Traded Jake Carlisle [traded w/ #23 and #44 for #5, #24 and Craig Bird]

[Defacto]

Actually my point was about the use of the PSD.

No you said a player should expect their club gets a reasonable deal. Did you not say that?

 

[Sweet Jesus]

No you said a player should expect their club gets a reasonable deal. Did you not say that?

Rather than putting them in a position where they have to shaft their old club by entering the draft.

Are we going to play a game where you only acknowledge the first half of a sentence and pretend the second half doesn't exist?

As I said, my point was about the use of the PSD. The link is right there.

You can complain about the Cripps deal but the fact remains a deal got done. It is therefore not pertinent to my comments about the use of the PSD.

 

[dee64]

Its late but Beams was contracted and if Carlisle was contracted we wouldn't have chased him
Dawes and Clark well Stkilda is not Melbourne and your on shaky ground when you use Melbourne for and draft/trade example
Judd the best player in a generation every team would have payed any contract in PSD
Wellingham would have been drafted on his early form and if Essendon was talking about pick 18 not pick 5 I wouldn't have anything to say pick 24 plus player or 3rd is much closer to 18 then 5
now back to the Socceroos

Yeah right. You blokes gave up pick 13 for Tom Hickey and pick 12 for Tom Lee. Are they still on your list? Clark was a good trade if not for injury, and Dawes has given us more than Hickey and Lee.

St. Kilda supporters are all smug now just because Carlisle has nominated them ahead of Carlton as his club of choice.

 

[Defacto]

Rather than putting them in a position where they have to shaft their old club by entering the draft.

As I said, my point was about the use of the PSD.

Are we going to play a game where you only acknowledge the first half of a sentence and pretend the second half doesn't exist?

You said it not me. Dont blame me for your s**t poor use of words...

Anyways here comes the back peddle

So any trade that does not end in the PSD is reasonable?

Was the cripps trade reasonable?

 

[RoundCubic]

Also Seb and Hickey are not Fringe
On the PSD interstate teams would not force him to move as it would effect his output and make him not worth the money they have to match.
Carlton have said they can't afford him
Essendon can't pay part of the contract because its a new contract not the trading of a current contract.
If Essendon redrafted him the AFL board would freak out and I would expect that it would go to court and with the ASADA stuff he would win
Only Carlton changing their mind would be a problem and I would think they might expect a friendly agreement would be reached (maybe we don't draft Rice or next trade to them is friendlier) because they can't afford him or he would of nominated them.

 

[Sweet Jesus]

Here comes the back peddle

How is it a back pedal when I have directed you several times to my original statement?

That's the opposite of a back pedal.

So any trade that does not end in the PSD is reasonable?

Was the cripps trade reasonable?

There's always going to be a side who thinks they got the s**t end of the stick.

Again, this has nothing to do with my statement about the use of the PSD. Please explain to me how it is connected.

 

[Defacto]

How is it a back pedal when I have directed you several times to my original statement?

That's the opposite of a back pedal.

There's always going to be a side who thinks they got the s**t end of the stick.

Again, this has nothing to do with my statement about the use of the PSD. Please explain to me how it is connected.

Mate youre already conceding...

See my previous post

Did the saints get the rough end of the stick?

 

[Sweet Jesus]

Mate youre already conceding...

By repeating my original point? That's a funny kind of conceding.

Perhaps if you've forgotten the point I was actually making. Which would be remarkable, since I've directed you back to it several times.

The Saints may well feel they got a raw deal for Cripps, even though he was a fringe player with 16 games under his belt.

Either way, it doesn't have anything to do with my point about the use of the PSD. Because Cripps didn't go in the PSD.

 

[Defacto]

Only if you've forgotten the point I was actually making. Which would be remarkable, since I've directed you back to it several times.

The Saints may well feel they got a raw deal for Cripps, even though he was a fringe player with 16 games under his belt.

Either way, it doesn't have anything to do with my point about the use of the PSD. Because Cripps didn't go in the PSD.

I didnt ask you what the saints think. I am asking you what you think...

Are you able to directly answer a question?

 

[Sweet Jesus]

I didnt ask you what the saints think. I am asking you what you think...

It's turned out to be a clear win for WC but at the time I could take it or leave it.

Are you able to directly answer a question?

My view of the Cripps trade isn't relevant to the point at hand, which is about the use of the PSD i.e. not a trade.

 

[Defacto]

It's turned out to be a clear win for WC but at the time I could take it or leave it.

My view of the Cripps trade isn't relevant to the point at hand, which is about the use of the PSD.

So the answer to my last question is no

 

[Sweet Jesus]

So the answer to my last question is no

I answered your question but also stipulated (explained again) that it's not relevant to my initial comments about the PSD.

As long as you understand that it's a tangent.

 

[RoundCubic]

Yeah right. You blokes gave up pick 13 for Tom Hickey and pick 12 for Tom Lee. Are they still on your list? Clark was a good trade if not for injury, and Dawes has given us more than Hickey and Lee.

StKilda supporters are all smug now just because Carlisle has nominated them ahead of Carlton as his club of choice.

I agree shocking apparently Watters wanted Tom Lee and fought with the draft team and won to get him to us probably partly why he was sacked. That was one of the worst draft year (and they say this year is shallow) Viney was a F/S and dodgy deal and if Grundy didn't slide the Hickey trade would of looked good.

 

[RoundCubic]

I answered your question but also stipulated (explained again) that it's not relevant to my initial comments about the PSD.

As long as you understand that it's a tangent.

