Adam Kingsley/Dimma/Richmond/GWS

[HBFlanker]

I think its going under the radar just how much Dimma staying at Richmond for half of this season has stuffed them around.

Kingsley was ltierally there. They knew how good he was going to be in a senior position.

There's an argument to say that Dimma was checked out from the word go this season. It certainly looked that way. If there was an inkling in him that he was going to depart this season, he should have left late last year, and the Tiges would have kept Kingsley.

Sliding doors moment, which could be huge for both clubs over the next few years, considering these clubs are on very different trajectories.

 

[L_W_P]

Hindsight is 20/20 but, just because the Tigers would have liked him to stay, doesn't mean that Kingsley would have been the right choice or even landed the job.

I think Dimma was still 'in' when the season started but, once he realised that Taranto and Hopper weren't going to be the panacea, he decided on the fresh start for everyone.

 

[Purple Suit]

Two different lists so the outcome would have been different anyway. The best coach in the world can't out coach father time.

 

[GastevsBeard]

we can't be mad - we got 3 flags

but also, kinda mad one of Kingsley / McCrae were not part of some form of succession plan

Good to see our sprog all over the league though. Shows that the turnover / smash forward at all costs gameplan is still the best in September if you have the right team chemistry / skillset / buy-in

 

[Danw0w]

Hindsight heroes out in force right now about Richmond.

There's an argument to say that Dimma was checked out from the word go this seseason.

And how would you possibly know this?

 

[HBFlanker]

Hindsight heroes out in force right now about Richmond.

And how would you possibly know this?

Probably due to how bad they were on field.

 

[Danw0w]

Probably due to how bad they were on field.

Oh so he was checked out in 2010, 11, 14, 15 and 16 then? Not bad for a checked out coach to win 3 flags.

 

[banzai]

Two different lists so the outcome would have been different anyway. The best coach in the world can't out coach father time.

This exactly, if Kingsley stayed and took over when Mini did, it's not like we would have been playing finals. Our runs over, need to rebuild.

 

[HBFlanker]

Oh so he was checked out in 2010, 11, 14, 15 and 16 then? Not bad for a checked out coach to win 3 flags.

Nope, but this year he was.

 

[BF Tiger]

Looking forward to the Adem Yze

Adem Yze

Age

46

Ht

187cm

Wt

85kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.2

5star

K

14.4

5star

HB

3.8

3star

M

4.0

4star

T

1.7

4star

No current season stats available

D

5.2

2star

K

3.4

2star

HB

1.8

2star

M

0.6

1star

T

0.6

3star

/Goody/Melbourne/Richmond thread in a year or two.

 

[VinnieB]

Would have made zero difference. Kingsley has plenty of talent at GWS to work with.
Richmond does not have much.

 

[Mr.X]

Looking forward to the Adem Yze/Goody/Melbourne/Richmond thread in a year or two.

Is Yze the front runner for the tigers coaching gig?

 

[BF Tiger]

Is Yze the front runner for the tigers coaching gig?

Some reports have it down to him and McQualter. Possibly just media speculation.

 

[tropicaltiger]

Probably due to how bad they were on field.

stupid comment really every man and his dog thought Richmond was going to make the finals 2/3rds into the season and giants bottom 6.

 

[Caesarr]

Aye, one of Kingsley or Mcrae should’ve been at Richmond. Both were rated extremely high internally as well.

 

[Elmer_Judd]

This exactly, if Kingsley stayed and took over when Mini did, it's not like we would have been playing finals. Our runs over, need to rebuild.

Agreed.

The Hopper trade was a mistake but not one that will haunt Richmond for years imo

Once again the Tigers have to roll up their sleeves and prepare for several years of hard work of drafting and developing young players.

Dylan Grimes, one of the best defenders of the past decade, falling off the cliff alarmingly this season was something unforseen I think.

Hopefully Gibcus (who looked a fine player in his first season) is over his injury concerns and can take his spot in the seniors next year.

By contrast, GWS always had a lot of quality kids and stars and vets on their list, and really underachieved under Leon Cameron. Naturally Adam Kingsley deserves the utmost praise, but it was pretty much a golden opportunity/dream job for any potential new/career coach.

 

[Colonial]

Loads of talent?
Lol everyone had said we had nothing left after last season.
We were picked to be bottom 3.
Cogs lost it in 2019 and never regained it.
Kelly was injury prone.
Greene too all over the shop.
Ward is old.
No key forwards.
Taylor our only good defender.
Green was on his way to the Tigers
HH was out too.
Our youth were all looking for the door.
“Lol Bedford is their big trade in”.

A lot of rewrites going on in this thread.

 

[HTPunter]

Loads of talent?
Lol everyone had said we had nothing left after last season.
We were picked to be bottom 3.
Cogs lost it in 2019 and never regained it.
Kelly was injury prone.
Greene too all over the shop.
Ward is old.
No key forwards.
Taylor our only good defender.
Green was on his way to the Tigers
HH was out too.
Our youth were all looking for the door.
“Lol Bedford is their big trade in”.

A lot of rewrites going on in this thread.

Yes, you do have loads of talent? The problem was how it was utilised and people assumed it would continue to be poorly utilised.

