1st Test Australia v India, Dec 17-21 at the Adelaide Oval

[Jinglebells32]

The huge amount of draws in the 70s and 80s suggests those pitches weren't minefields.

Bat faces haven't changed.

Today's attacking mindset is more likely to lead to dismissals than the defence first attitude of the 70s and 80s.

The big disadvantage for today's bowlers is the thicker bats and short boundaries mean top edges are more likely to fly for six, but on the other side of the coin bigger boundaries meant the ground in earlier times was harder to defend against 1s, 2s or 3s. Let's also not forget how much better fielders are now.

I love Cummins, but let's not get carried away. He's bowling beautifully for his era, just like Lillee did.

Lillie's bowling of Viv at the end of the day at the MCG, in 1981 I think, to have the Windies 4/10 closed out the best day of test cricket I've seen.

After Kim Hughes made one of the gutsiest 100's ever made.

 

[Southerntakeover]

Break it down to the most exaggerated example possible.

Say you're a bowler and you have a couple of fast bowling team mates who average a wicket per over.

Do you think that is going to make it tougher to take wickets yourself?

Depends upon other variables like how many overs he's likely to bowl, and how long the game goes. If he bowls one over, then there's likely to be nine on offer. The other bowlers are not necessarily taking more wickets than back in the day.

And no, the fall of wickets at the other end more rapidly does not necessarily make it tougher to take wickets yourself: it means you rarely have to bowl to set batsman and break partnerships. It's not sensible to speak of the lost opportunity to dismiss established batsman when there is no actual guarantee that they be dismissed at all.

It's more sensible to think about that when it comes to the tail end really. It's not being able to come in and sweep up the fat at the end of the innings that does it. People don't 'miss out' on the opportunity to dismiss established upper order batsman in the usual course.

In actuality the person who left more wickets on the table than anyone else was probably McGrath: it was not uncommon for him to do the heavy lifting and remove the best batsman / upper order and watch someone else take the tail: highest percentage of upper order batsman of the modern greats. Of course, he benefited from Warne as a partnership breaker as well.

Glenn McGrath Was A Giant Killer | Cricket Web

www.cricketweb.net

If there's an argument for Cummings, it's not in base strike rates. That's a foolish analysis that misses part of the bigger picture: batting orders are more prone to collapse, and do their business faster because of trend changes in the game. Bowlers generally bowl less overs: there are far fewer drawn tests. That doesn't mean that there's more or less competition for the wickets per se. We see less dogged defensive work being conducted, both because of a lower capability and because of changes in the approach to batting spawned by t20 cricket. That can mean smaller strike rates. It's probably more so in something I suspect to be the case: that Starc feasts on the tail at a higher percentage than other bowlers.

 

[Southerntakeover]

I get your drift, but the hypothetical you propose is extreme, doncha think?
In 3 overs, apart from the 3 wicket-taking balls, all of the others'd be clobbered for 6, ==> 3/90
(although ... if the wickets were Pujara, Kohli and Rahane, maybe Paine would take that?? )

He was responding to an extremely unrealistic example- a wicket every over.

 

[CrowBloke]

He was responding to an extremely unrealistic example- a wicket every over.

Fair enough.
I was being light-hearted.

 

[CrowBloke]

It's probably more so in something I suspect to be the case: that Starc feasts on the tail at a higher percentage than other bowlers.

Really good post.
I tried to find the stats site that I used a while ago to show that Starc actually dismisses more #1-6 batsmen, than 7-11.
Can't find it, sorry (it's not cricinfo, has yellow pages from memory). I think Starc gets more attention as a tailend mopper-upper because those late inswinging yorkers are trademark-Starc, memorable.

Whether he takes more tail-end wickets at a higher % than other bowlers would probably be on the same site. Can anyone help, please?

 

[PhatBoy]

Really good post.
I tried to find the stats site that I used a while ago to show that Starc actually dismisses more #1-6 batsmen, than 7-11.
Can't find it, sorry (it's not cricinfo, has yellow pages from memory). I think Starc gets more attention as a tailend mopper-upper because those late inswinging yorkers are trademark-Starc, memorable.

Whether he takes more tail-end wickets at a higher % than other bowlers would probably be on the same site. Can anyone help, please?

percentage of bowler's wickets taken from batsmen 7-11:

Mitch Starc - 31.5
Nathan Lyon - 32.5
Pat Cummins - 26
Josh Hazlewood - 25.9

 

[Perth bloke]

Really good post.
I tried to find the stats site that I used a while ago to show that Starc actually dismisses more #1-6 batsmen, than 7-11.
Can't find it, sorry (it's not cricinfo, has yellow pages from memory). I think Starc gets more attention as a tailend mopper-upper because those late inswinging yorkers are trademark-Starc, memorable.

Whether he takes more tail-end wickets at a higher % than other bowlers would probably be on the same site. Can anyone help, please?

couldn't agree more.. When Starc gets those late swinging yorkers right it's like watching an artist at work

 

[philreich]

Interesting trivia there with no batsman getting to double figures but with the final wicket retired.

That last occurred the year the Gold Coast Suns made the finals.

 

[RohitSharma]

Merry Christmas my Australian fans, may you get all the happiness in the world.

 

[CrowBloke]

Merry Christmas my Australian fans, may you get all the happiness in the world.

Thank you.
Best wishes for your happiness and a better 2021 for all BF posters, their families and friends!

 

[Burtonsgottago]

Just checked in on the score.... Bye Bye Burns

 

[11kgm]

We won't need you ever again

 

[Pippen94]

percentage of bowler's wickets taken from batsmen 7-11:

Mitch Starc - 31.5
Nathan Lyon - 32.5
Pat Cummins - 26
Josh Hazlewood - 25.9

What % does Lyon get because tailender throws bats at ball because Starc working them over with short ball at other end??

 

[rocker_oz33]

Those feilding highlights...LoL..