FTA-TV Survivor 40 (Winners at War)

[dont bowl there]

Just out of interest, why did you think Michelle deserved votes? What part of her game justified anyone voting for her, ahead of Natalie or Tony?

She formed bonds with many in the game and won immunity when she needed it the most. She deserved votes over Natalie IMO but I hate edge so view them as lesser no matter what. Would have been fine with a Tony sweep but Michelle was hardly a zero vote goat like normal.

 

[nobbyiscool]

A few thoughts:

- I'm very disappointed that we didn't get a reunion. I mentioned during the live airing that it's obviously logistically difficult, but I wanted a reunion today more than any of the previous 39 seasons.

- It's a funny game, Survivor. Over the last couple of weeks, Michele played exactly the same game as when she won - she played from the bottom, she went on a winning streak, and she lucked into a late alliance having played individually for weeks. And this time she got no votes. I thought her game was better than that, and I hope it doesn't bum her out.

- I'm sure I said in this thread that I expected Tony to be among the first eliminated. It's mind blowing to me that he was allowed to dominate the game like this. He even dominated the jury - they were eating out of the palm of his hand at final tribal.

- They showed a lot of reflections of people's Survivor careers. It almost looked like a hard reset, with no repeat players to ever appear again. I legit think that from about season 35 (? - whichever came after game changers) they aren't going to recycle players any more. Certainly it looked like all the people in the discussion for Survivor Mt Rushmore - Sandra, Tony, Rob, Parvati, Tyson, Sarah et al - were speaking about this as being their last Survivor experience. This seemed line a really defining moment for Survivor going forward.

- I wonder if it's time for a reset in terms of how the game is played. I don't need to see 100 advantages any more. If they're set on the Survivor economy, the advantages should be coming from that rather than from dumb luck/idol hunting.

- Overall, this series was pretty disappointing. I think the final 3 weeks were better, and I think as fans we all deserved a LOT more of the Michele/Natalie alliance, but in a way I think the castaways were so keen to come and be respectful representatives of the game that it took away from the game (or at least from the final tribal). * what the jury were saying about how difficult the choice was - I don't think there was any drama in the final tribal, because I thought the result was pretty obvious.

 

[glenferry23]

Very good outcome, can’t fault Tony as the winner. Looked like the jury were expecting Natalie to do what Chris did and pit herself against Tony, it seemed to at least cost her Rob’s vote. Others perhaps too.

Great finale though, a lot of emotion involved and can see there are genuine relationships out there between them. Was a great touch seeing Tony’s kids on his lap as he’s announced as the winner, what a moment for them.

 

[Kirby]

Michelle deserved more votes than Natalie because she wasn’t voted out first and actually was part of the game.

EoE nearly ruined this season.

I love Tony and he very much deserved the win. The moments after he beat Sarah in the fire making challenge were very emotional. Best moment the finale.

I’m very disappointed in Parvati’s vote. The peanut butter vote.

That gender equality thing just seemed so out of place, it made no sense in this game at all. It was clearly a response to the debacle of the last season. Utter rubbish in a game where as many women win as men. There are gender biases that cut clearly both ways. What have I been watching?

I thank Tony for turning this season into a “middling” one and not the bottom 5 one it was until a month ago.

 

[YippeeYiYeo]

Wtf Ben is at final 5 and is happy to be voted out and lose the chance for 2 million bucks. This finale is going from bad to worse.

Jesus these people are muppets. Please let Tony win. Id be content with Michelle as an underdog victory too. But fair dinkum Ben and Sarah are vomit inducing. Seriously could be my last US survivor series ever at this rate.

 

[Lefthanded]

Best player won.

Sarah not my favourite (I do like her) but when she spouted arrogantly at final 6 that "if Natalie had an idol I'd know it" and ignored Tony (Ben ignored him too) and it cost Ben and Tony their idols I would have been happy to see Sarah go that tribal.

Was surprised Tyson didn't have 1 advantage in the challenge (must of spent his two tokens from coconut challenge on food). He and Rob were good enough to nearly catch Nat and Wendell.

