Prediction Changes Dogs V Saints 18/3/2023 Marvel

[Charlie Bucket]

An apt description of our current midfield.
Lazy at times and have shown on numerous occasions when the heat comes they disappear. Last Saturday night the most resent example. Standing on opponents at stoppages well that’s foreign to them also.

Agree.

It’s been mentioned a few times by posters that Bont and some of the other leaders are the quieter types and more so lead by example (me being one). Well they’ve shown some pretty shithouse examples over the last 12-18mths. No wonder the rest of the team shits themselves when the heats turned up. The players that are meant to inspire and lead them jump ship at the site of an iceberg.

 

[Charlie Bucket]

Stoppages well that’s foreign to them also.

Don’t agree too much with this one. They do at times, but around the ground stoppages, when it’s required, you’ll rarely see them ignore instructions to close up on an opponent like West does.

 

[DognBones]

With regards to West. Are we aware of any improvements to his game in the off -season? Has he added some pace or endurance, features that have been identified as needing improvement in the past? Obviously, the selectors are not convinced because he wasn't even considered as an emergency last start. I think we might need to see him in the team soon to find the answers to the above questions or I can see a long or even permanent stint in the VFL for him.

 

[Libba39]

Something is definitely off with the midfield. Treloar & Baz are very poor defensively and Macrae has fallen off a cliff in that area. Maybe it's coaching but our mids consistently get better numbers than the opposition and I walk away from way too many games feeling like they've been beaten.

We lost our B&F-winning midfielder over the off-season who despite the opinion of many salty folks on here was a heart-and-soul contributor and our best pressure player. You don't just replace that overnight.

Oh, and it doesn't help when your ruckman gets constantly beaten.

 

[Golden_6]

We lost our B&F-winning midfielder over the off-season who despite the opinion of many salty folks on here was a heart-and-soul contributor and our best pressure player. You don't just replace that overnight.

Oh, and it doesn't help when your ruckman gets constantly beaten.

The hitouts were only 36-27 in Melbourne's favour which is actually an excellent result considering English is coming up against Gawn & Grundy effectively solo.

We again won the clearances 37-30 but I just feel like we get minimal value from them. When the Demons win clearances against us, they seem to go straight out of the front of the stoppage into an attacking position. We seem to go sideways or backwards. It's a set-up/coaching issue to be honest.

 

[TiAn_]

The hitouts were only 36-27 in Melbourne's favour which is actually an excellent result considering English is coming up against Gawn & Grundy effectively solo.

We again won the clearances 37-30 but I just feel like we get minimal value from them. When the Demons win clearances against us, they seem to go straight out of the front of the stoppage into an attacking position. We seem to go sideways or backwards. It's a set-up/coaching issue to be honest.

Quality of clearances from centre bounces is a big issue, for sure. We concede a lot more out the front to the opposition than we generate.

 

[doggies ftw]

The hitouts were only 36-27 in Melbourne's favour which is actually an excellent result considering English is coming up against Gawn & Grundy effectively solo.

We again won the clearances 37-30 but I just feel like we get minimal value from them. When the Demons win clearances against us, they seem to go straight out of the front of the stoppage into an attacking position. We seem to go sideways or backwards. It's a set-up/coaching issue to be honest.

Spot on mate, nailed it.

Plus this issue was there all last year with Dunks, which proves it’s again a setup issue not personnel. Maybe it’s a speed issue, I think that might have an influence but I don’t think it’s entirely the issue to be honest. But Dunks wouldn’t help with that anyway

There’s been so many arguments on this forum with people claiming our midfield is still great because of clearance numbers. But that’s why you can’t use these stats as your whole argument, on paper you’d chalk that down to a win for our midfield - yet in reality we were literally obliterated

It’s a coaching issue

 

[Foxman98]

Spot on mate, nailed it.

