Review Good vs GWS

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DangerSloane

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Two months ago himmelburg had shown absolutely fu**n nothing..

Be fair to say no one saw himmelbergs current form coming.. he showed fu** all in four years even in most of his sanfl matches..
Not true.
He'd always shown glimpses. Just hadnt done moer than about 1 or 2 good things in a game.

consistency is coming though which is good. Its amazing what happens when you give some kids a real run at it.
 
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Mackay has been stiffed here.

Watching the replay again, D Mac turns his body side on and tries to take possession of the ball. He got down as low as humanly possible. There is literally not anything else he could have done.

De Boer placed himself in the most vulnerable position possible. Front on, stooped over, head down. Exactly what you're taught not to do from U/8s upwards.

Mackay didn't go in high, didn't overlook the ball, didn't raise an arm/elbow.
 

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Vader

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Our effort, game plan, fitness and coaching have been the same all year.
Other areas havent really improved. We're still fumbly and our handballing is still average.

Ill take spatial awareness though. we seem to be able to somewhat find a target under pressure much easier.
One you didnt mention which i think is probably as important if not more than all of those is spacing.

We are not committing 3 or 4 numbers to the 1m around the ball any more. We have options out the side and the back which we hadnt had all year.

Minimal missing of obvious easy kicking targets and a ton less interecpt marks from opposition makes us look a lot better side.
It also helps that we've moved beyond "dump kick down the line" as our only method of moving the ball from Defence to Attack. If anything, we forced GWS into playing that way.
 

Mutineer

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This.
Keays' ability to find a gap/evade/get out of traffic is very good. Reminds me of Greenwood but, big plus, is 5 years younger.
Keays has only one real weakness in his game he has no right foot and will always try to run around a player to get on his left when the right play is to go direct by the right boot, don't think I've ever seen him use his right foot. But he has so many positives to his game that's really a minor criticism.
 

CrowBloke

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Probably a combination of things. Time. Better communication. How do you convey your message across a number of small groups (because they can't all train together) and have it mean the same thing at the same time? I reckon Nicks has figured it out.
In bold above, really good point. The changes are significant.
The 4-quarter pressure was especially prominent vs. GWS.
Match-fitness has improved them, too.
 

DangerSloane

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It also helps that we've moved beyond "dump kick down the line" as our only method of moving the ball from Defence to Attack. If anything, we forced GWS into playing that way.
In saying that, we havent changed a lot. We just have guys competing at those contests now down the line. Not being jumped all over or looking at each other thinking 'who is going in the air'

Its amazing what kicks guys can pull off when they have hte balls to go for them. I think we've been looking for those kicks all season, we just havent been capable or confident in making them.

Clean contested takeaways make every other part of the game look easy.
 

DangerSloane

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Keays has only one real weakness in his game he has no right foot and will always try to run around a player to get on his left when the right play is to go direct by the right boot, don't think I've ever seen him use his right foot. But he has so many positives to his game that's really a minor criticism.
I might be wrong but I thought i saw him use it for the first time on Tuesday.
 

LC40

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Several posters have commented similarly.
The Crows of the last 3 weeks do not look as disunited/dispirited/uninterested as the mob getting hammered before that. They're playing with more energy, more intent (Mrouch 12 tackles! vs GWS), and I'd say even with a bit of flair from the new blokes (Keays/Sholl/Hamill/Schoenberg). The improvement in eg Himmelberg (looks and moves less like a praying mantis and more like a good CHF) and McAdam! has been great to watch.
I'd love to know from Nicks and the players what's happened, how and why.
They played youth who are energetic and keen and have revitalised the squad knowing they're not going to get dropped after one game.
 

Scorpus

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Mackay has been stiffed here.

Watching the replay again, D Mac turns his body side on and tries to take possession of the ball. He got down as low as humanly possible. There is literally not anything else he could have done.

De Boer placed himself in the most vulnerable position possible. Front on, stooped over, head down. Exactly what you're taught not to do from U/8s upwards.

