Who will be better in 2024? Hawthorn or Essendon?

[BomberBoy123]

It's always bizarre to me how posters can't admit their team isn't the bestest in the world all the time.

Essendon is, for now, the better team in 2024. Admitting that won't cause Hawthorn to fold.

The stupid part about it is it’s not even close, as of right now one of them is battling to get out of the bottom 4 and the other on the edge of the top 4, miles apart.

 

[WN123]

Hawthorn remind me of Essendon about 15 years back.
The fallen powerhouse. Supporters with an absolute belief that it is only a matter of time before they rocket back up the ladder. Proclaiming mediocre/good players as the next coming. (Newcombe, Nash, Lewis, Day etc). Favourite son returns as coach full of sound and fury signifying nothing.

 

[PerthBoy86]

How did more people vote Hawthorn?

 

[boncer34]

The stupidest part about it is it’s not even close, as of right now one of them is battling to get out of the bottom 4 and the other on the edge of the top 4, miles apart.

3.5 wins isn't miles apart imo.

 

[BomberBoy123]

3.5 wins isn't miles apart imo.

It is over an 8 week period….

If they are only 3.5 wins behind us at seasons end the fair enough, but it’s likely to be closer to 10 by then.

 

[Inspecta Gadget]

It's always bizarre to me how posters can't admit their team isn't the bestest in the world all the time.

Essendon is, for now, the better team in 2024. Admitting that won't cause Hawthorn to fold.

Please refrain from using Hawthorn and fold in the same sentence. It might trigger some serious ptsd in the older fans. I can guarantee there's at least a couple that have gone into a fugue state where they're rattling a tin can

 

[RoughysMullet]

We’ll still be better

 

[smish]

This thread is finally living up to its potential

 

[NetworkNerd]

Hard to argue against Essendon. 3.5 games clear and every game for the rest of the year is 'Winnable' based on current form.

• Play a Geelong 'away' game at the MCG rather than GMHBA
• Only 2 'reasonably tough' games against Gold Coast and Brisbane up in QLD

All other matches are at MCG/Marvel so they will always be a decent chance. Not necessarily favourite but a good chance. Nobody can deny this

 

[toomanysquibs]

You can if the question is who is better in that season. Or does less wins = more success? Coz in that case we've got the Hawks covered for the last 20 years.

Bit mischievous. Nobody said less wins equals more success.

Was purely talking about the question in the context of who is better in 2024: the Hawks or Fly up, up!

Again, you’d probably need to win the flag and have your club make some kind of significant breakthrough discovery in medicine, win a pulitzer, humanitarian award of some note or something of that ilk.

i see all kinds of deflection above. It’s going to take a bit more than some pretty home and away wins to argue that you’re better than Hawthorn this year.

 

[Kreuuuzeurns]

Essendon have a more talented list, have recruited better this off-season, are further ahead in their development and have a better coach. They were already 4 wins and 10% better than the Hawks in 2023. Spanked them by 10 goals h2h.

Why is this a thread?

Going the way I expected in December.

 

[Bunk Moreland]

How did more people vote Hawthorn?

Essendon hatred

 

[Philhawk]

Right now? Dons.

Let’s chat in 8 weeks. Pretty sure the w/l picture will be different.

Biggest issue with the Dons list is that they are nowhere near a flag or even competing.

Pretty happy with with our list is at and the way we’re heading.

 

[Philhawk]

Hawthorn remind me of Essendon about 15 years back.
The fallen powerhouse. Supporters with an absolute belief that it is only a matter of time before they rocket back up the ladder. Proclaiming mediocre/good players as the next coming. (Newcombe, Nash, Lewis, Day etc). Favourite son returns as coach full of sound and fury signifying nothing.

Ah yes, I remember these comments from Dons posters on this board 15 years ago.

The absolute belief comes from belief in an organization with a track record of competing every decade.

We’ll take our licks now, our list profile is still in a far better position than the Dons.

 

[BomberBoy123]

Ah yes, I remember these comments from Dons posters on this board 15 years ago.

The absolute belief comes from belief in an organization with a track record of competing every decade.

We’ll take our licks now, our list profile is still in a far better position than the Dons.

What do you actually base your last sentence on?

 

[HairyO]

It is over an 8 week period….

If they are only 3.5 wins behind us at seasons end the fair enough, but it’s likely to be closer to 10 by then.