 

[nobbyiscool]

That gender equality thing just seemed so out of place, it made no sense in this game at all. It was clearly a response to the debacle of the last season. Utter rubbish in a game where as many women win as men. There are gender biases that cut clearly both ways. What have I been watching?

You suck at maths.

As many women win as men? I think were at about 25-15 in favour of men after today. (I personally think that stat gets worse when you consider the context of each season, and the extent to which women had to dominate series' in order for a woman to win - winners like Danni and Kim were the result of series' where gender was an issue in how alliances played out.)

I thought it was obvious to everyone how women are treated differently to men in Survivor - where a guy is a "boss", a woman is a "bitch". I guess that's what surprised me about that whole conversation, is that it was apparently a revelation to anyone.

 

[revo333]

Best player won.

Sarah not my favourite (I do like her) but when she spouted arrogantly at final 6 that "if Natalie had an idol I'd know it" and ignored Tony (Ben ignored him too) and it cost Ben and Tony their idols I would have been happy to see Sarah go that tribal.

Sarah was annoying for the whole finale, People are saying it's the best finale they have ever done but I'm not sure i'll watch the finale again and it's mainly because of her, I thought the peak of the series was the merge until the final EOE challenge.

And don't get me started on the gender bias rant while the females were outnumbering the males 4 to 2...

 

[Lefthanded]

That gender equality thing just seemed so out of place, it made no sense in this game at all. It was clearly a response to the debacle of the last season. Utter rubbish in a game where as many women win as men. There are gender biases that cut clearly both ways. What have I been watching?

Agree that it seemed a bit out of place. I thought some of it was Sarah making a good speech to the jury to talk her game up a bit (good move considering if Nat or Michelle had ended on the jury instead of her she'd be pitching for 7 women's vote) as a response to the suggestion that Tony was dominating. I don't think many (if any) would dispute Tony having played the better game - found more idols, won more immunities, on the right side of more votes (I suspect), considered better the chance of Natalie having an idol on return etc
however I do think we do perceive men and women differently (partly because they are different). There are some things the average woman is better at and some things the average man is better at.
I don't perceive a gender bias on Survivor but quick count suggests 25 male winners, 15 female winners shows it's not a coin toss scenario.

 

[revo333]

- It's a funny game, Survivor. Over the last couple of weeks, Michele played exactly the same game as when she won - she played from the bottom, she went on a winning streak, and she lucked into a late alliance having played individually for weeks. And this time she got no votes. I thought her game was better than that, and I hope it doesn't bum her out.

Russell Hantz was seen as a failure for getting zero votes in season 20 yet Michele has been praised for making it to the final 3 and getting zero votes from the jury.

Is it a successful game you have played if you make it to the final 3 and can't get a single vote? from a much bigger jury this season as well.

Maybe there is stuff we don't see off camera that rubs people the wrong way with her.

 

[revo333]

I don't perceive a gender bias on Survivor but quick count suggests 25 male winners, 15 female winners shows it's not a coin toss scenario.

It was pretty even up to season 25.

So what has changed in the last 15 seasons?

 

[revo333]

- They showed a lot of reflections of people's Survivor careers. It almost looked like a hard reset, with no repeat players to ever appear again. I legit think that from about season 35 (? - whichever came after game changers) they aren't going to recycle players any more. Certainly it looked like all the people in the discussion for Survivor Mt Rushmore - Sandra, Tony, Rob, Parvati, Tyson, Sarah et al - were speaking about this as being their last Survivor experience. This seemed line a really defining moment for Survivor going forward.

Survivor brings out very nostalgic feelings for people, the old schoolers appear to be held in higher regard.

I'm not sure the show can last without returning players, it appears it's all gone in a full circle.

 

[YippeeYiYeo]

Why didnt Natalie put Michelle up against Tony? Surely the goal of the fire making challenge is eliminating the biggest threat.

oh and i hate sarah more than ever. Her choking on her water and interrupting when Natalie was explaining her decision was really childish and exposes her sore loser attitude. God i hope Tony beats her amd that “gender bias” twat misses out on final 3 by a whisker. She’s literally been the least impressive of the 4 left.

