercept, outside/skillful players with speed.

I'd look at the delisted FA pool closely, and see if we can snag another value player like we did with Keays.

Maybe i'm jumping the gun on ROB, but I really think he's f***ing useless. No point sticking with him at his age given our current trajectory. Just means we need RT to step up, and get a decent chop from Tex and Murray.

Have a crack!!!
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Like your 22. Just changed positions. I want to have our future A+ Graders starting in the guts

FB Parnell Butts Worrell

HB Doedee Murray Laird

C Hinge Dawson Soligo

HF Keays Walker Cook

FF Gollant Fogarty McAdam

R Thilthorpe Rankine Rachele

INT Smith Schoenberg Milera Berry
 

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crows dude said:
Like your 22. Just changed positions. I want to have our future A+ Graders starting in the guts

FB Parnell Butts Worrell

HB Doedee Murray Laird

C Hinge Dawson Soligo

HF Keays Walker Cook

FF Gollant Fogarty McAdam

R Thilthorpe Rankine Rachele

INT Smith Schoenberg Milera Berry
Click to expand...

I thought it was solid that Laird said this week he would play back when the call came, he enjoys the midfield and with the young guys but.

I think he'll rotate through the mid for a couple more years first though.

On SM-F926B using BigFooty.com mobile app
 
B: Doedee - Butts - Hamill
HB: Smith - Murray - Worrell
C: Soligo - Schoenberg - Dawson
HF: McAdam - Walker - Rachele
F: Rankine - Fogarty - Thilthorpe
R: O’Brien - Laird - Berry
Int: Milera - Taylor - Keays - Hinge

Sub: Cook

Emg (from): Jones, Murphy, McHenry, Parnell, Gollant, Pedlar, Himmelberg (if not traded), Strachan, Sholl (if not traded), Nankervis, Newchurch, Michalanney, + our first pick in this year’s draft + a genuine key defender who we will inevitably pick up via the draft or trade this offseason

Seedsman comes straight into the 22 if we can get him fit, at the expense of Taylor, who slides to sub.

If Hamill’s ongoing concussions cause him trouble, Jones comes straight in for him.

Anyone not listed is either delisted, traded or irrelevant.
 
Right now, I'd go:

B: Josh Worrell, Jordon Butts, Tom Doedee
HB: Brodie Smith, Nick Murray, Patrick Parnell
C: Jordan Dawson, Rory Laird, Jake Soligo
HF: Josh Rachele, Darcy Fogarty, Izak Rankine
F: Shane McAdam, Taylor Walker, Riley Thilthorpe
R: Reilly O'Brien, Ben Keays, Sam Berry
I/C: Harry Schoenberg, Will Hamill, Mitch Hinge, Ned McHenry

The ones that would be on the edge:
  • Schoenberg - I really like what he brings at his best, but he's starting to look gassed. He needs a big pre-season to get to the next level, otherwise others, such as Taylor or even Pedlar, could go past him at a rate of knots
  • Ned - really only in the side as we lack forward pressure otherwise, but we need to find an upgrade here soon, I think. Sloane could come into this role as a pressure forward once he is fit
  • Smith - super inconsistent these days, and if he regresses even more next year, we could see a re-shuffle that puts Hinge into the backline and Milera on a wing (who is probably the unluckiest player to not be in the 22). Turning 31 next year, so not exactly a surprise if he does regress, but we have to plan for life after Smith soon, I reckon

If Seed's fit (doubt it), he probably comes in for Ned, with Soligo moving to full-time midfield, Keays spending most time forward and Ned or Schoenberg goes out. Milera unlucky too, as stated above
 
B: Worrell, Butts, Doedee

HB: Smith, Murray, Milera

C: Dawson, Berry, Hinge

HF: Keays, Walker, Fogarty

F: Rankine, Thilthorpe, McAdam

R: O’Brien, Rachele, Laird

I: Soligo, Parnell, Schoenberg, Cook, Pedlar (sub)



Need opportunity: Gollant, Nankervis, Taylor, whoever we draft



Depth: Frampton, Jones, Hately, Strachan, Murphy, Brown, McHenry



Irrelevant: McPherson, McAsey



Trade: Himmelberg, Sholl, Crouch, Newchurch



Delist: Davis, Turner, Borlase, Rowe



Retire: Seedsman, Sloane, Hamill
 
B: Parnell Butts Worrell
HB: Smith Murray Doedee
C: Hinge Soligo Dawson
HF: Rankine Tex McAdam
F: Rachelle Fog RT

F: ROB Berry Laird

I/C: Milera, Keays, Schoenberg, Cook

Now I expect Sloane and McHenry to be selected, but look at my forward line, where does McHenry fit? He’s not keeping Rankine, Rachelle or McAdam out of the team, if he is Nicks is an idiot.

