Preview 2023 Goodbye (To 2024) New; Preseason Discussion

[TeeKray]

Assuming Wines gets back to something approaching what he is capable of, there should be more than enough midfield minutes for him, Rozee, Butters and JHF.

I'm happy for Boak to play a wing or half forward type role. He's an experienced head, fit as a fiddle, can plug straight into the midfield proper if an injury pops up. No issue there.

Drew is the more interesting one. He's one of our most reliable players and our only defensive minded midfielder but we're literally talking about a midfield rotation that features a Brownlow medalist and three others who could potentially win a Brownlow in their own right. It's a difficult balancing act.

 

[wayb2912]

We are going to win the flag

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[Scodges]

That was over 20 years ago when the amount of rotations were minimal - barely 20 per game.

And it worked because the secondary guys like Notting, Lappin etc could rotate through other parts of the ground.

If you assume that Rozee and Butters and Port's two primary on ballers, of their three secondary guys (JHF, Wines and Drew) only JHF has shown that he can play in another part of the ground. Both Drew and Wines are strictly on ballers, they have not shown at any point in their career that they can play in another part of the ground.

They're going to have a log jam in the midfield and it will either result in IJF seeing significantly less minutes in the middle to accommodate Drew and Wines which will no doubt hinder his development, or they will move Rozee and Butters out of the middle more often, which I simply don't agree with considering they're our two best guys in that position.

We have good depth, can only be a good thing.
I trust Carr to make it work.


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[Chewy316]

We have good depth, can only be a good thing.
I trust Carr to make it work.


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Depth is a great problem to have provided you're picking the right balance in the team. It's fine for instance to have a gluttony of rucks in the squad (think Primus, Brogan, Lade, French etc). But it becomes a problem when you try to play 3 of them all in the same team.

Depth becomes a negative problem when you're diluting player roles to fit everyone in the team particularly at the expense of the team balance which impacts your two top players in particular - Rozee and Butters.

We saw last year Wines spend significant portions of his game on a wing. It was to the detriment of the side. Now they say Wines will be exclusively on ball this year. Well that is going to dilute the Rozee, Butters, JHF and Drew minutes on the ball.

It's going to be a headache regardless of how much they're talking it up this pre-season.

 

[Poo Eckert]

We are going to win the flag

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You should be banned

 

[Ah12]

If Wines has another year similar to last year he shouldnt be in our midfield. I dont know where else you can play him in the team if thats the case. Hopefully he is back closer to his best. I fear him and Boak shouldnt be in our side if its more of the same.

Like Wines, Boak is not a wingmen. He found bugger all of the footy in that role. I also have no idea how he fits in the team.

 

[Ah12]

If i see Dixon hobbling around in round 1 i dont think ill bother watching the season. Can understand last year given what we had available but this year there is no excuse to be playing injured players.

 

[Schulzenfest]

Drew is the odd man out. He's the fifth best player in what should be a four man midfield rotation. Unless he can reinvent himself like SPP did, he can't play anywhere else. This is why I questioned his five year contract. People mostly mocked me at the time but now some of you are coming around.

 

[Jonts]

Drew as the defensive winger rather than the "skinny" winger is a fine option and not worth stressing about. He can negate there enough

 

[Ah12]

Drew is the odd man out. He's the fifth best player in what should be a four man midfield rotation. Unless he can reinvent himself like SPP did, he can't play anywhere else. This is why I questioned his five year contract. People mostly mocked me at the time but now some of you are coming around.

I felt like Drew elevated his game last season. Started to add some run and carry to his game. Watch the final 5 minutes of a close game and you will see why Drew is important to us. When its on the line to be won his 1%’ers and defensive acts are huge and its easy for them to go unnoticed.

Hes also our only mid that can do a shutdown role if needed. Can match it with the big bodies and was able to keep Bont quiet last year, no mean feat in itself. 5 years is on the long aide but i have no doubt he is in our best 22.

 

[PatientMental]

Drew is the odd man out. He's the fifth best player in what should be a four man midfield rotation. Unless he can reinvent himself like SPP did, he can't play anywhere else. This is why I questioned his five year contract. People mostly mocked me at the time but now some of you are coming around.

I can see them using drew as the anchor mid against good teams where the other 2 mids will be free wheeling front runners.

But he will be used sparingly against bad teams when we can run all 3 mids as free wheeling front runners.

This will cause a Jekyll and Hyde situation of being very free flowing against slop and slop against stronger teams.

 

[Shaucob_Burjan]

Just a thought, but can Drew play that defensive forward role?