Mackay didn't go in high, didn't overlook the ball, didn't raise an arm/elbow.
I thought people were joking when they said Mackay would be suspended for it. I was shocked when the ban came in.
 

adelaidecrows

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Several posters have commented similarly.
The Crows of the last 3 weeks do not look as disunited/dispirited/uninterested as the mob getting hammered before that. They're playing with more energy, more intent (Mrouch 12 tackles! vs GWS), and I'd say even with a bit of flair from the new blokes (Keays/Sholl/Hamill/Schoenberg). The improvement in eg Himmelberg (looks and moves less like a praying mantis and more like a good CHF) and McAdam! has been great to watch.
I'd love to know from Nicks and the players what's happened, how and why.
This is my take.

Nicks did too much to early and may not have sold the message very well at all. I do think he would be the first to admit he would change some things. But he is a first year coach. So I think he can be excused for some mistakes.

The senior players clearly were frustrated and obviously had some issues at the end of last year especially around player movement. It looks like with the younger guys making an impact the senior players are starting to trust the younger players and are responding.

Overall the list isn't as bad as we thought. It's not last by the length of the straight as many experts made out. I believe covid was the blessing in disguise for our club. I believe without covid we would have delivered a frustrating year but won about 6-8 games and we wouldn't have played as many kids and more senior players leave. Only to fall into a pile of crap next year.

Now things have started to click, I can't see a negative in the club. So if that's the case this year even though are ladder position is sh*t its ticked alot of boxes in regards to allowing us to move forward.

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CrowBloke

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Thanks, good reply:
Now things have started to click, I can't see a negative in the club.
... except they still have Chapman/Roo/Hass/Hart to deal with.
(I was calling for Godden's head a month ago, but the mids' improvement has been startlingly good)
 

adelaidecrows

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Thanks, good reply:

... except they still have Chapman/Roo/Hass/Hart to deal with.
(I was calling for Godden's head a month ago, but the mids' improvement has been startlingly good)
Yes but if everything is on the up and things are starting to feel good I am not sure the need for roo to leave is actually valid. Hass would be the only one I have queries about and Chapman is leaving anyway. Once the review is done on this year I would expect some changes. From here based on our improvement and the lack of rumours from internal sources coming from the club I suspect we are on a good place. If we can make ourselves better by employing a better person in key positions that's a given. I'm happy for roo to stay. We need ex players around the inner sanctum helping to drive things. Don't see too many putting their hand up.

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CrowBloke

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I'm happy for roo to stay.
Thanks, good reply.
Bluntly, I'm not.
Loved him as a player (am West Adelaide fan, so I noticed him back then too), great playing career, but his nepotism is obvious --- Burton/Hass, Hart in particular --- and has hurt the Club.

Has Roo done more good than harm in the last few years? Not for mine, sorry. :(
 

adelaidecrows

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Thanks, good reply.
Bluntly, I'm not.
Loved him as a player (am West Adelaide fan, so I noticed him back then too), great playing career, but his nepotism is obvious --- Burton/Hass, Hart in particular --- and has hurt the Club.

Has Roo done more good than harm in the last few years? Not for mine, sorry. :(
Roo and the board only oversee the football department and don't make the decisions when it comes to hiring assistant coaches. The only direct decisions I know of that he has played a hand in was the senior coaches and The general manager of the football department. As a board no doubt they ratified a do anything to get Gibbs approach but not once did I ever see Roo doing the negotiations at the trade table.

Roo cops alot because he is the face of the club but it genuinely looks like Burton was the one who completely screwed the club. I'm not sure you can blame Roo for that since Roo didn't plan the camp.

The one thing to bare in mind. Every crows supporter for nearly two decades has demanded a change in culture, lure more talent back to SA and be more elite. The only way to do this was to gut the club inside out and change the culture. Arguably that's exactly what happened. The cancerous culture has been moved on. With another massive list cull at the end of the year moving into next year our list is going to be packed with young talent.

The club looks happy again. Which when was the last time you truly can say you felt the club was a happy place?

At the end of this season the club has given supporters something to genuinely feel confident in for the first time since I'd say 2005. Every year for the last 15 years we basically had come to expect everything to crumble down. Let's be positive as I can only see good things.



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CrowBloke

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Golumless

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Yes but if everything is on the up and things are starting to feel good I am not sure the need for roo to leave is actually valid. Hass would be the only one I have queries about and Chapman is leaving anyway. Once the review is done on this year I would expect some changes. From here based on our improvement and the lack of rumours from internal sources coming from the club I suspect we are on a good place. If we can make ourselves better by employing a better person in key positions that's a given. I'm happy for roo to stay. We need ex players around the inner sanctum helping to drive things. Don't see too many putting their hand up.

