I don't hate Moore but I can see how some would not really like him as a personality and the same goes for Grundy.
Nobody appeals to everyone.
Training 2022 Training Reports and General Club Updates
- Thread starter Jen2310
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Nobody appeals to everyone.
Scodog10
Brownlow Medallist
There’s an interesting topic! It got me thinking whether there’s a leadership void league wide?
Running through the clubs and from 2021 most are approaching or over 30 (Sloane, Zorko, Pendles, Heppell, Fyfe, Selwood, McEvoy, Gawn, Boak, Cotchin, Parker, Ziebell and Shuey). I realise that captains are usually mid to late career when they get the gig, but that seems an old cohort.
Digging deeper and Brisbane with Starcevic and Port with Wines are the only clubs that appear to have obvious replacements (I could be missing some though) with GWS and us potentially replacing ours with guys from the 2011 draft so 29 this year. Is it a generational stage for the game or just a quirk?
Yeah, you're right. People need to stop complaining about the contract. He's a very good ruckman
sr36
Hall of Famer
I think that older captains will continue, as with more complex game plans, the on field role has shifted balance from predominantly inspirational towards instructional, so experience and knowledge is more important than it was.
sr36
Hall of Famer
Where those stats are useful is that rather than the "connection" issue which many talk about, or the criticism of Grundy that many carry on with, those stats point to an issue either with ground level personnel or with strategy. I think it's been a combination of both.
Grundy was a revelation early in his career as a first ruck who was just about a ruck rover as well.
Then the opposition strategy boys got their sht together and simply blocked the ground at his feet.
Up till this last coaching change we still haven't dealt with that and are paying the price at stoppages and centre square hitouts.
Glad to hear he is practicing different hitouts.
- Jul 2, 2017
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It's a very good question Sco. I would add Doedee at Adelaide and Brayshaw at Freo as captains in waiting. Lever was always touted as a potential captain for the Crows when he was drafted but I'm not sure if he could fill the mantle from Gawn effectively.
My diehard West Coast supporting mate laments the fact that no one seems capable of stepping up in replacement of Shuey long-term.
Scodog10
Brownlow Medallist
I tend to agree. How many people, outside club environments, do you think use hitout stats that way?
It’s where I’m hopeful the influence of McRae/ Bolton/ Leppa can be seen most. McRae with stoppage as a tenet of his coaching, Bolton as the mastermind putting it all together and Leppa in charge of the structure to protect us when it all goes wrong. I think we do a lot of other things well enough to be competitive if we get this right.
I also think personnel will naturally realign if you get the structure right. Take a guy like JT who was a nothing footballer pre and post 2018, but had a breakout year when we got our system right. That might be T Brown or Steele who knows. A bunch of guys at Melbourne will wind up in the same boat.
sr36
Hall of Famer
Not many. I think most cherry pick stats to support their belief, rather than using them to inform. Be it hitouts or any other stat.
- Oct 1, 2012
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Are we training today?
MyManLynch
Brownlow Medallist
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The court appearance live via video link from NYC will be approx 1am Melbourne time?
I hope they don’t catch JDG off guard…in his bath robe…that could be embarrassing.
edit: posted in wrong place…
I hope they don’t catch JDG off guard…in his bath robe…that could be embarrassing.
edit: posted in wrong place…
Last edited:
- Jul 2, 2017
- 8,083
- 15,246
- AFL Club
- Collingwood
He'll be streaming in live from the Albion surely.
Scodog10
Brownlow Medallist
Its the proliferation of stats in general that’s allowed it to creep in, IMO.
I was reading the below article the other day and whilst it’s not so much stat based and more about data it’s the learnings that a laymen can take from it that interest me. To bring it around speed of delivery is akin to a hitout it only tells a small portion of the story and I don’t really care how many times Grundy got first hand to it or whether our mid got first hand to that. What I want to know is where it went (boundary, corridor, forward and back), whether the player that received it for Collingwood got a clean possession from the hitout and what the disposal efficiency was of that clean possession.
