Preview Changes: R15 vs North Melbourne, Sunday June 26, 12.40pm ACST in Tasmania

[jackster83]

Selectors have wasted the form of Worrell and now Newchurch not allowing them to get into the AFL when they were ready.

Absolutely no reason why they couldn't have played against West Coast.

 

[Betts are off]

Selectors have wasted the form of Worrell and now Newchurch not allowing them to get into the AFL when they were ready.

The Newchurch one sucks because he's a career forward pocket/flanker. Its the cruisiest position to give a young player a game.

You could literally give him a game at any point and he won't ever be the reason we lost. And right now the bar is pretty damn low for forward pocket/flanker in terms of scoreboard impact. Like primary school highjump low!

 

[1990crow]

Absolutely no reason why they couldn't have played against West Coast.

Roo wants all the "experience" in the side as we can muster. It's why Murphy is continually picked despite playing forward and not kicking goals.

 

[1990crow]

The Newchurch one sucks because he's a career forward pocket/flanker. Its the cruisiest position to give a young player a game.

You could literally give him a game at any point and he won't ever be the reason we lost. And right now the bar is pretty damn low for forward pocket/flanker in terms of scoreboard impact. Like primary school highjump low!

I saw positive signs in Matthew Nicks selection practices in 2020. It's been all downhill since then.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Got a feeling one of Cook and Schoenberg gets selected this week

I’ll say Cook gets the nod

 

[Mego Red]

Selectors have wasted the form of Worrell and now Newchurch not allowing them to get into the AFL when they were ready.

They're doing exactly as well now as they were five weeks ago.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

I really don’t get why people just want to ditch 10 game Murray who is barely 21 yo and actually does well in contests given how many I50s we are conceding

Murray has shown he can defend.

Frampton has shown he can't defend.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

Got a feeling one of Cook and Schoenberg gets selected this week

I’ll say Cook gets the nod

Cook is a must in IMO.

 

[Kane McGoodwin]

The Newchurch one sucks because he's a career forward pocket/flanker. Its the cruisiest position to give a young player a game.

You could literally give him a game at any point and he won't ever be the reason we lost. And right now the bar is pretty damn low for forward pocket/flanker in terms of scoreboard impact. Like primary school highjump low!

Exactly - we should be getting games into our specialist small forward, rather than wasting time playing midfielders as forwards... when they don't even get any time in the midfield.

 

[Betts are off]

Exactly - we should be getting games into our specialist small forward, rather than wasting time playing midfielders as forwards... when they don't even get any time in the midfield.

And also dropping small forwards who don't kick goals.

I get that defensive pressure, and providing a link is important, but at the end of the day a small forwards primary function should come back to crumbing the pack and kicking goals. We have 3 in the side who right now, simply don't perform their primary function. And I don't think defenses fear/respect any of them because of this fact.

Newchurch might be the poorest in the other 2 roles, but man does he get dangerous when the ball is in his area! I certainly wouldn't want to be on him when the ball hits the deck

 

[Scorpus]

And also dropping small forwards who don't kick goals.

I get that defensive pressure, and providing a link is important, but at the end of the day a small forwards primary function should come back to crumbing the pack and kicking goals. We have 3 in the side who right now, simply don't perform their primary function. And I don't think defenses fear/respect any of them because of this fact.

Newchurch might be the poorest in the other 2 roles, but man does he get dangerous when the ball is in his area! I certainly wouldn't want to be on him when the ball hits the deck

The best way for our small forwards to nullify the opposition's defense is to get the ball and kick it through the goals

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Cook is a must in IMO.

I want to see a role change for Cook - half forward

Soligo and Dawson wings

Hately in guts

Think I might be dreaming

 

[krrzr]

I want to see a role change for Cook - half forward

Soligo and Dawson wings

Hately in guts

Think I might be dreaming

Hately and Soligo in the guts
Dawson and Cook on the wing

I am for sure dreaming

 

[Betts are off]

The best way for our small forwards to nullify the opposition's defense is to get the ball and kick it through the goals

Yep, and there's no pressure like scoreboard pressure!

You wont find a defender in the game who would prefer to be tackled 0 times but gets 6 kicked on him, over getting tackled 6 times and have none kicked on him!

Hell, when I was a defender I wouldn't care if you tackled me 1000 times in the game, if I keep you to zero goals, I win!

 

[Scorpus]

Yep, and there's no pressure like scoreboard pressure!

You wont find a defender in the game who would prefer to be tackled 0 times but gets 6 kicked on him, over getting tackled 6 times and have none kicked on him!