Plus this issue was there all last year with Dunks, which proves it’s again a setup issue not personnel. Maybe it’s a speed issue, I think that might have an influence but I don’t think it’s entirely the issue to be honest. But Dunks wouldn’t help with that anyway

There’s been so many arguments on this forum with people claiming our midfield is still great because of clearance numbers. But that’s why you can’t use these stats as your whole argument, on paper you’d chalk that down to a win for our midfield - yet in reality we were literally obliterated

It’s a coaching issue

It's a combination of coaching and personal issue, The coaches need to do more to drill into their heads to lower their eyes and stop bombing long to no one but at the same time the players are elite level athletes and need to identify and adapt in game themselves.

Our biggest issue at stoppage and why we give up so many damaging clearances however is our lack of intelligence in there, I don't know how they all struggle so much of lining up on the defensive side of your opponent and not getting sucked in and leaving the whole defensive side open! It is the most infuriating thing to continue to watch and how after 3 years they haven't worked it out stiff baffles me. Personally I think now is the time to blood a Garcia type in there and drill into his brain the defensive positioning as I can't be f***ed seeing Bont/Macrae/Libba/Smith all start defensive side and give it up so quickly anymore.

 

[Charlie Bucket]

With regards to West. Are we aware of any improvements to his game in the off -season? Has he added some pace or endurance, features that have been identified as needing improvement in the past? Obviously, the selectors are not convinced because he wasn't even considered as an emergency last start. I think we might need to see him in the team soon to find the answers to the above questions or I can see a long or even permanent stint in the VFL for him.

The telling sign is that he wasn’t even considered for the 5th bench spot.

No Dunkley and potentially lacking some in and under grunt, and he still hasn’t done enough to be in the current 23.

Almost 23 years old. Something’s gotta click for him, or it could be another wasted career.

 

[doggies ftw]

The telling sign is that he wasn’t even considered for the 5th bench spot.

No Dunkley and potentially lacking some in and under grunt, and he still hasn’t done enough to be in the current 23.

Almost 23 years old. Something’s gotta click for him, or it could be another wasted career.

Could be another wasted career at the dogs*

Bevos selections can not be used as an argument for or against a player

 

[Charlie Bucket]

Could be another wasted career at the dogs*

Bevos selections can not be used as an argument for or against a player

What are you suggesting? West’s lack of game time is Bevo’s fault? Come on doggo, don’t go down that rabbit hole.

We all love a feel good father son story. Don’t be blinded by it though. West is clearly lacking in several areas of his game, and is struggling with selection because of it. Couldn’t be any clearer now missing the Rd 1 game.

Next time he plays, watch him closely between contests. Barely gets out of 1st gear. Lazy lazy player.

IMO he’s closer to carving out a good local career than he his an AFL one. Things need to change between the ears.

 

[doggies ftw]

What are you suggesting? West’s lack of game time is Bevo’s fault? Come on doggo, don’t go down that rabbit hole.

We all love a feel good father son story. Don’t be blinded by it though. West is clearly lacking in several areas of his game, and is struggling with selection because of it. Couldn’t be any clearer now missing the Rd 1 game.

Next time he plays, watch him closely between contests. Barely gets out of 1st gear. Lazy lazy player.

IMO he’s closer to carving out a good local career than he his an AFL one. Things need to change between the ears.

Not even talking about West here, but you can’t make an argument for or against a player based on them not being picked in Bevos side - he gets plenty wrong too , you can’t simply write off a player as not good enough due to not being picked by Bev

If that was the he case our best key defender wouldn’t be playing at Carlton right now

 

[Charlie Bucket]

Not even talking about West here, but you can’t make an argument for or against a player based on them not being picked in Bevos side - he gets plenty wrong too , you can’t simply write off a player as not good enough due to not being picked by Bev

If that was the he case our best key defender wouldn’t be playing at Carlton right now

That’s not my argument. Pretty clear in my earlier posts.

You don’t need his lack of selection to be convinced he’s out of the side for good reason. That was one thing I suggested using to confirm what can be seen in his games.

Missing out on Rd 1, at his age, with the lack of mid to small talent in the side, isn’t a good look for Rylie. Unless, you’re down the rabbit home, then it’s the coaches fault.

 

[blagodellago]

If the thinking is West isn’t getting a game for what he doesn’t do when the ball isn’t in his immediate vicinity, the argument falls flat. Seems like a lot of our boys are offering similar output in that regard. I highly value what he brings around the ball, and as others have said, we need more of his mongrel.

