Not commenting on anything other than for your "system" to mean anything, you'd have to do it for every other club in the league. You'd also probably have to include the travel clubs do to get home after away games.
Opinion VICBias - Genuine Discussion
- Thread starter Hank Heavenly
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Not commenting on anything other than for your "system" to mean anything, you'd have to do it for every other club in the league. You'd also probably have to include the travel clubs do to get home after away games.
Massive Vic biase.
From the start. VFL broke. Needed cash injection from new interstate teams and resulting increase in tv rights to survive and then thrive.
All VFL clubs needed to agree to terms for new sides, so it needed to be juicy for the Vic clubs to agree.
Two sets of AFL CEO’s thought there were too many clubs in Melbourne but couldn’t force the issue.
Fitzroy were the sacrificial lamb. Vic clubs didn’t want to create a monster by allowing North Fitzroy to merge. Best option was to feed the Lions to Brisbane.
Then when Brisbane and Sydney became strong, Vic clubs up in arms.
Now the vast majority of media and administration is still based in Melbourne, it’s maintained the bias.
The AFL in all reality is an extension of the VFL. It benefits from TV rights due to the expansion north, despite not enough players up there to fill sides. WA and SA are still having players picked off to supplement this growth, extra to the teams they have playing in the competition. The reason these states/teams joined the VFL/AFL in the first place.
A strong and fair-fixtured 14 team national competition should be the way forward. 7 Vic teams and 7 interstate teams (no Gold Coast). Those Vic teams should play some home games in regions without AFL teams to grow the game. This would also help even up the interstate travel each club is required to do.
This would also help strengthen the VFL/SANFL/WAFL. These competitions, if treated properly, could add value in several ways to the game of Aussie Rules and the product that is the AFL.
From the start. VFL broke. Needed cash injection from new interstate teams and resulting increase in tv rights to survive and then thrive.
All VFL clubs needed to agree to terms for new sides, so it needed to be juicy for the Vic clubs to agree.
Two sets of AFL CEO’s thought there were too many clubs in Melbourne but couldn’t force the issue.
Fitzroy were the sacrificial lamb. Vic clubs didn’t want to create a monster by allowing North Fitzroy to merge. Best option was to feed the Lions to Brisbane.
Then when Brisbane and Sydney became strong, Vic clubs up in arms.
Now the vast majority of media and administration is still based in Melbourne, it’s maintained the bias.
The AFL in all reality is an extension of the VFL. It benefits from TV rights due to the expansion north, despite not enough players up there to fill sides. WA and SA are still having players picked off to supplement this growth, extra to the teams they have playing in the competition. The reason these states/teams joined the VFL/AFL in the first place.
A strong and fair-fixtured 14 team national competition should be the way forward. 7 Vic teams and 7 interstate teams (no Gold Coast). Those Vic teams should play some home games in regions without AFL teams to grow the game. This would also help even up the interstate travel each club is required to do.
This would also help strengthen the VFL/SANFL/WAFL. These competitions, if treated properly, could add value in several ways to the game of Aussie Rules and the product that is the AFL.
LOL
Would have to be one of the dumbest posts I've ever read.
Congratulations.
The amount of scientific non bias material explaining how travel impacts recovery and injury management is extensive. But hey, lets come up with something so simple (and bias) to use instead of scientific non bias facts to support your 'straw man' argument and claim victory.
Whatever makes you happy buddy!!!!
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Depends on 'who' is being biased. As the definition states here it's an inclination or prejudice.
The thread title gives the impression that every single victorian has an inclination against and to pre judge anything non vic. That means intent to pre judge from an emotive perspective.
If you put your emotions aside for just one and don't let it cloud your judgement, there is no known universe where this could possibly be true.
Ok there are some in the media and others who transparently pre judge intentionally. I doubt that represents the majority.
And yes on face value it looks like the landscape is set up to favour the vics, and it is for reasons that I and many others have explained ad nauseum and hve been rejected ad nauseum.
HQ do not have a thinly veiled disdain for non vic, again it's all about reasons.
Yet many on here who seem so pissed off continue to put up with it and continually whinge.
Barking at clouds on a forum will get you nowhere, set up a petition for change or vote with your feet and your remote. Imagine if every non vic fan actually snubbed the league and reinvigorated the state leagues. That would then change the reasons wouldn't it!
Or you can continue to be pissed off, everyone has a choice.
Gold Coast is the 6th largest city in the country, there is more merit in the Gold Coast remaining and having 6 teams in Victoria (5 in Melbourne)
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On numbers alone thats hard to argue...
But name one professional sporting team that has survived there?
It's a really hard market as it's a tourist driven venue rather than a parochial "suburban" local venue
The only near football issue I have ever seen of any Vicbias is the GF at the MCG. And to play there is a commercial decision not a football decision.
I agree some AFL decisions have promoted certain Melbourne clubs but its probably more to the detriment of other Melbourne clubs than those out of Melbourne.
