List Mgmt. 2021 Trade Thread - Part II

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George

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Aug 17, 2015
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Continued in Part III

List Mgmt. - 2021 Trade Thread - Part III

We are onto Part 3.
www.bigfooty.com www.bigfooty.com


Delisted;
Oscar Clavarino
Sam Alabakis

Traded;
-

Retired;
Jake Carlisle
Dylan Roberton
Shaun McKernan
James Frawley


Current Players Out of Contract;
7. Luke Dunstan (RFA) - Link
13. Jack Lonie - Link
25. Dean Kent - Link
39. Darragh Joyce - Link
41. Paul Hunter - Link


To see the full list (it gets updated regularly) visit this thread;

www.bigfooty.com

List & Contract Status

SENIOR LIST 1. Jack Higgins 2. Marcus Windhager 3. Zak Jones 4. Lance Collard 5. Brad Crouch 6. Sebastian Ross 7. Nasiah Wanganeen-Milera 8. Bradley Hill 9. Jack Steele 10. Mitchito Owens 11. Hunter Clark 12. Max King 13. Ryan Byrnes 14. Liam Stocker 15. Paddy Dow 16. Daniel Butler 17. Isaac...
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Restricted and Unrestricted Free Agency Window
Friday October 1 – Friday October 8

Trade Period
Players: Monday October 4 – Wednesday October 13
Picks: Monday October 4 – tbc (approx. Friday November 19)

List Lodgement 1
tbc (approx. Thursday October 28)

Delisted Free Agency Window 1
tbc (approx. Friday October 29 - Monday November 8)

List Lodgement 2 (Final date for primary list delistings)
tbc (approx. Tuesday November 9)

Delisted Free Agency Window 2
tbc (approx. Wednesday November 10 - Friday November 19)
 
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gringo2011 said:
He's still around Crouch level. I think it's dumb to deliberately weaken your list. You guys just like to believe in the club making the right decision every time even if it doesn't make sense. Bruce was a sh*t hack and then went to the Dogs and is a fan favourite there and came fourth in the Coleman.

We are going to give away 2 firsts to chase King now who we hope might become a 50 goal forward while we still need top end talent in the midfield. Sometimes the club does things that aren't very sensible.

So far we have had one year with a spot in finals but otherwise have been sleeping in the lower part of the middle rungs for years. Even last year we only won 10, this year- 10 wins, 2019 - 9 wins, 2018 - 4 games, 2017- 11 wins, 2016 - 12 wins. How long do we have to wait to actually be competitive?
Click to expand...

With Dunstan, clearly, We are targeting a mid with our first pick and have two mids that hopefully would come in as NGA's. All of whom better our list. Dunstan is serviceable and did well in the games he was in. We've had him on our list for those years you've highlighted and hasn't taken us to the next level.
Is he winning us our next flag? Probably not.
 
ScrappyDo said:
He is not around Crouch level. Crouch has better disposal, covers more ground and has a consistency of high possession counts that Dunny can't get near. A 6 game purple patch does not redefine a whole career. And Ross is sh*t too!!!
Click to expand...


Well I guess we'll revisit it next year if e'splaying well elsewhere. Hopefully we aren't still crying about letting players go at the same point next year. Ratts is gone if we are.
 
gringo2011 said:
Well I guess we'll revisit it next year if e'splaying well elsewhere. Hopefully we aren't still crying about letting players go at the same point next year. Ratts is gone if we are.
Click to expand...
Dunstan is the ultimate list clogger , can only play one position - it's just time to move him on and bring youth in from the draft.
Having him as depth on the list would still hinder the kids on the list trying to get a midfield spot at Sandringham.
Onwards and upwards.
 

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gringo2011 said:
Well I guess we'll revisit it next year if e'splaying well elsewhere. Hopefully we aren't still crying about letting players go at the same point next year. Ratts is gone if we are.
Click to expand...
That's all true enough. We don't have the luxury of being cautious though. As Lethers said a while back, We are in pursuit of the club's next premiership, and we are proceeding with upmost haste.
Now I'll take that over the previous 8 or 9 years of SFA..
 
gringo2011 said:
He's still around Crouch level. I think it's dumb to deliberately weaken your list. You guys just like to believe in the club making the right decision every time even if it doesn't make sense. Bruce was a sh*t hack and then went to the Dogs and is a fan favourite there and came fourth in the Coleman.

We are going to give away 2 firsts to chase King now who we hope might become a 50 goal forward while we still need top end talent in the midfield. Sometimes the club does things that aren't very sensible.