I’d expect also Sloane would replace Cook and Keays might get centre and Soligo is on the bench but both moves would be a mistake
 
Seems likely we recruit Rankine and I think Taylor might get into the team by the start of next year, so based on that my best guess is something like this:

B: Doedee Butts Worrell
HB: Dawson Murray Smith
C: Soligo Keays Hinge
HF: McHenry Walker Rachele
F: Rankine Fogarty McAdam
R: ROB Laird Berry

I/C: Thilthorpe Milera Taylor Jones
Sub: Pedlar

Definitely have some serious competition for places at inside mid, wing and half back. Keays might spend time up forward, but probably not that much with Rachele, Rankine and McHenry all around the side. Also not sure if Doedee, Worrell, Butts and Murray will really all be selected together that much.
 
NSolis said:
Seems likely we recruit Rankine and I think Taylor might get into the team by the start of next year, so based on that my best guess is something like this:

B: Doedee Butts Worrell
HB: Dawson Murray Smith
C: Soligo Keays Hinge
HF: McHenry Walker Rachele
F: Rankine Fogarty McAdam
R: ROB Laird Berry

I/C: Thilthorpe Milera Taylor Jones
Sub: Pedlar

Definitely have some serious competition for places at inside mid, wing and half back. Keays might spend time up forward, but probably not that much with Rachele, Rankine and McHenry all around the side. Also not sure if Doedee, Worrell, Butts and Murray will really all be selected together that much.
Click to expand...
I don’t know if Nicks will do it, but Keays is a massive upgrade on McHenry as a defensive forward/high half forward. Better ball winner, bigger and stronger, smarter runner, arguably tackles more effectively, and will hit the scoreboard more regularly.
 
We've had a few players who looked promising at the back end of a season regress in the pecking order over summer.

And conversely - some who seemed to be on the outer that have worked their way back in.

Eg
Cook & Berry fall back from end of 2021 to start of 2022
Himmelberg overtakes Thilthorpe by Round 2 2022
Frampton in up forward 2021
Etc

You hope young players who have ended 2022 strongly - Soligo, Berry, Fogarty, Hinge, Worrell - continue to build and hit the ground running in 2023. But it's no guarantee.

It feels like the development and evolution of our line up regresses over summer. Takes us half a season or longer to rediscover things we already know.
 
Soggy2112 said:
I don’t know if Nicks will do it, but Keays is a massive upgrade on McHenry as a defensive forward/high half forward. Better ball winner, bigger and stronger, smarter runner, arguably tackles more effectively, and will hit the scoreboard more regularly.
Click to expand...
Broadly agree, but Keays is also an effective midfielder who has had a lot of success in that role for us in the past. One thing I am pretty confident of is that we will not go in next year with a forward made up of some combination of Walker, Fogarty, TT, McAdam, Rachele, Rankine, Milera without a defensive half forward type. So I think we'll see either McHenry or Keays in that role.

Not to say Rachele couldn't play a role like that but probably not in his second season.
 

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NSolis said:
Broadly agree, but Keays is also an effective midfielder who has had a lot of success in that role for us in the past. One thing I am pretty confident of is that we will not go in next year with a forward made up of some combination of Walker, Fogarty, TT, McAdam, Rachele, Rankine, Milera without a defensive half forward type. So I think we'll see either McHenry or Keays in that role.

Not to say Rachele couldn't play a role like that but probably not in his second season.
Click to expand...
I agree Keays is effective in the midfield and I’m sure we’ll see him in there from time to time, particularly if Laird gets injured. But half forward should be his main role next season, Berry and Laird are better than him at providing that inside grunt and Keays does not have the skills to best complement them in the midfield IMO.
 
Soggy2112 said:
B: Worrell, Butts, Doedee

HB: Smith, Murray, Milera

C: Dawson, Berry, Hinge

HF: Keays, Walker, Fogarty

F: Rankine, Thilthorpe, McAdam

R: O’Brien, Rachele, Laird

I: Soligo, Parnell, Schoenberg, Cook, Pedlar (sub)



Need opportunity: Gollant, Nankervis, Taylor, whoever we draft



Depth: Frampton, Jones, Hately, Strachan, Murphy, Brown, McHenry



Irrelevant: McPherson, McAsey



Trade: Himmelberg, Sholl, Crouch, Newchurch



Delist: Davis, Turner, Borlase, Rowe



Retire: Seedsman, Sloane, Hamill
Click to expand...
The call on Newchurch is too early, he is showing real improvement. We need to see him in the league team surrounded by better ball users.
We've put too much development time into him not to reap the benefits. You could be right but keeping on the list another year costs nothing and he certainly has talent.
 