Taking Grundy’s numbers under Buckley at a 30% hitout to advantage rate maybe 50% of those resulted in a possession and due to the congestion we might be lucky if 30% of those possessions hit a target. That’s a very small amount resulting in a mark downfield and I guarantee Nic Nat and Gawn go at a much better rate.
Looks fast, feels faster - why the speed gun is only part of the story
Data on release points and trajectory are helping to break down the mysteries of why some bowlers are harder to face than others
makes me wonder if Friday nights will be. Or they are just amping it given next week would be their last week before break 
76woodenspooners
Brownlow Medallist
Training just finished and wasn’t a light session like Wednesday usually ismakes me wonder if Friday nights will be. Or they are just amping it given next week would be their last week before break
Friday’s is a mixed session with the AFLW and will be in front of the parents?
They’ll probably want to take it easy.
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MyManLynch
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I think Friday is a PR exercise.Training just finished and wasn’t a light session like Wednesday usually is
Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
Autograph signing etc, meet the players (except for Jordy).
Membership drive.
With a light run…
TradeDraft
Post-Human
Training just finished and wasn’t a light session like Wednesday usually is
Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com
Be a Practice Game/Match Simulation Friday Night?
TradeDraft
Post-Human
and Need Time for Signing and things for the Fans
sr36
Hall of Famer
As well as the proliferation of stats, it's also that the impact of Grundy's hitout stats or anyone else's other stats is so difficult to quantify. There's just so many variables that impact the effectiveness of stoppage clearances, or the effectiveness of anyone's stats.Its the proliferation of stats in general that’s allowed it to creep in, IMO.
I was reading the below article the other day and whilst it’s not so much stat based and more about data it’s the learnings that a laymen can take from it that interest me. To bring it around speed of delivery is akin to a hitout it only tells a small portion of the story and I don’t really care how many times Grundy got first hand to it or whether our mid got first hand to that. What I want to know is where it went (boundary, corridor, forward and back), whether the player that received it for Collingwood got a clean possession from the hitout and what the disposal efficiency was of that clean possession.
Taking Grundy’s numbers under Buckley at a 30% hitout to advantage rate maybe 50% of those resulted in a possession and due to the congestion we might be lucky if 30% of those possessions hit a target. That’s a very small amount resulting in a mark downfield and I guarantee Nic Nat and Gawn go at a much better rate.
Looks fast, feels faster - why the speed gun is only part of the story
Data on release points and trajectory are helping to break down the mysteries of why some bowlers are harder to face than otherswww.google.com.au
We've become more sophisticated with our reading of stats, but to accurately model football games and the impact of an individual's variables would take statistical genius. And would need to be regularly altered when teams change strategies and plans.
Scodog10
Brownlow Medallist
It wouldn’t be overly difficult given the data would already be there. It would take an investment in computer science (which we already do) and an understanding of the best way to communicate outcomes of that work. The real question is in finding a Sean McVay/ Bryson Dechambeau coach that’s driven by data/ science over instinct. That’s a huge leap of faith because it’ll be a while until someone either works their way through the coaching system with it as a philosophy or comes in externally from the game with data as a tenet. Finally they need a personality to make it all work because you walk into most clubs talking data and the players will look at you like you have two heads.
Jen2310
Moderator
- Thread starter
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Pre-season Week 3. Wednesday Dec 8th.
Usually a lighter session mid-week (as Mon/friday's the big sessions) but that wasn't the case today. Which means Friday being the open session with family and the public, they'll use as the lighter one.
The moment I saw the umpires I thought. Oh, no not a small session this one. First time umpires have come this pre-season. Post christmas we'll see them more as they get into real intense match sim.
They started warming up at 9:15, and probably started just after 9:30, went for a good 2 1/2 hrs. Between drills and match play, the specialized sessions led by coaches, it was a really eventful morning.