And my point is people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones
WC built its team on the threat of getting home sick WA players home using the PSD to speed up its rebuild
Saints are gonna do the same with disgruntled players maybe more problematic but the same idea

 

[Smalls0304]

Also Seb and Hickey are not Fringe
On the PSD interstate teams would not force him to move as it would effect his output and make him not worth the money they have to match.
Carlton have said they can't afford him
Essendon can't pay part of the contract because its a new contract not the trading of a current contract.
If Essendon redrafted him the AFL board would freak out and I would expect that it would go to court and with the ASADA stuff he would win
Only Carlton changing their mind would be a problem and I would think they might expect a friendly agreement would be reached (maybe we don't draft Rice or next trade to them is friendlier) because they can't afford him or he would of nominated them.

Ross & Hickey are fringe players. Youre not going to play longer hickey rooey mccartin & bruce. Hickey is on the outer. Ross has played 30 something games in 4 years.
When did we say we couldnt afford him? If he falls PSD we will take him. You dont think Judd, Carrazzo, Hendo, Yarran, probably bell and warnocks contract finally over frees up a bit? But nah we could be super friends and promise not to for friendly trades after.. be real pls

 

[Juicison]

Youre not going to play longer hickey rooey mccartin & bruce. Hickey is on the outer

Yeah we're not, however we will play at some point next year (if they are still on the list) Longer, Hickey, Rooey & Bruce.

Secondly on all this PSD talk can we remember back a few years when Tippett got walked to the last pick in the PSD because no club was willing to pay his asking price. If Carlisle puts his asking price at his front ended contract being offered by St kilda no other team will take hom

 

[BOMBERS 4 LIFE!!!!]

Second round+Seb Ross lol.

Players like Seb Ross and Tom Hickey cant get a bloody game at St.Kilda what makes you think they'll get one at Essendon? They will be nothing but list cloggers.

 

[Axcellence]

The sub rule is dead, resulting in 2 ruckman being played again. Interchanges may reduce as well.

Hickey will come in and be the 2nd ruckman who can actually play forward. If you see the from that game against bulldogs, it was he who laid a f50 tackle on murphy resulting in a goal for us. A ruckman who can lay a F50 tackle and is good below his knees is a good get.

 

[Ricmel]

Essendon can choose to send him to the draft and get nothing and he's off to Carlton.

That is the very definition of leverage. One outcome is very bad for one party. Ultimately they will want to avoid that outcome.

 

[HighettBomber]

That is the very definition of leverage. One outcome is very bad for one party. Ultimately they will want to avoid that outcome.

It's not really that bad an outcome considering some of the players that look like going into the preseason draft. Carlton very well might not take him if Aish or Treloar were there. Your position isn't that good, if you want him you will have to pay and there is no way you will get him without giving up a first round pick or a player of similar value.

 

[Verdun]

Wow there are some very surprised posters here. St Kilda have been nominated by two players as their club of choice that does not mean it's supporters are 'smug' it means the club is in a strong bargaining position this is a concept a lot of other clubs supporters can not get their head around.

I repeat the two players have nominated the Saints, bottom line this means the club is now has the upper hand how it plays out now will be interesting.

I do not believe a direct swap for pick 5 for JCarlisle is the best outcome for the Saints and I have faith in Bains and the rest of the list management team to work it.

The Saints have drafted extremely well over the last 2-3 years and been patient with their young players like Acres, Hickey and McKenzie this indicates the club is being run very well and gives supporters faith in the direction the club is headed. For other clubs supporters to start lecturing on how the club should manage it's list is extremely hypocritical - ask yourself how you want your club to manage the situation when a player nominates YOUR club?

 

[Verdun]

It's not really that bad an outcome considering some of the players that look like going into the preseason draft. Carlton very well might not take him if Aish or Treloar were there. Your position isn't that good, if you want him you will have to pay and there is no way you will get him without giving up a first round pick or a player of similar value.

This post highlights what I'm talking about

 

[toxic]

It's not really that bad an outcome considering some of the players that look like going into the preseason draft. Carlton very well might not take him if Aish or Treloar were there. Your position isn't that good, if you want him you will have to pay and there is no way you will get him without giving up a first round pick or a player of similar value.

Treloar and Aish trades will be done

Pick 5 for Carlisle will NOT occur

If saints secure another 1st rounder lower down the chain, say a 12 or 14 then that would probably be part of the deal

 

[Roadto2018]

Yeah right. You blokes gave up pick 13 for Tom Hickey and pick 12 for Tom Lee. Are they still on your list? Clark was a good trade if not for injury, and Dawes has given us more than Hickey and Lee.

St. Kilda supporters are all smug now just because Carlisle has nominated them ahead of Carlton as his club of choice.

Agree on the Lee trade although we did get decent picks in return, still on the list though, but the hickey trade was by no means a bad one, got decent picks in return again and he has the potential to be one of the most dangerous ruck/forwards going around, great dukes, would be our number 1 ruckman if he didn't get injured last year allowing longer to overtake him

 

[Roadto2018]

Here is a tip for all you expert St Kilda supporters - stop embarrassing your fellow knowledgable Saints fans with the garbage you are posting in this thread. Especially Defacto.

Every reasonable person knows that pick 5 will be involved. This may involve the Saints getting later picks back, but it is a fair and equitable trade for both parties. Essendon loses a gun CHB, Saints gain a gun CHB - pay the price to get the gun. You already are $$$ wise.

Every reasonable supporter would rather not get Carlisle at all than give up pick 5 for him directly, absolutely if traded for 2 later picks I'd do that, so would every saints fan, but pick 5 straight, with all that goes against Essendon being the power position, is just not going to happen. Midfielders are more required for us at the minute, and we can always draft and develop another key defender. Personally I don't see how two second rounders isn't fair given the circumstances, or a second and Ross, and we do rate Ross.