I’m finally more positive we can start to improve coming off super low expectations this year and last year

Need a few things to go out way however including draft / trade period and injuries

Like the fact we can build a deeper midfield going forward

B Parnell Murray Doedee
HB Smith Butts Worrall
C Dawson Laird Rankine
HF Soligo Tex Keays
F Thilthorpe Fogarty Rachele
1R ROB Berry Schoenberg
I/C Milera McAdam (Jones or Ned) Hinge
Sub Taylor

Seeing a deeper midfield with Laird Schoenberg Berry + Dawson , Rankine , Rachele , Soligo , Keays , Hinge , Jones all going through wing or centre square roles at times

I’d make Murray the no 1 shut down defender for the most dangerous forward and train Butts to be a touch more offensive in the air to go for his marks

Smith spot in side looks shaky if he keeps dishing out inconsistency

I’m bullish on Taylor over Cook and Pedlar but hope all can pressure the selectors

Thilthorpe I want 50/50 ruck : forward as I think he’s a potentially freakish ruck

Not sure what to do with ROB but he starts season
 
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adelaidecrows said:
Why do people have Borlase being delisted? big man, only 2nd year into career next year and requires time to develop. Bit harsh I would have thought.
Click to expand...
Yeah. I’ve seen enough in the sanfl to keep persisting with. He also looks like one of those naturally strong people. He could end up being quite solid
 
LC40 said:
The call on Newchurch is too early, he is showing real improvement. We need to see him in the league team surrounded by better ball users.
We've put too much development time into him not to reap the benefits. You could be right but keeping on the list another year costs nothing and he certainly has talent.
Click to expand...
It’s not that I necessarily want him gone, he obviously has talent and we should have given him a game weeks ago.

However, if he’s not gonna get picked ahead of Murphy and McHenry I don’t see him getting a game with Rankine and Rachele in the side. Might as well trade him for a pick and get someone who plays a position that we might actually use.
 
Soggy2112 said:
It’s not that I necessarily want him gone, he obviously has talent and we should have given him a game weeks ago.

However, if he’s not gonna get picked ahead of Murphy and McHenry I don’t see him getting a game with Rankine and Rachele in the side. Might as well trade him for a pick and get someone who plays a position that we might actually use.
Click to expand...
See I actually think he has the talent to be picked ahead of both Murphy and McHenry.

True he might not be selected before Richelle but Rankine as yet isn't on our squad.
If Rankine does join us there are always injuries and loss of form.
Newchurch may also find a rich vein of form as he matures.
I do know that to climb the premiership ladder we'll have to improve in multiple positions (we are currently 15th).
Our half forward flankers definitely need an upgrade if we are totally honest. McHenry and Murphy will still be in the squad but you can only go so far with triers.
Newchurch plays their position.

As for trading him, he's an unknown commodity so what pick do we get for him, a 4th or 5th rounder?
It's rinse and repeat, we need to put two years into the next draftee before they're ready to be considered to play.
The Crows have already committed two years into Newchurch, if he is ready to blossom it should be in the next few years.

I don't know if Newchurch will be a regular league player but I like the improvement in his game.
He is a good decision maker, unselfish, has speed and agility and is a good user of the ball....all good traits.
There are plenty of players I would trade on our list but Newchurch isn't one of them.
Just keep him until we know what we've got.
 
LC40 said:
See I actually think he has the talent to be picked ahead of both Murphy and McHenry.
Click to expand...

I agree.

Coaches don’t seem to though, and he’s OOC, we need points for Michalanney presumably, so hence I put him in the trade category.

I would by no means be disappointed if we signed him on a one year deal, he’s definitely worth persisting with.
 
LC40 said:
See I actually think he has the talent to be picked ahead of both Murphy and McHenry.

True he might not be selected before Richelle but Rankine as yet isn't on our squad.
If Rankine does join us there are always injuries and loss of form.
Newchurch may also find a rich vein of form as he matures.
I do know that to climb the premiership ladder we'll have to improve in multiple positions (we are currently 15th).
Our half forward flankers definitely need an upgrade if we are totally honest. McHenry and Murphy will still be in the squad but you can only go so far with triers.
Newchurch plays their position.

As for trading him, he's an unknown commodity so what pick do we get for him, a 4th or 5th rounder?
It's rinse and repeat, we need to put two years into the next draftee before they're ready to be considered to play.
The Crows have already committed two years into Newchurch, if he is ready to blossom it should be in the next few years.

I don't know if Newchurch will be a regular league player but I like the improvement in his game.
He is a good decision maker, unselfish, has speed and agility and is a good user of the ball....all good traits.
There are plenty of players I would trade on our list but Newchurch isn't one of them.
Just keep him until we know what we've got.
Click to expand...

Absolutely, you can't go any higher then winning a premiership, and it's guaranteed there will always be a few triers who end up doing a role on the cheap in a premiership year, no matter the club. We do live in a salary capped league after all.

Really, the only thing that matters with a player like McHenry/Murphy is you're getting value for money, and we probably are if they're cheap, seeing they're replacement level forwards.
 
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