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Ex-player or not, there needs to be a price paid by Roo for the disaster he's brought on this club with the last 4-5 years, as he's been one of the main architects of it with being the person who recommended a dangerously under-qualified Burton to the role of GM.

Time for both parties to move on.
 

CrowBloke

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Roo cops alot because he is the face of the club but it genuinely looks like Burton was the one who completely screwed the club. I'm not sure you can blame Roo for that since Roo didn't plan the camp.
Roo is a very prominent public face, compromised by his Eddie-two-hats conflicts of interest, and a propensity to be OVERloyal. I don't blame Roo for the Camp specifically, nor any one specific damning failure Since 2017 but, like Pyke/Burton/Camporeale (all gone) is/was a part of the problemS. Promoting Burton over Teague was a ridiculous decision, in which Roo would have had influence (btw, I loved Burton as a player, too).
Chapman and Roo have been driving forces, overseeing the Crows fall from 2017GF (for which I give Pyke and the players most credit) to the rabble of 5 weeks ago.
Burton's and Hart's appointments (Burton brought old mate Hass with him, remember) on the basis of their record in their fields were unfathomable. Shocking nepotism, compounded by the fact that Burton/Hass contributed to Brisbane's misery --- why hire failures?? (answer: ex-teammates) --- and Hart was sacked by Collingwood.
 

adelaidecrows

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Ex-player or not, there needs to be a price paid by Roo for the disaster he's brought on this club with the last 4-5 years, as he's been one of the main architects of it with being the person who recommended a dangerously under-qualified Burton to the role of GM.

Time for both parties to move on.
But if he has learned from his mistakes and we can't get a better person what's the point in getting rid of him. Punishing him is stupid if it doesn't get us anywhere. We need passionate crows people and that includes ex players. He is a board member which is an unpaid position. So banishing him from the club as a punishment for daring to make it better but getting it wrong will only serve as a deterrent for others. It won't attract people to the club.

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adelaidecrows

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Not Hart as well?
Why Hart? Again things seem to be improving.

This is what I don't get about Adelaides supporter culture. There is this image that all ex players are bad and they must go because they only got the job because of their mates. It's no wonder ex players don't feel welcome at the club. We need to start trusting in their appointments

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Crow Envy

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But if he has learned from his mistakes and we can't get a better person what's the point in getting rid of him. Punishing him is stupid if it doesn't get us anywhere. We need passionate crows people and that includes ex players. He is a board member which is an unpaid position. So banishing him from the club as a punishment for daring to make it better but getting it wrong will only serve as a deterrent for others. It won't attract people to the club.

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Oh please. He is the Director of Football and with his standing at the club, if you don’t think he has significant power you are kidding yourself.

He has repeatedly shown poor judgement. It was his mate Burton that f’ed the club. He sits on list management which has seen us have to pay players playing for other clubs. His foot in mouth comments embarrass the club.

Name me one good thing besides Walsh that he has done.

He has been a disaster and needs to go and if you need convincing, we are bottom.
 

Golumless

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But if he has learned from his mistakes and we can't get a better person what's the point in getting rid of him. Punishing him is stupid if it doesn't get us anywhere. We need passionate crows people and that includes ex players. He is a board member which is an unpaid position. So banishing him from the club as a punishment for daring to make it better but getting it wrong will only serve as a deterrent for others. It won't attract people to the club.

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See, if the mistake was small, I'd agree. Write it off. That said, this hasn't been a small mistake. This mistake cost us a window and pissed away 8 years building a squad to compete at the top end. That is not a mistake you can come back from, nor should you be given the opportunity at the place you are at. It doesn't matter if he's a passionate crows person, or (eww) an ex-crows player. We simply cannot afford to risk him destroying another tilt and there is no doubt Roo will destroy another tilt.

There is no point that hiring Brett Burton was daring to make it better. It was obvious in 2016 it was a shithouse move, it remained obvious in 2020. After all he badly failed in a lesser role at Brisbane. It was nothing more than incompetence.
 

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