I also like the calls for Garcia. I want to see him spend more time in the side than not.


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[Bulldog rick]

Should sweet be given a chance this week?

 

[dogwatch]

Calls for JJ out are premature especially when we lack experienced runners. IMO he was rusty and short of match play. He missed a decent chunk of the preseason. I’d be surprised maybe even alarmed if he doesnt play a much better game this week.

And calls for Hannan to be the obvious out might be unrealistic. You just know he’ll hold his spot.

 

[adogsfan5]

Should sweet be given a chance this week?

No point really. Saints have one ruckman in Marshall.

 

[Foxman98]

Should sweet be given a chance this week?

For what? Lobb took 1 CBA they have Marshall/Cordy this is the week to go smaller not taller

 

[Foxman98]

Calls for JJ out are premature especially when we lack experienced runners. IMO he was rusty and short of match play. He missed a decent chunk of the preseason. I’d be surprised maybe even alarmed if he doesnt play a much better game this week.

And calls for Hannan to be the obvious out might be unrealistic. You just know he’ll hold his spot.

His experience isnt relevant when he doesn't do much and drops sitters and gives up goals

 

[Dog 36]

His experience isnt relevant when he doesn't do much and drops sitters and gives up goals

Using that criteria we would not field a team.

 

[Foxman98]

Using that criteria we would not field a team.

We would but also using the experienced criteria we would keep in Hannan over Garcia

 

[doggies ftw]

It's a combination of coaching and personal issue, The coaches need to do more to drill into their heads to lower their eyes and stop bombing long to no one but at the same time the players are elite level athletes and need to identify and adapt in game themselves.

Our biggest issue at stoppage and why we give up so many damaging clearances however is our lack of intelligence in there, I don't know how they all struggle so much of lining up on the defensive side of your opponent and not getting sucked in and leaving the whole defensive side open! It is the most infuriating thing to continue to watch and how after 3 years they haven't worked it out stiff baffles me. Personally I think now is the time to blood a Garcia type in there and drill into his brain the defensive positioning as I can't be f***ed seeing Bont/Macrae/Libba/Smith all start defensive side and give it up so quickly anymore.

I don’t think it’s as simple as lowering our eyes. There’s nothing to kick to further up the ground where we’re a bunch of stagnant witches hats.

Plus we win huge clearance numbers but we overpossess the footy and flick it around sideways & backwards which runs us into trouble and means we’re hacking it forward to a flood of defenders who have already gotten back behind the ball.

This is purely by design, we got a jump on the comp with this style where we flicked it around into space but it’s been found out (5 years ago…) when the opposition realised if you sit on the outlets and let us overpossess the footy until we turn it over. Times have changed, you watch the damage Melbourne do to us out of the stoppages and it’s a surge of forward running players, with one to two forward handballs max and quick entries. They don’t sit defensive side of the contest and pray we don’t hurt them, they think how can we win this contest and move it forward. Not how can we stop the opposition doing this.

Going more defensive is not the answer, the best defence in the centre circle is offence, win the ball and get it going our way. Were more than capable of beating any midfield in the comp for clearance numbers - but it’s our reluctance to attack from them and our pussy farting little handballs where no one wants to find themselves in trouble.

Ride the pressure FFS and move the ball forward this hot potato bullshit hasn’t worked in years

 

[dogwatch]

His experience isnt relevant when he doesn't do much and drops sitters and gives up goals

That’s why I mentioned the fact that he has had very little recent match practice. He should be much better for the run.

We would but also using the experienced criteria we would keep in Hannan over Garcia

If Hannan had JJ’s CV yes we would.

But he doesn’t.

However for other reasons (Bevo) I’m expecting Hannan to retain his spot anyway.

 

[Bulldog rick]

I hope buku gets a game this week anyone agree?

 

[Dog 36]

I hope buku gets a game this week anyone agree?

Play him. I get the feeling we will hear something along the lines that Bev wants the players who played Saturday to have the opportunity to make all the wrongs right.

Lobb out means one change for sure not sure they will go for Buku may look at a Garcia (run and grunt)