So far we have had one year with a spot in finals but otherwise have been sleeping in the lower part of the middle rungs for years. Even last year we only won 10, this year- 10 wins, 2019 - 9 wins, 2018 - 4 games, 2017- 11 wins, 2016 - 12 wins. How long do we have to wait to actually be competitive?
Click to expand...
As you said we can always pick up Dom Tyson - ha ha ha
 
Premium said:
Dunstan is the ultimate list clogger , can only play one position - it's just time to move him on and bring youth in from the draft.
Having him as depth on the list would still hinder the kids on the list trying to get a midfield spot at Sandringham.
Onwards and upwards.
Click to expand...
I disagree he's a clogger. He is outstanding depth. The kind you want for a premiership window.
However that kind is always gonna be tempted for opportunities at another club.
 
bird_man said:
Still no news on Ross signing a contract which is a little odd
Click to expand...
You would assume he is going, AFL don't want any players or mangers talking about free agency players until 30/09 & as for Dunny maybe he doesn't want to stay as much as the club doesn't want him he is looking for more game time instead of being depth.
 
bird_man said:
A lot of sides also use their wing as another midfield rotation which might work and give guys like Clark more time around the footy.

We could have Jones, Ross and Clark rotating between on ball, and wing.
Click to expand...
Having watched all the U18 trial games, I'd be half inclined to plonk Owens out there.. 190cm, fast, competitive, huge running capacity, can take a mark, kicking I'm not sure about just yet though. He will bang the door down from a wing at Sandy that's for sure.
 
joydivision22 said:
Having watched all the U18 trial games, I'd be half inclined to plonk Owens out there.. 190cm, fast, competitive, huge running capacity, can take a mark, kicking I'm not sure about just yet though. He will bang the door down from a wing at Sandy that's for sure.
Click to expand...
He will probably still take a bit of time IMO. Especially with how little footy he's played in 2 years.

He looks a very good long term prospect though.
 
ScrappyDo said:
Not at all.
On the 7 years of evidence to that point they were entirely justified in their beliefs. There were a few games mid season to give them pause for thought, followed by a couple that reconfirmed the original status quo.
It looks like they were honest and matter of fact about where our midfield was at and prioritized Bytel's development (fair enough).
Now that the season has ended they've not changed their opinions despite what some silly posters here might have to say about Bytel not performing to AA standards after 13 games.
Click to expand...
Its pretty straight forward - tell everyone on your list at the start of the year that we will pick on form not on hunches - then stick to it.

Then when its mathematically impossible to play finals - then you can start thinking about "development".

People crap on about Richo playing "favourites" but clearly Ratts had a view about Bytel last season and has been proved wrong.

Dunstan came in as a 19 YO in 2014 and played 16 games - and cracked 20 possessions 7 times and everyone said - we've got a keeper.

Unfortunately Bytel comes in as 21 YO, played 13 games last year and only managed to crack 20 possessions once in that time. Some are very easily seduced by the word "potential".

Bytel might become a player but just like Long or Battle, I'm yet to be convinced.
 
ScrappyDo said:
I disagree he's a clogger. He is outstanding depth. The kind you want for a premiership window.
However that kind is always gonna be tempted for opportunities at another club.
Click to expand...
I view him as a list clogger , has been in the system for years and has been dropped several times before and is taking a spot of a kid being developed - we have to continuously improve our squad and midfield if it needs it and he has been in the system for 8yrs and been given every chance to perform and good on him he turned it on this year to hopefully extend his career - we pick up 3 mids in the draft , Byrne , Bytel , Gresham , Clark I fully expect we will be right.
We have delisted and moved on many players - Bruce , Hind , Newnes , Acres who were regulars and it has given us a bunch of new kids into the squad that has breathed live in to the team with guys like Highmore , Sharman , Connolly , Byrne etc.
 
shlong said:
With Dunstan, clearly, We are targeting a mid with our first pick and have two mids that hopefully would come in as NGA's. All of whom better our list. Dunstan is serviceable and did well in the games he was in. We've had him on our list for those years you've highlighted and hasn't taken us to the next level.
Is he winning us our next flag? Probably not.
Click to expand...

You really think teams are so confident in their draft choices?

a) Its really hard to target a specific mid in a draft when you have 10 people picking players in front of you.
b) Most draftee's don't play much first year.
c) Some draftees will be spuds. If we get 3 who are still on the list in 5 years time, we've done well.
 
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pebblesofsand said:
Its pretty straight forward - tell everyone on your list at the start of the year that we will pick on form not on hunches - then stick to it.

Then when its mathematically impossible to play finals - then you can start thinking about "development".

People crap on about Richo playing "favourites" but clearly Ratts had a view about Bytel last season and has been proved wrong.

Dunstan came in as a 19 YO in 2014 and played 16 games - and cracked 20 possessions 7 times and everyone said - we've got a keeper.

Unfortunately Bytel comes in as 21 YO, played 13 games last year and only managed to crack 20 possessions once in that time. Some are very easily seduced by the word "potential".