 

[Ochre]

Hahahahhahahahahahahahahaahaha if you'd made me line everyone up on that sand day 1 in order of likelihood to win, I'm not sure I'd put Tony ahead of Probst. He ******* did it. All hail the king.

 

[Ochre]

Also reason 77135 why EOE sucks, I found myself hating Nat so much. I love Nat. * EoE

 

[Gak Attack]

Hated EoE and the finale didn't help that fact, even now you get people voting in spite at the end and when you haven't voted anyone out that is a massive advantage. Natalie did as well as you could from her position but I just don't think it's fair on the others. Think some people have been harsh on Michele, yes she had some luck but she also won when she had to and played pretty well knowing she was always close to being out.

So really Tony was the clear winner, would have been a lot better if Sarah was in the final 3 with him, could have really split the votes Tony eventually got. Natalie ****ed up keeping Michele, she was still not a threat even if she won fire imo, she either should have tried to beat him in fire herself or picked Sarah and hope Michele got the job done, if Sarah beats Tony she gets all those votes and wins easily as well.

Also Michele at the end, wow.

 

[YippeeYiYeo]

Hahahha yes!!!!

And judging by the jury’s reaction they wanted Tony to win that Final 4 fire making challenge. Some even let out a woooo! If sarah won that my TV was going off.

Geez that was close. Great final 3 considering Denise, Sarah and Ben were all final 6.

Michelle, Tony and Natalie is decent. All won individual immunity challenges, were good socially, and deserve to be there. Unique stories too. Michelle the underdog postmerge, Natalie the survivor from EOE, and Tony the master who has always been in control.

Tony, Michelle, Natalie is the ideal finishing order IMO. Tonys spy nest, his manic personality, correctly guessing who had advantages/idols, winning II challenges, socially competent. Hes dominated. If people consider Sandra to be the queen of Survivor, Tony should be considered the King.

 

[YippeeYiYeo]

Jeremy and Nick offended at Tony... piss off.

 

[YippeeYiYeo]

Ooh Boston Rob dropping bombs that Natalies social game on EOE in the final week wasnt very good. Shes taken a hit here.

 

[YippeeYiYeo]

The jury loves Tony. Spy nest story winning hearts and minds. Hes won.

 

[dales.girl38]

It was pretty even up to season 25.

So what has changed in the last 15 seasons?

The final 4 fire making challenge and oversupply of advantages have made a big difference. Men, as has been pointed by players before, have historically had more opportunities to look for idols given their more physical tasks of getting wood etc. I do think the women have stepped up a bit more in the past few seasons though and we've seen more women get them of late.

Since season 26 there have been 3 female winners, Natalie (28), Michele (32) and Sarah (34) - coincidentally the final 3 women, with Denise the previous female winner before that too. That's not even close to equal. On the know it alls they mentioned that Natalie receiving votes was the first female to receive a vote since Sarah's win. I don't think it's right to dismiss the gender bias issue, but I wholeheartedly believe Tony played an objectively superior game, and I refuse to support a female contestant purely because Survivor's due for a female winner.

 

[drd23]

I can't believe the lack of comments about effectively quitting at F5. It made zero sense for him or Sarah

 

[YippeeYiYeo]

Natalie could have reliquished her final 4 immunity necklace and battles Tony to eliminate him in a fire making challenge. But she didnt. She left it to Sarah. Bit of a strategical blunder.

Tony again getting laughs from the jury talking about getting extorted from EOE. Hes charming their socks off.

Can he sweep it with 17 votes?

 

[dales.girl38]

I can't believe the lack of comments about effectively quitting at F5. It made zero sense for him or Sarah

Very true, Sarah's best chance was with Ben still in the game. Surely with Michele gone and Ben there, Natalie still wins the final immunity challenge. She could then have sent Ben to defeat Tony at fire, since he's won it before. A final 3 of Natalie, Sarah and Ben would definitely see Sarah the favourite.

Odd choice by all concerned really. Tony should have been the one trying to get rid of Ben, while the others should have been saving him.

 

[Ochre]

Spoiler

So the leaked final 3 before the series aired was correct!

Returnee seasons are always spoiled.