Cogs did lose it - he was dropped for christ sake.
Who was calling Kelly injury prone? Lol.
Ward is old - he’s serviceable but past his best.
Hogan wasn’t even potentially going to kick 40 goals before he got a shithouse Essendon & BZT.
Buckley was left out of your side round 1, until he was a late in.
HH was halfway out the door, he considered some decent offers until late in the season.
Who was criticising Bedford? Everyone could see he had talent and forward pressure was lacking at GWS (and yes, Daniels was probably written off).

Just because there’s been a revitalisation doesn’t mean 1) people were being unfair at the time & 2) that the list isn’t full of talent.

You forgot to add everyone had assumed Whitfield was past it and out the door - and most likely he was, if he didn’t have the right coach. He’s still hugely talented, but quite clearly his last couple of seasons were not prime Whitfield.

 

[juss]

I think its going under the radar just how much Dimma staying at Richmond for half of this season has stuffed them around.

Kingsley was ltierally there. They knew how good he was going to be in a senior position.

There's an argument to say that Dimma was checked out from the word go this season. It certainly looked that way. If there was an inkling in him that he was going to depart this season, he should have left late last year, and the Tiges would have kept Kingsley.

Sliding doors moment, which could be huge for both clubs over the next few years, considering these clubs are on very different trajectories.

There's no guarantee Kingsley would have been the next senior coach of RFC, even if Dimma left earlier.

It might have gone instead to McQualter, Xavier Clarke, or potentially someone like Adam Yze anyway, or a name we haven't even heard.

I don't regret losing Kingsley because you have no idea if he would have been right for RFC. We probably still needed a new voice and ideas which Kingsley is not. It's pretty obvious how much of the Richmond mantra he's brought to GWS. As has McCrae at the Pies.

What we need is something fresh.

 

[Elmer_Judd]

There's no guarantee Kingsley would have been the next senior coach of RFC, even if Dimma left earlier.

It might have gone instead to McQualter, Xavier Clarke, or potentially someone like Adam Yze anyway, or a name we haven't even heard.

I don't regret losing Kingsley because you have no idea if he would have been right for RFC. We probably still needed a new voice and ideas which Kingsley is not. It's pretty obvious how much of the Richmond mantra he's brought to GWS. As has McCrae at the Pies.

What we need is something fresh.

What Richmond needs is a coach who is brutally honest and frank about the current state of the Tigers list and doesn't beat around the bush and give false assurances he can get Richmond back into the final as soon as next year.

Essendon went down that path with Matty Knights and look how that ended up.

Sometimes I wonder if Richmond don't need a new list manager either. Blair Hartley has been great for your club but has been there a while now.

The whole footy department could do with bit of a refresh imo

 

[Colonial]

Yes, you do have loads of talent? The problem was how it was utilised and people assumed it would continue to be poorly utilised.

Cogs did lose it - he was dropped for christ sake.
Who was calling Kelly injury prone? Lol.
Ward is old - he’s serviceable but past his best.
Hogan wasn’t even potentially going to kick 40 goals before he got a shithouse Essendon & BZT.
Buckley was left out of your side round 1, until he was a late in.
HH was halfway out the door, he considered some decent offers until late in the season.
Who was criticising Bedford? Everyone could see he had talent and forward pressure was lacking at GWS (and yes, Daniels was probably written off).

Just because there’s been a revitalisation doesn’t mean 1) people were being unfair at the time & 2) that the list isn’t full of talent.

You forgot to add everyone had assumed Whitfield was past it and out the door - and most likely he was, if he didn’t have the right coach. He’s still hugely talented, but quite clearly his last couple of seasons were not prime Whitfield.

So we are s**t has turned into we have loads of talent?
Because the narrative that the club just can’t be about hard work and culture but the usual “they were gifted all their talent”?

AFL social media is a laugh sometimes.

 

[juss]

So we are s**t has turned into we have loads of talent?
Because the narrative that the club just can’t be about hard work and culture but the usual “they were gifted all their talent”?

AFL social media is a laugh sometimes.

The Giants have always had loads of talent. That much has always been clear with so many top picks and such.

But talent alone doesn't mean success and it takes the off field stuff, coaching and development to bring it together and that's what Kingsley has done

 

[Colonial]

The Giants have always had loads of talent. That much has always been clear with so many top picks and such.

Really? Over the 12 years or so how many of those top picks have gone on to kill it at other clubs? We do have an exodus annually.

But talent alone doesn't mean success and it takes the off field stuff, coaching and development to bring it together and that's what Kingsley has done

Seems other clubs as well considering how many superstars we leak a year in the annual Giants exodus have gone into great things.

About 3 in 12 years really.

 

[juss]

Really? Over the 12 years or so how many of those top picks have gone on to kill it at other clubs? We do have an exodus annually.

Seems other clubs as well considering how many superstars we leak a year in the annual Giants exodus have gone into great things.

About 3 in 12 years really.

It's a pretty continual factory of good talent coming in, sure some leave buy you often get good picks back for them and the cycle continues.

Talent has never been the issue for GWS

 

[Colonial]

It's a pretty continual factory of good talent coming in, sure some leave buy you often get good picks back for them and the cycle continues.

Talent has never been the issue for GWS

But is it unfair talent?

As I’ve said it’s not like the exodus, some? That’s some rewriting there, has been small supposedly if you listen to people on here and in the media. Yet you could say only Cameron, Steel, Adams and maybe Treloar have gone on with it. In 12 years of exodus.

Says to me the whole gifts of copious amounts of talent is rubbish.
Add to that the talk over the last few years of the window shut.
Hmm.