Bytel might become a player but just like Long or Battle, I'm yet to be convinced.
Click to expand...
It's very different to what Ratten said publicly.

Apparently there was spot available. Bytel played better leading up to round one so was ahead of Dunstan and got the spot.
 
pebblesofsand said:
Its pretty straight forward - tell everyone on your list at the start of the year that we will pick on form not on hunches - then stick to it.

Then when its mathematically impossible to play finals - then you can start thinking about "development".

People crap on about Richo playing "favourites" but clearly Ratts had a view about Bytel last season and has been proved wrong.

Dunstan came in as a 19 YO in 2014 and played 16 games - and cracked 20 possessions 7 times and everyone said - we've got a keeper.

Unfortunately Bytel comes in as 21 YO, played 13 games last year and only managed to crack 20 possessions once in that time. Some are very easily seduced by the word "potential".

Bytel might become a player but just like Long or Battle, I'm yet to be convinced.
Click to expand...
Bytel could well be a bust but you can not compare Dunstan at the same age - Dunstan came into the system as a kid they said was ready to go.Luke Dunstan (Woodville-West Torrens)

Height: 184 cm
Weight: 84 kg
Position: Midfielder
Player Comparison: Sam Mitchell, Scott Pendlebury
Strengths: Endurance, leadership, ball-winning ability, contested disposal/possession
Weaknesses: Opposite foot disposal

Like Dom Sheed, Luke Dunstan is another player who is difficult to place in this year’s draft. His elite kicking and endurance ability could see him chosen anywhere between pick 10 to 20, depending on the needs of other clubs before him. We’ve chosen him at pick eight here as he will be a perfect fit for West Coast. His ability to amass a heap of disposals, combined with the ferocity of his tackling and contested ball-winning ability, makes him a standout prospect this year.

However, perhaps Dunstan’s biggest strength is his leadership ability. He was made captain of the South Australia under-18 Championship squad this season, and was an integral member of the AFL-AIS Academy. On the AIS trip to Europe, Dunstan was touted as a future leader, as he was, according to the AFL’s Cal Twomey, one player who would always bring his teammates back into line, and ensure everyone was working their hardest. For a young player to come to a club with this leadership ability already under his belt is a massive benefit, and is something the Eagles would also benefit from in their young midfield.

When he plays as a midfielder, Dunstan is prolific, racking up both uncontested and contested possessions. Throughout the Championships, he averaged 22 disposals, and earned South Australian MVP honours, along with teammate Matt Scharenberg. One of Dunstan’s big strengths is his ability to play as a half-forward. He performs exceptionally well in this role, being an excellent overhead mark, and is an accurate kick for goal. This versatility is yet another string to his bow, and another added benefit for an Eagles team sorely lacking in tall half-forwards, especially given the injuries to Mark LeCras and Mark Nicoski this season.

//////
Bytel came into the draft hardly playing much football the year before the draft , then his draft year he never played , the following year VFL was hardly played and the same this year so no way can you compare the to at this early stage.
He needs game time whether it is in the VFL or whatever.

In the Dunstan write up they said he had elite kicking and endurance and is a good overhead mark - false news.
 
joydivision22 said:
Having watched all the U18 trial games, I'd be half inclined to plonk Owens out there.. 190cm, fast, competitive, huge running capacity, can take a mark, kicking I'm not sure about just yet though. He will bang the door down from a wing at Sandy that's for sure.
Click to expand...
Big fan of this. Give us some excitement with some players we haven’t seen yet!
 
pebblesofsand said:
Its pretty straight forward - tell everyone on your list at the start of the year that we will pick on form not on hunches - then stick to it.

Then when its mathematically impossible to play finals - then you can start thinking about "development".

People crap on about Richo playing "favourites" but clearly Ratts had a view about Bytel last season and has been proved wrong.

Dunstan came in as a 19 YO in 2014 and played 16 games - and cracked 20 possessions 7 times and everyone said - we've got a keeper.

Unfortunately Bytel comes in as 21 YO, played 13 games last year and only managed to crack 20 possessions once in that time. Some are very easily seduced by the word "potential".

Bytel might become a player but just like Long or Battle, I'm yet to be convinced.
Click to expand...
With all due respect, this is complete tripe.

Committing games to develop a young player is NOT playing favorites.
Ratts view was made clear in his recent interview stating that he's been given the roll of running with the oppo's best mid for his development. This was OBVIOUS upon viewing and is in no small part the reason for his alleged low numbers that weren't by any means low for a 10 gamer.
Only on the planet were every junior is expected to hit the same numbers as Bailey Smith did in a packed elite midfield does Bytel's performance not measure up.
SaintsSeptember posted Lenny's first season numbers and they were near identical, Bytel actually ahead on several crucial stats.

Bytel "not performing" is a forum myth.
 