Those who continue on about travel... what? If its that bad get your club to relocate to Melbourne, play their 10 away games in a row and stay home for the rest of the season (sarcasm)
Seriously Melbourne has a population of about 5.1 mill (not sure if it includes Geelong) so 1 team for about every 500K people.
Perth 2.4 mill for two teams or 1.2 mill per person. Adelaide nearly 1.8 mill for 2 teams - 900k each.
Maybe Covid19 will force the issue. Could 2 Melbourne teams relocate to Perth and 1 to Adelaide? Easy to say, my team are probably safe.
But as for bias. Nah.
As for the media - what do you expect? I was in QLD in 2017 when the Storm beat Nth Qld in the NRL GF. The papers went with Maroons players win GF. Maybe parochialism more than bias. Same happens in very state with AFL.
I agree some AFL decisions have promoted certain Melbourne clubs but its probably more to the detriment of other Melbourne clubs than those out of Melbourne.
Those who continue on about travel... what? If its that bad get your club to relocate to Melbourne, play their 10 away games in a row and stay home for the rest of the season (sarcasm)
Seriously Melbourne has a population of about 5.1 mill (not sure if it includes Geelong) so 1 team for about every 500K people.
Perth 2.4 mill for two teams or 1.2 mill per person. Adelaide nearly 1.8 mill for 2 teams - 900k each.
Maybe Covid19 will force the issue. Could 2 Melbourne teams relocate to Perth and 1 to Adelaide? Easy to say, my team are probably safe.
But as for bias. Nah.
As for the media - what do you expect? I was in QLD in 2017 when the Storm beat Nth Qld in the NRL GF. The papers went with Maroons players win GF. Maybe parochialism more than bias. Same happens in very state with AFL.
If covid forces the issue then it's likely gc or a smaller vic club would go under. I doubt relocation would work, their fans (revenue) wouldn't adopt the idea. North is an example of that (their members rejected the move to the GC).
As for the rest of your post, it's close to the mark. Apart from using cities instead of states to gauge a number of fans per team. There's probably more fans per club if you look at the whole.
Victoria has about 1.2 mill not in Melbourne so that's average at 120K per club, WA has about 300K not in Perth so it actually increases the numbers per club by 150K. I made an error and had The SA number not Adelaide so the 900k is for the state about 700K in Adelaide.
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Why? Even the least supported club in Melbourne at the moment has significantly more financial support from members and attendances than GC. Let alone the 6th ranked Melb club.
#VICBIAS is a handy shortcut but you're absolutely right. I suspect that for smaller Vic clubs state pride must trump all or they've put up with it for 100+ years so can't imagine better alternatives than being screwed over by the old VFL Big 4 (or so), otherwise they'll be demanding Collingwood and Richmond travel down the road to Geelong or travel down to Tasmania at the very least.
Or head over to China.
He played in a superior league. You're not comparing apples with apples
Sorry to pick on your post like this.
Richmond have been to Kardinia Park 15 times since 1990. Once every two years on average seems pretty fair to me.
Collingwood have been three times (1991, 1995, 1999). West Coast have been 21 times. I think your anger should be pointed at Geelong going to Perth rather than Richmond going to Geelong.
Richmond have also traveled to Tasmania where Collingwood haven't.
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Must admit I just threw in the first two big Vic clubs I could think of. Nailed Collingwood, was wrong with Richmond in that example.
The discrepancy is pretty nuts. Collingwood three times vs West Coast 21 times in the same timeframe. This is what we mean when we use #VICBIAS as a shortcut to cover a range of issues. Collingwood will never travel as far as the Eagles, everyone accepts that, but they don't even travel down the road to Geelong ffs.
Geelong earn more money by hosting the game at the MCG. Collingwood are easily the highest averaged games since 1997 (58594 - 6500 more than Hawthorn in second). This average also includes the round 15, 1999 game where 24395 went to Kardinia Park.
I gotta say, I didn't check Geelong either - they may have played a heap in Perth.
See that shouldn't happen. Geelong should play all home games in Geelong or all at the MCG, not small or non-Vic clubs in Geelong and Collingwood at Collingwood's home ground. Ridiculous advantage to Geelong and Collingwood. Same goes for Hawthorn's opponents in Tasmania (although I'm hoping that deal ends when a Tassie team joins the comp). Eagles are always heading there to play Hawthorn or North. Have Collingwood or other big Vic clubs?
I feel like they come over quite often. But every Vic club should come over at least once, to play either the Eagles or Dockers (rotating each year). But I remember North for one have come over twice during the home and away season. That shouldn't really happen because it doesn't happen to the big clubs.
It should be #BigVicClubBias because the small Vic clubs are just as screwed over, but that doesn't roll off the tongue as well or promote state rivalries as well ... Which in a way also benefits the big clubs because it seems that state pride trumps all.