Roll call:
1. Lippa
3. IQ
4. Grundy
5. Elliott
6. Tyler B
7. J.Daicos
8. Bianco
9. Noble
11. Keane
12. Wilson
13. Adams
14. Cameron
15. Krueger
17. Cal B
18. Macrae
19. Draper
20. Kelly
21. Ruscoe
22. Sidebottom
23. Roughy
24. Poulter
25. Crisp
26. Reef
27. Murley
28. Murpht
29. McMahon
30. Moore
31. McCreery
32. WHE
34. Chugg
35. N. Daicos
36. Harrison
37. Maynard
38. Howe
39. Begg
41. Mihochek
43. Dean
44. Madgen
46. Cox.
Again, no Henry, Ginnivan or Johnson
Adams clearly has learnt from past seasons where he has gone too hard too fast in the pre-season putting a toll on his body, so this year he seems to be taking a step back and just going at his own pace. Smart.
He did lots of running with Reef and a couple others. Was on the bike and did a couple other things.
Reef did some boxing, running, the bike. The ropes. Not sure what his issue is. Whether he is injured or not.
McMahon, still supporting the short (up to his calves) moonboot, but he was again walking fine, riding the bike and also using the ropes.
J.Daicos, Keane. Madgen also did some running as well.
Drills were focused on:
-Tackling
-Contest work
- Stoppages
- groundballs
Match play.
Specialised sessions for the young midfield grounp including Lippa, Cal, Poulter, Wilson, Tyler, Murley, Macrae. Along with Sidebottom and WHE on the wings I think. Begg and Grundy serviced as the rucks.
Warm up:
Match play:
Midfield.
Specialised work
Usually a lighter session mid-week (as Mon/friday's the big sessions) but that wasn't the case today. Which means Friday being the open session with family and the public, they'll use as the lighter one.
The moment I saw the umpires I thought. Oh, no not a small session this one. First time umpires have come this pre-season. Post christmas we'll see them more as they get into real intense match sim.
They started warming up at 9:15, and probably started just after 9:30, went for a good 2 1/2 hrs. Between drills and match play, the specialized sessions led by coaches, it was a really eventful morning.
Roll call:
1. Lippa
3. IQ
4. Grundy
5. Elliott
6. Tyler B
7. J.Daicos
8. Bianco
9. Noble
11. Keane
12. Wilson
13. Adams
14. Cameron
15. Krueger
17. Cal B
18. Macrae
19. Draper
20. Kelly
21. Ruscoe
22. Sidebottom
23. Roughy
24. Poulter
25. Crisp
26. Reef
27. Murley
28. Murpht
29. McMahon
30. Moore
31. McCreery
32. WHE
34. Chugg
35. N. Daicos
36. Harrison
37. Maynard
38. Howe
39. Begg
41. Mihochek
43. Dean
44. Madgen
46. Cox.
Again, no Henry, Ginnivan or Johnson
Adams clearly has learnt from past seasons where he has gone too hard too fast in the pre-season putting a toll on his body, so this year he seems to be taking a step back and just going at his own pace. Smart.
He did lots of running with Reef and a couple others. Was on the bike and did a couple other things.
Reef did some boxing, running, the bike. The ropes. Not sure what his issue is. Whether he is injured or not.
McMahon, still supporting the short (up to his calves) moonboot, but he was again walking fine, riding the bike and also using the ropes.
J.Daicos, Keane. Madgen also did some running as well.
Drills were focused on:
-Tackling
-Contest work
- Stoppages
- groundballs
Match play.
Specialised sessions for the young midfield grounp including Lippa, Cal, Poulter, Wilson, Tyler, Murley, Macrae. Along with Sidebottom and WHE on the wings I think. Begg and Grundy serviced as the rucks.
Warm up:
Match play:
Midfield.
Specialised work