Hell, when I was a defender I wouldn't care if you tackled me 1000 times in the game, if I keep you to zero goals, I win!

Forward pressure and inside 50 tackles have to be the most overrated stats in football.

You don't need to pressure or tackle the opposition if you're winning the ball first and kicking goals.

This obsession with defensive pressure forwards is loser mentality selection. Get players in that will win the ball and kick goals, don't just concede you won't get the ball so need pressure specialists that can't do anything else

 

[Rix31]

And also dropping small forwards who don't kick goals.

I get that defensive pressure, and providing a link is important, but at the end of the day a small forwards primary function should come back to crumbing the pack and kicking goals. We have 3 in the side who right now, simply don't perform their primary function. And I don't think defenses fear/respect any of them because of this fact.

Newchurch might be the poorest in the other 2 roles, but man does he get dangerous when the ball is in his area! I certainly wouldn't want to be on him when the ball hits the deck

And I don't feel their defensive pressure is up to standard anyway. Maybe too young and not strong enough for now but I don't know how much speed a murphy or rowe or mchenry is going to gain. They just lack any sort of weapon and we really should be looking to upgrade once our other priorities are taken care of.

On SM-G935F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Betts are off]

Forward pressure and inside 50 tackles have to be the most overrated stats in football.

You don't need to pressure or tackle the opposition if you're winning the ball first and kicking goals.

This obsession with defensive pressure forwards is loser mentality selection. Get players in that will win the ball and kick goals, don't just concede you won't get the ball so need pressure specialists that can't do anything else

Agreed, the Richmond Dynasty made it a sexy football term for a while. But at the end of the day all players should have the ability and desire to tackle and pressure their opponent, its a AFL football prerequisite. You really don't need a specialist player or players for that skillset.

Elite small forwards, are wildly more difficult to come by! Players like Eddie Betts or Toby Greene don't grow on tree's, but there is probably 100 players in the SANFL who could adequately fill the 'pressure forward' role in a team tomorrow.

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Forward pressure and inside 50 tackles have to be the most overrated stats in football.

You don't need to pressure or tackle the opposition if you're winning the ball first and kicking goals.

This obsession with defensive pressure forwards is loser mentality selection. Get players in that will win the ball and kick goals, don't just concede you won't get the ball so need pressure specialists that can't do anything else

Not at all …. goals and forward pressure come in hand in hand . We instantly became a much worse side when we lost our best pressure player and our next best one started to age

They are both important , there’s no point having pressure without ability to kick goals though , let’s be honest though we don’t have either forward pressure or ability to kick goals from our smalls

to have pressure only is a problem … all it does is half the job is slowing down opposition scoring

Pretty much every premiership is built on forward pressure , the ability to keep the game played at your end . Melbourne , Richmond and so on . Exactly why melbourne went out and got Pickett even though he was taken higher than most people expected

 

[LeftyLuke]

Just heard Nicksy on Jars, Bernie and Blewy' show. Seemed to namecheck Schoenberg (a lot), Jones and Pedlar in his interview as players who are performing in the 2's.

Fingers crossed that's an indication they are in line for recall.

He should also be mentioning Cook,Gollant, Newchurch.

 

[Scorpus]

Not at all …. goals and forward pressure come in hand in hand . We instantly became a much worse side when we lost our best pressure player and our next best one started to age

They are both important , there’s no point having pressure without ability to kick goals though , let’s be honest though we don’t have either forward pressure or ability to kick goals from our smalls

to have pressure only is a problem … all it does is half the job is slowing down opposition scoring

Pretty much every premiership is built on forward pressure , the ability to keep the game played at your end . Melbourne , Richmond and so on . Exactly why melbourne went out and got Pickett even though he was taken higher than most people expected

Pickett is a genuine goal kicker, the pressure aspect is a bonus. If he didn't kick goals he would have been drafted in the 40+ range.

Forward pressure is only relevant if your midfield is weak. If they aren't delivering it to our forwards advantage, then we need to mop up the mess that creates. Also if the midfield applies poor pressure, then the forwards need to compensate for that too.

IMO keeping the ball in the forward half has little to do with actual forward pressure and more about structure, defensive work and intercepting. The most successful teams at locking the ball in will mop up and intercept the ball in the air and send it back in. The midfield will work hard back defensively to plug gaps and make it harder. It's rare that a small forward's tackle or chase will do much, it's more about the entire midfield's ability to zone and shut down run.