Premium said:
Bytel could well be a bust but you can not compare Dunstan at the same age - Dunstan came into the system as a kid they said was ready to go.Luke Dunstan (Woodville-West Torrens)

Height: 184 cm
Weight: 84 kg
Position: Midfielder
Player Comparison: Sam Mitchell, Scott Pendlebury
Strengths: Endurance, leadership, ball-winning ability, contested disposal/possession
Weaknesses: Opposite foot disposal

Like Dom Sheed, Luke Dunstan is another player who is difficult to place in this year’s draft. His elite kicking and endurance ability could see him chosen anywhere between pick 10 to 20, depending on the needs of other clubs before him. We’ve chosen him at pick eight here as he will be a perfect fit for West Coast. His ability to amass a heap of disposals, combined with the ferocity of his tackling and contested ball-winning ability, makes him a standout prospect this year.

However, perhaps Dunstan’s biggest strength is his leadership ability. He was made captain of the South Australia under-18 Championship squad this season, and was an integral member of the AFL-AIS Academy. On the AIS trip to Europe, Dunstan was touted as a future leader, as he was, according to the AFL’s Cal Twomey, one player who would always bring his teammates back into line, and ensure everyone was working their hardest. For a young player to come to a club with this leadership ability already under his belt is a massive benefit, and is something the Eagles would also benefit from in their young midfield.

When he plays as a midfielder, Dunstan is prolific, racking up both uncontested and contested possessions. Throughout the Championships, he averaged 22 disposals, and earned South Australian MVP honours, along with teammate Matt Scharenberg. One of Dunstan’s big strengths is his ability to play as a half-forward. He performs exceptionally well in this role, being an excellent overhead mark, and is an accurate kick for goal. This versatility is yet another string to his bow, and another added benefit for an Eagles team sorely lacking in tall half-forwards, especially given the injuries to Mark LeCras and Mark Nicoski this season.

//////
Bytel came into the draft hardly playing much football the year before the draft , then his draft year he never played , the following year VFL was hardly played and the same this year so no way can you compare the to at this early stage.
He needs game time whether it is in the VFL or whatever.

In the Dunstan write up they said he had elite kicking and endurance and is a good overhead mark - false news.
Click to expand...
So basically exactly what I'm saying - it was obvious Dunstan would be able to play AFL to a reasonable standard.

As for Bytel, I'll be more than happy if he busts out some 25+ games next year but as I say - he's yet to convince me he will be anything more than a GOP.
(not there's anything wrong with being a GOP - every team has them and needs them - jeez he might even take Dunnie's GOP spot)

Actually I'd love him to become the type of player he reckoned he was (ahh the foolishness of youth!!!)

“I like to describe myself to clubs as a contested type of player, good around stoppages and I win clearances,” Bytel said pre-draft.

“I like to think you can build a midfield around the type of player I am, a contested player and a tall inside mid.”
 
joydivision22 said:
Midfielders need to be able to roll forward and rotate, absolutely. I consider this part of the position and this is the position our 'all-rounders' should be found. Otherwise forwards should be kept in the forward line, much like defenders are. Clearly having x1 KP swingman on your list is worthwhile but I'm just so over the constant flinging around of positions.

Billings was a forward foremost when he was drafted, lets keep him there. Coffield was always a HBF foremost, let's keep him there. Battle is our swingman, but he needs to get a run in one spot this year and I'm hoping it's CHB. Clark started as a HBF and moved into the midfield in his draft year, time he graduates into an AFL Midfield now but I wouldn't be shocked if he stays at HB.

McKenzie should be our starting LHS Winger and stay there. The other wing is a point of contention, Hill should be able to reclaim it but I have my doubts unless we're playing at Optus or the MCG. Don't know who else can play this role properly.
Click to expand...

I wish i could express myself as well as this. Bingo
 
pebblesofsand said:
So basically exactly what I'm saying - it was obvious Dunstan would be able to play AFL to a reasonable standard.

As for Bytel, I'll be more than happy if he busts out some 25+ games next year but as I say - he's yet to convince me he will be anything more than a GOP.
(not there's anything wrong with being a GOP - every team has them and needs them - jeez he might even take Dunnie's GOP spot)

Actually I'd love him to become the type of player he reckoned he was (ahh the foolishness of youth!!!)

“I like to describe myself to clubs as a contested type of player, good around stoppages and I win clearances,” Bytel said pre-draft.

“I like to think you can build a midfield around the type of player I am, a contested player and a tall inside mid.”
Click to expand...
Worth watching this series. “Jack Bytel is rated as the best inside mid in this draft” he was selected ahead of his draft year to be in a documentary following Sam Walsh, Max, Ben and himself. All top 10 picks there. All elite A grader bound. Shows how highly he was rated. Once he shows some of that potential we’ll be laughing. Should make Bailey smith look piss weak

 
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