Senor M
SFAEW World Heavyweight Champion
Since 2012 (when North Melbourne started playing in Hobart) The West Coast have been there three times--- as has Sydney, St. Kilda & Melbourne, while Richmond has been there twice.
This is where #VICBIAS seems to struggle for legitimacy in my opinion because it's often based on 'gut feel' and observations rather than evidence & data.
York Park
Hawthorn - 64 games
St Kilda - 12 games
Fremantle - 12 games
Port Adelaide - 10 games
Brisbane - 10 games
West Coast - 7 games
Carlton - 2 games
Richmond - 1 game
Collingwood - 0 games
Essendon - 0 games
Dat gut feel hey?
Non Vic and small Vic clubs cop the brunt of it BY FAR when it should be shared around.
And that's just one oval, expand it and it becomes even more noticeable. There's only been one AFL game played at Blacktown. Guess who GWS's opponents were? Hint: It wasn't a big Victorian club or even a team from the eastern two thirds of the country. The Eagles have played as many games at Manuka in Canberra as Richmond, Collingwood, Hawthorn and Essendon combined. As have Freo. Port have played twice as many.
Eagles and Dockers will always travel more. We all accept that. But * me.
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Senor M
SFAEW World Heavyweight Champion
How many times have West Coast been to York Park in the past 5 years? How about the last decade??
Your original comment was...
West Coast has played at York Park ONCE in the past decade and 3 times in Hobart for a total of 4 games in a decade. But yes you're "always heading there"
So now you're complaining about the Eagles having to spend an extra 20 minutes on the bus to get to Blacktown Oval (instead of the Sydney Showgrounnds) in 2012 when the Giants were playing their 3rd ever game.
...and complaining that The Eagles had to play games in Canberra in 2002, 2004 & 2006?
Maybe, but that's not how the Melbourne clubs are setup. Stadiums were rationalised and big games are played at the MCG so the competing clubs can earn more money. Carlton and Essendon have never played eachother at Ettihad even though both are tenants. Should those games be shifted back to Ettihad even though they average 59243 crowds as a Carlton home game and 61189 as an Essendon home game since 1997?
Maybe pre-2012 West Coast did a few extra trips to Tasmania but for the past 8 years not so much. Also, remember St Kilda played home games at York Park.
Why would Hawthorn want to play high attendance games in Tasmania anyway? What is the benefit for them? To lose more money on attendance from not getting a 50000+ crowd at the MCG? Really doesn't make sense. Same goes for the AFL - why would they send a Collingwood, Essendon or Carlton to Launceston when the average crowd for those games is 58287, 52339 and 38538 respectively? York Park only holds 19500. Hawthorn v Sydney average 43952 and unsurprisingly they have only been to York Park once. Is this some sort of bias towards Sydney?
Do you mean like 2019 when Richmond played both Adelaide and Port Adelaide at Adelaide Oval? 2019 had the following either double up travel or back to back travel (this was a quick look so there may be more or there may be a mistake or two)
Carlton - Syd/GWS both away
Collingwood - WCE/GWS back to back away (via bye), Sydney away
Essendon - Syd/GWS both away, WCE/Fre both away
Geelong - Ade/Por both away
Hawthorn - Syd/GWS both in away
Melbourne - GCS/WCE back to back away
North Melbourne - Bri/GCS both away
Richmond - Ade/Por both away, GWS/Por back to back away
Western Bulldogs - WCE/Fre both away
As the AFL run on dollars clubs that draw attendances, eyeballs and thus sponsorship historically will always be front and centre. It isn't a bias towards Victorian teams, it's a bias towards money to keep the distribution money high enough for the smaller clubs to keep the doors open.
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In 2015 the Eagles left Perth just once after August 2nd prior to flying across for the GF on September 26th!
One trip in 2 months....* what an impost!!
Hawthorn, their opponent, flew across to Perth 3 times in that same period, and also had a trip to Tassie!!
It was Hawthorn who had the arduous travel load in 2015, the Eagles had a Richmond-esque run home.
What is your argument here?
Vic clubs are dudded by not getting to play all their home games at one ground? Agree with that
That it is ridiculous that vic clubs sell home gameS and end up having to travel, sleep away from home and their regular fans!? Agree again
That clubs who get to play Hawthorn in Tassie, where Hawthorn have had to travel, sleep in hotels and not have their regular home crowd are advantaged!? If so agree again!!
The AFL needs to step in and fix the problem, the problem is Melbourne clubs being shafted and denied games at their actual home ground!!
In a 26 round h&a season with 14 clubs you could have a couple of Vic sides play 3 home games there each and Brisbane could play 1or2 home and 1or2 away also. Evens up the fixture, fills up Carrara.
What the hell's going on with this Hall of Fame rubbish? 2 Brisbane players, a West Coast player, a South Australian and a New South Welshman!!! Obvious #InterstateBias.
DaTBird187
What D Farke?
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20 consecutive years like that and it might get to be acceptable. There is a lot of catching up to do.
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