West Coast/Hawthorn - Who will do better in 2017?

[little graham]

Hawthorn too strong if Sam Mitchell plays most games

I see what you did there.

 

[WWSD]

Vickery is no a-grader or superstar, but he's a significant upgrade on Schoenmakers. He kicked 26 goals this year in a bottom 8 side. Imagine what he'd do surround by Rioli, Gunston, Breust, Roughead, Puopolo, Sicily, Burton and co. His job is to compete and bring the ball to ground. Hawthorn's forward structure will be much better then 2016, especially with Roughead likely to come back who's good for 2-3 goals a game and having two key forwards now will bolster our forward-line with Gunston likely to benefit going back to his old role as the 3rd tall. Our inside 50 marks per game in 2017 should go up a fair bit.

I don't think we will make the top 4 or challenge for the flag, but there's still more then enough quality players in the best 22 to win enough games to make another finals appearance. Likely to finish around 5th-8th and maybe a Semi Final at best which is not a bad outcome given our list turnover and Hawthorn going throw a rebuilding phase.

West Coast are likely to finish higher on the ladder even without Naitanui available. They've got some quality key position players and good midfield depth to go deep in the finals with a healthy list to choose from.

 

[Randomizor]

Hawks took it upon themselves to equalise the competition this trading period. Should see them slide significantly. Eagles finally have a midfield, but no Natanui. Should see them stay in about the same position they were this year.

 

[kane249]

It's hard to pick the Hawks for next year.

No S.Mitchell, Lewis
Will Roughead play at all?
Ceglar who is no superstar, but a solid part of their line up to miss most of the year.
Hodge, Burgoyne, Gibson another year older.

But on the flip side T.Mitchell and O'Meara in (knees pending).
Will Vickery be better in a good side.
Their winning culture and Clarkson is a genius.

Arguments can be made either way.

 

[hoianbulldog]

Early whispers on O'Meara's knee are pretty positive.

Is he training the house down?

Sorry, it is the off season.

 

[Ok Boomer]

More importantly, is he wearing a hat?

 

[Ok Boomer]

How's that?

I really doubt it.

Priddis and Mitchell will be great, or at the very least, interesting. I'm excited.

 

[Upgrayedd]

Both Mitchells will be awarded brownlows next year

 

[RUNVS]

West coast are topping up while the Hawks are shedding skin for the rebirth.

Given that I would be a pretty disappointed eagles fan if they didn't finish higher than hawthorn.

Not sure I agree as Hawthorn sold most of the next two drafts for O'Meara and to a lesser extent Mitchell so there is only so much rebuiding they can possibly do in 2016 and 2017. What rebuilding they can do they have already done.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Is he training the house down?

Sorry, it is the off season.

They've had to put scaffolding up around all the terraces at Waverley, in preparation.

 

[EdCurnowRules]

I'd say 7th-10th. Naitanui's absence puts a ceiling on it, to the point that winning a final and essentially improving on 2016 would have to be considered a partial success.

I definitely don't think Mitchell walks in and automatically makes the midfield one of the best in the comp. Its problems run deeper than that.

And I hate to say it but, based on 2016, there's something not quite right mentally with WC. Coming off a great 2015, where they were admittedly shown up in the GF, the expectation was that they'd be desperate to find that incremental improvement from emerging players, recruits and players returning from injury. Instead, they played without commitment for 80 per cent of the season. There was some very flaky s**t served up. Guys like LeCras and Yeo went backwards, while Hill, Cripps and Wellingham weren't as good either. Duggan stalled and Sheed got injured. And the additions in Jetta, Redden and Mackenzie were non-factors. Something quite dramatic would need to happen to reverse that.

I reckon you're about spot on here mate but I really do think they can bounce back big time in 2017. Hoping more than anything


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Leather Poisoning]

Not sure I agree as Hawthorn sold most of the next two drafts for O'Meara and to a lesser extent Mitchell so there is only so much rebuiding they can possibly do in 2016 and 2017. What rebuilding they can do they have already done.

Our current list won't win a flag unless the under 24 crew get a lot of game time and two or three of them become stars. That's part of the rebuild.

 

[Cynic]

At this point I'd say both will finish close enough together to make this question pretty redundant.

If I had to choose though I'd go West Coast due to Hawthorn's harder draw and reliance on older players.

 

[Kwality]

Jesus mate, Hawks topped the ladder for about 5 rounds didn't they? They made the finals and actually their performance against Geelong was really good I thought. I don't want to use the 'knocked out by the eventual premiers' line, but Bulldogs were up and we were down. Yes, I expected them to go further into September but I don't think they had a comparable year to West Coast.

They were streets ahead this season and the gap may narrow next year.

.... when you are at the sharp end looking to contend, its easy to only remember when you were knocked out by a better team n the day.

The 2016 squads wouldn't do much better in 2017 & that's why there is a bit of list management at work now. Too many unknowns, ifs, buts ....

I'm certainly following the Hawks off season moves

 

[Suma Magic]

West coast are topping up while the Hawks are shedding skin for the rebirth.

Given that I would be a pretty disappointed eagles fan if they didn't finish higher than hawthorn.

Hopefully the cost of topping up, pick 88, doesn't come back to bite us...

We don't have enough old players to shed skin. We had one over 30 this year.

By retaining all our high picks this year and next we are playing the long game.

 

[Suma Magic]

On topic, both will finish somewhere 5-8th IMO.

 

[BEaston]

WC will finish higher imo

 

[Wesley2]

Not sure I agree as Hawthorn sold most of the next two drafts for O'Meara and to a lesser extent Mitchell so there is only so much rebuiding they can possibly do in 2016 and 2017. What rebuilding they can do they have already done.

That theory works if you think the draft is the only way to gain players. Looking at the Hawks over the past 10 years or so we know this is patently untrue.

 

[WestCoast05]

West coast are topping up while the Hawks are shedding skin for the rebirth.

You added Vicary, JOM and Mitchell - you are topping up also.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

You added Vicary, JOM and Mitchell - you are topping up also.

Vickery yes.

But the other two are going to play for 10 years and they were obtained by shedding skin.

 

[Toump Ass]

Both gonna tank 2017. Reckon the Hawks will do it better.

 

[mightymouse75]

Hawks will struggle big time.
Eagles will finish ahead.

 

[kane249]

Vickery yes.

But the other two are going to play for 10 years and they were obtained by shedding skin.

And draft picks

 

[WestCoast05]

Vickery yes.

But the other two are going to play for 10 years and they were obtained by shedding skin.

But you swapped out your picks for them?
We kept ours - and we will use them.
With the addition of Mitchell we still only have 2 players over 30.

I'm not disagreeing with what you are saying - I'm just saying it is highly simplistic to label one team in rebuild mode and the other as 'topping up'.

Truth is if Mitchell wasn't offered to us for pick 88 we wouldnt have taken him -and part of taking him is obviously we want him for the coaching role. And Vardy is obviously a stop-gap for Natanui (that said, noone will be conplaining if he exceeds expectations and cements a spot).

Last season West Coast traded in a Jetta and Redden - duds so far. But our discovered stars over the past couple season were McGov and Barrass (and we will see how Duggan and Sheed play out before I call them discoveries or even stars).
I wouldn't be surprised if from that West Coast now prefer to get the picks and develop their own.

 

[MC_9]

Not sure I agree as Hawthorn sold most of the next two drafts for O'Meara and to a lesser extent Mitchell so there is only so much rebuiding they can possibly do in 2016 and 2017. What rebuilding they can do they have already done.

We gave away our first for next year. We have a 2nd onwards.

Hardly most of our picks for next year.