I did a predictor and think I was somewhat generous to both teams and Hawks finished 15th on 8 wins and Dons finished 10th on 11.5 wins. Hawks would still be 15th on 9 wins and on 7 wins - given Roos, Eagles and Tigers are also going to lose a lot of games.

Essendon could go as high as 7th on 12.5 wins or drop to 13th on 10.5 wins so there is far more variability there.

Unless you see Essendon winning 16 or 17 games (which is ridiculous) then you really havent looked at our draw.

I have GWS, Melb and Geelong on 16 wins, Swans on 15 wins. Essendon are not at their level.

 

[BomberBoy123]

I did a predictor and think I was somewhat generous to both teams and Hawks finished 15th on 8 wins and Dons finished 10th on 11.5 wins. Hawks would still be 15th on 9 wins and on 7 wins - given Roos, Eagles and Tigers are also going to lose a lot of games.

Essendon could go as high as 7th on 12.5 wins or drop to 13th on 10.5 wins so there is far more variability there.

Unless you see Essendon winning 16 or 17 games (which is ridiculous) then you really havent looked at our draw.

I have GWS, Melb and Geelong on 16 wins, Swans on 15 wins. Essendon are not at their level.

I said closer to 10 dude, as in closer to 10 than 3.5, we’ll be comfortably 7-10 wins better of than Hawthorn by seasons end.

 

[HairyO]

I said closer to 10 dude, as in closer to 10 than 3.5, we’ll be comfortably 7-10 wins better of than Hawthorn by seasons end.

My guess is the current 3.5 is more likely than 7 or more. The Bombers are going to have a few runs of losses.

We are too, obviously. But my guess is we are at 2.5 games difference after this weekend.

 

[BomberBoy123]

My guess is the current 3.5 is more likely than 7 or more. The Bombers are going to have a few runs of losses.

We are too, obviously. But my guess is we are at 2.5 games difference after this weekend.

You are as much chance of losing this week as we are, then we’ll win our next 2 and you’ll lose your next 2, that gap will continue to grow.

 

[toomanysquibs]

What do you actually base your last sentence on?

A few suggestions, offered only in place of that poster's silence:

Did it perhaps come about by way of a stern belief that his club has never written, produced and starred in the kind of s**t show that Messers Hird and Thompson put together for pretty much everyone's protracted amusement, in the not too distant past?

Or could it be the sum of that years long event plus the barren decades bookending it, during which performances on the field were only slightly better than what was going on off-field?

Or maybe it's the shameless dishonesty of that 'Up, up to win the' bit in the song?

 

[HairyO]

You are as much chance of losing this week as we are, then we’ll win our next 2 and you’ll lose your next 2, that gap will continue to grow.

I dont think anyone knows what the Tigers or the Lions are going to do 2 weeks from now.

 

[BomberBoy123]

A few suggestions, offered only in place of that poster's silence:

Did it perhaps come about by way of a stern belief that his club has never written, produced and starred in the kind of s**t show that Messers Hird and Thompson put together for pretty much everyone's protracted amusement, in the not too distant past?

Or could it be the sum of that years long event plus the barren decades bookending it, during which performances on the field were only slightly better than what was going on off-field?

Or maybe it's the shameless dishonesty of that 'Up, up to win the' bit in the song?

So basically nothing, when comparing the two current playing lists, you know you can’t even compare so you resort to something completely unrelated, I got my answer

 

[BomberBoy123]

I dont think anyone knows what the Tigers or the Lions are going to do 2 weeks from now.

The Lions maybe, you may get them at the right time with injuries but pretty sure we all know the Tigers are cooked.

 

[boncer34]

Bit mischievous. Nobody said less wins equals more success.

Was purely talking about the question in the context of who is better in 2024: the Hawks or Fly up, up!

So if Essendon win more games are they better in 2024?

 

[toomanysquibs]

18 pages a growing.

So basically nothing, when comparing the two current playing lists, you know you can’t even compare to you resort to something completely unrelated, I got my answer

I'm picturing you fist pumping while singing a few verses of 'Up,up' after writing this. It's very cute.

But while it's a novel and very pretty idea that Essendon would be better than Hawthorn in 2024, there's a reason why you can't resist the allure of framing it in this way....

Namely that an educated supporter - and I'd suggest any neutral supporter reading this somewhat redundant thread - is also going to recognize that the stigma of being the league's lowest functioning basket case this century is the kind of stain that you just can't wash away with a few seasons of nice home and away results.

Unfortunately respect and being 'better' is built on high concepts such as winning finals, or not being taken to court because you're trying to inject your team with success.