 

[Rash]

Just a thought, but can Drew play that defensive forward role?

we have enough defensiive fwds tho, the likes of mcentee (who should be delisted but ken will give him a game), DBJ and spp to an extent. we need crafty goal kickers as small fwds

 

[Lefti93]

We didn't give Jay Schulz

Jay Schulz

Age

39

Ht

193cm

Wt

94kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

10.6

3star

K

7.1

3star

HB

3.5

3star

M

5.1

5star

T

1.9

4star

G

1.7

5star

No current season stats available

D

3.6

1star

K

2.4

1star

HB

1.2

2star

M

1.4

2star

T

0.2

3star

G

0.8

4star

who's body was cooked an extra season, but we've given Charlie who is arguably more cooked another season to limp around. Give me a cooked Jay over a cooked Charlie any day man.

 

[Powerade 08]

We didn't give Jay Schulz who's body was cooked an extra season, but we've given Charlie who is arguably more cooked another season to limp around. Give me a cooked Jay over a cooked Charlie any day man.

It’s not an extra season it’s an extra 6 seasons. Although to be fair he was good in the COVID years.

 

[chiwigi]

Finlayson and Georgiadas should be our wings.

Rest the midfielders at half forward.

 

[philthy05]

Like Wines, Boak is not a wingmen. He found bugger all of the footy in that role. I also have no idea how he fits in the team.

Boak can play wing and is much a wingman as anyone.

He doesn’t get a tonne of ball in that role because we don’t play through the wings.

When has a wingman averaged a lot of touches under Hinkley?

Amons 23d years were playing behind the ball, as a true wing he averaged 16d.

Drew is the odd man out. He's the fifth best player in what should be a four man midfield rotation. Unless he can reinvent himself like SPP did, he can't play anywhere else. This is why I questioned his five year contract. People mostly mocked me at the time but now some of you are coming around.

Sure he’s arguably 5th banana as long as wines is in form and healthy.

Wines is 29 and struggled with his health.

How many years can we expect him to be better than drew for?

I’m pretty glad we’ve got a ready to go guy locked up for post wines.

As for Drew this year? well jhf will likely spend plenty of time forward again as he’s so dangerous there and screws with teams matchups moving him around and at 20 years old he’s still building that tank , and I’ve got no issue with playing Drew some minutes on the wing in a gameplan that floods the midfield and there’s no such thing as open space on the wings.

But if Drew spends time in the sanfl this year all good. He’s there and reliable when we need him.

 

[Pappagallo]

Why do I get the sense that the regime will be lamenting our lack of genuine wingmen at the end of our season?

 

[manureid]

Why do I get the sense that the regime will be lamenting our lack of genuine wingmen at the end of our season?

Will provide the coach with another excuse, so mission accomplished.

 

[Schulzenfest]

Why do I get the sense that the regime will be lamenting our lack of genuine wingmen at the end of our season?

We'll probably trade out Esava and BZT to bring a ready made wingman in at the end of the year.

 

[Peninsula Boy]

There is nothing wrong with having 5 in the rotation in the midfield with Rozee, Butters, Horne-Francis, Wines and Drew.

 

[afl2004]

Drew is the odd man out. He's the fifth best player in what should be a four man midfield rotation. Unless he can reinvent himself like SPP did, he can't play anywhere else. This is why I questioned his five year contract. People mostly mocked me at the time but now some of you are coming around.

Could Tyson Stengle, Braun and chad fletcher because they couldn't play well up forward but were in the midfield instead of judd for entries qtrs In 06

 

[shewho]

There is nothing wrong with having 5 in the rotation in the midfield with Rozee, Butters, Horne-Francis, Wines and Drew.

Exactly- Wines and Drew provide the ball winning grunt (which we lacked in the finals), Rozee and Butters provide the flair/burst/speed and Horne-Francis will increasingly provide both ball winning grunt and flair/burst/speed.

Wines and Drew both had 50% CBAs last year behind Rozee 69%, Butters 62%, JHF 58% and a few guest appearances. Good midfielders spend about 85% Time on Ground. So if Wines, Butters, Rozee and JHF all spend about 65% of time in the guts and 20% of time up forward, that would leave Drew with 40% time in the guts and 45% time on a wing (becoming the +1 at stoppages around the ground).

Given that I would back Butters, Rozee, JHF and Wines to win most centre clearances against any other team in the comp (and increasingly so over time), the need for a defensive mid (Drew) at centre bounces will decline. Drew can do his defensive role after the centre clearance is won.

 

[TazD]

Drew and Wines play 100% midfield. One of Rozee, Butters, and JHF rotate forward and play the Martin/Petracca role. Boak doesn't play unless one of the other five is injured/suspended.

 

[TazD]

We are going to win the flag

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