Of course this requires a team that has defensively minded midfielders which we lack, so we're forced to bring in all these s**t pressure forwards and play them super high

 

[Betts are off]

And I don't feel their defensive pressure is up to standard anyway. Maybe too young and not strong enough for now but I don't know how much speed a murphy or rowe or mchenry is going to gain. They just lack any sort of weapon and we really should be looking to upgrade once our other priorities are taken care of.

On SM-G935F using BigFooty.com mobile app

Mate your observation is spot on. I just looked up the AFL's top inside 50 tacklers by average (link below). Care to guess who the top 3 Crows players are?

Shane McAdam, Darcy Fogarty and Tex Walker.... Not Ned McHenry, Lachlan Murphy and James Rowe

2022 AFL League Tackles Inside 50 Per Game Leaders

2022 AFL League Tackles Inside 50 Per Game Leaders.

www.footywire.com

 

[Scorpus]

Mate your observation is spot on. I just looked up the AFL's top inside 50 tacklers by average (link below). Care to guess who the top 3 Crows players are?

Shane McAdam, Darcy Fogarty and Tex Walker.... Not Ned McHenry, Lachlan Murphy and James Rowe

2022 AFL League Tackles Inside 50 Per Game Leaders

2022 AFL League Tackles Inside 50 Per Game Leaders.

www.footywire.com

It's because they don't have a ball winning mindset.

Players that want to win the ball and kick goals by nature will be closer to the ball and able to tackle if they don't get there.

If your entire game as a player is built on getting there second to "apply pressure" you're less likely to be positioned well.

Charlie Cameron for example is an elite pressure player because he wants the ball to kick goals. He doesn't want to zone off, man space, prevent run, or chase tail. He wants the ball, it's where he goes, he gets it or tackles.

 

[Betts are off]

It's because they don't have a ball winning mindset.

Players that want to win the ball and kick goals by nature will be closer to the ball and able to tackle if they don't get there.

If your entire game as a player is built on getting there second to "apply pressure" you're less likely to be positioned well.

Charlie Cameron for example is an elite pressure player because he wants the ball to kick goals. He doesn't want to zone off, man space, prevent run, or chase tail. He wants the ball, it's where he goes, he gets it or tackles.

Its still quite shocking to me though. I mean, how has that not been a Key Performance Indicator for those 3 players, and if it is, how are they seen as even remotely achieving it?

And if that's not a KPI, and goal kicking certainly doesn't seem to be one either, then what the hell is there output measured on?

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Pickett is a genuine goal kicker, the pressure aspect is a bonus. If he didn't kick goals he would have been drafted in the 40+ range.

Forward pressure is only relevant if your midfield is weak. If they aren't delivering it to our forwards advantage, then we need to mop up the mess that creates. Also if the midfield applies poor pressure, then the forwards need to compensate for that too.

IMO keeping the ball in the forward half has little to do with actual forward pressure and more about structure, defensive work and intercepting. The most successful teams at locking the ball in will mop up and intercept the ball in the air and send it back in. The midfield will work hard back defensively to plug gaps and make it harder. It's rare that a small forward's tackle or chase will do much, it's more about the entire midfield's ability to zone and shut down run.

Of course this requires a team that has defensively minded midfielders which we lack, so we're forced to bring in all these s**t pressure forwards and play them super high

The pressure isn’t a bonus , it’s a must

It’s what he was elite at as a junior ( definitely not goals kicked or possessions ) and they went and got it , they Obvs knew he had potential to develop his offence

The reason why the best kicks mostly play at half back isn’t by coincidence, the more forced ‘hack kicks’ out of F50 sets up the chance to intercept mark across the wings

If clubs didn’t rate forward pressure as important as they do there would be so many more coast to coast goals against

It also helps create repeat entries which leads to more I50s and goals

We don’t have good pressure forwards in either defence or offence capability . I think that’s the frustration is guys getting picked to apply pressure but don’t even do that and they definitely don’t have a good offence game or ability to create scores

 

[Jeffcrowe]

Mate your observation is spot on. I just looked up the AFL's top inside 50 tacklers by average (link below). Care to guess who the top 3 Crows players are?

Shane McAdam, Darcy Fogarty and Tex Walker.... Not Ned McHenry, Lachlan Murphy and James Rowe

2022 AFL League Tackles Inside 50 Per Game Leaders

2022 AFL League Tackles Inside 50 Per Game Leaders.

www.footywire.com

Yeah exactly , the guys we pick because we think they apply good pressure aren’t actually good at it

We only pick Rowe for his offence as he’s terrible at it even though he’s worked hard to improve at it this year