List Mgmt. 2021 Trade Thread - Part II

George · Aug 24, 2021

Continued in Part III

List Mgmt. - 2021 Trade Thread - Part III

We are onto Part 3.

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Delisted;
Oscar Clavarino
Sam Alabakis

Traded;
-

Retired;
Jake Carlisle
Dylan Roberton
Shaun McKernan
James Frawley

Current Players Out of Contract;
7. Luke Dunstan (RFA) - Link
13. Jack Lonie - Link
25. Dean Kent - Link
39. Darragh Joyce - Link
41. Paul Hunter - Link

To see the full list (it gets updated regularly) visit this thread;

List & Contract Status

SENIOR LIST 1. Jack Higgins 2. Marcus Windhager 3. Zak Jones 4. Lance Collard 5. Brad Crouch 6. Sebastian Ross 7. Nasiah Wanganeen-Milera 8. Bradley Hill 9. Jack Steele 10. Mitchito Owens 11. Hunter Clark 12. Max King 13. Ryan Byrnes 14. Liam Stocker 15. Paddy Dow 16. Daniel Butler 17. Isaac...

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Restricted and Unrestricted Free Agency Window
Friday October 1 – Friday October 8

Trade Period
Players: Monday October 4 – Wednesday October 13
Picks: Monday October 4 – tbc (approx. Friday November 19)

List Lodgement 1
tbc (approx. Thursday October 28)

Delisted Free Agency Window 1
tbc (approx. Friday October 29 - Monday November 8)

List Lodgement 2 (Final date for primary list delistings)
tbc (approx. Tuesday November 9)

Delisted Free Agency Window 2
tbc (approx. Wednesday November 10 - Friday November 19)

Saint_Dos · Sep 22, 2021

CursingFijian said:
Now tell me that the epicentre was at the Kings residence, with after shocks felt all the way up to the GC.

Nah it was at Moorabbin.
Jack Bytel just dropped his weights off the bench press

Bill Mohr · Sep 22, 2021

Premium said:
Get Ladhams and if we get Ben King next year and the feeling is that Ladhams is now extra just put him on the market.
And if we don't get Ben King we still have a good ruckman.

Yes, I was thinking the same thing. He looks the type who will get better with game time so I dont think the club can lose on that. Have heath in the background but no idea if he will make it or not.

Chef Ratts · Sep 22, 2021

gringo2011 said:
You'd be pretty sure that Ryder won't play 23 games and Marshall and him would share the ruck the rest of the time. I doubt that would be his major concern. 12 months at best for Paddy and by that time he should be primed to take over. If we are getting King though it just makes zero sense to have so many talls. One of the Kings would have to back up ruck IMO or it's just too much of an imbalance. Marshall would have to be the prime ruck. We'd still probably have to let a tall forward go. Unless they think that they can trade Marshall out for overs it seems to be a weird move.

If they trade Marshall out that'd just about be the last straw for me after all these years of disgraceful drafting and trading.

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Yawkey way · Sep 22, 2021

PandaG said:
Did you watch Paul Hunter play this year..?

Pointless recruiting ladhams if bing is coming and Marshall is seen as our first ruck. You can get a ruck upgrade for a packet of chips. What‘s Callum Sinclair worth etc and before you tell me he can’t play he’s been good enough to touch st Kilda up. We can’t play them all so ladhams only makes sense if we’re still worried about landing bing or don’t see Marshall as a full time ruck.

Yawkey way · Sep 22, 2021

Bill Mohr said:
The team operates better with the 2 ruckman, even ratten is saying that. Most people are predicting Ryder to play half a year and that is without an injury. hence the "looking forward" for another ruckman. Will it happen, who knows?

Great so where will we park bing if we land him.

Bill Mohr · Sep 22, 2021

Yawkey way said:
Great so where will we park bing if we land him.

If the saints pushed hard they could probably get Ladhams. King is a different story mainly fed by excited posters who have no idea what Ben King will do and if the club can get him. Its a monster feeding on itself.

bird_man · Sep 22, 2021

Harvey has gone to Hawthorn

Joffaboy · Sep 22, 2021

Why even worry about King, he wont be at the Saints in 2022 and may never be. God forbid but he could have a career ending injury in 2022, or the Suns come good get Clarko and he decides to stay or a number of other reasons to not build your trading in 2021 from what 'may' happen in the future with Ben King.

Bloody hell hasn't covid, lockdowns, riots, and earthquakes taught us anything can happen in a short space of time??

Winmar2Lockett · Sep 22, 2021

Yawkey way said:
Pointless recruiting ladhams if bing is coming and Marshall is seen as our first ruck. You can get a ruck upgrade for a packet of chips. What‘s Callum Sinclair worth etc and before you tell me he can’t play he’s been good enough to touch st Kilda up. We can’t play them all so ladhams only makes sense if we’re still worried about landing bing or don’t see Marshall as a full time ruck.

I really don't see the issue here.

Ladhams comes in as Paddy's replacement. He splits time with Roma in the ruck then brief stints in the forward line and on the bench.

Bing plays a mix of CHF & FF (or possibly CHB- I don't subscribe to the theory that he will only play as a forward like he's a petulant child).

Winx plays a mix of FF & CHF.

Both also have their time on the pine as well. At any time you may only have 3 of them on field (all 4 if Bing is at CHB).

Very manageable IMO.

We're very fortunate that our other marking targets are super mobile and can play high or low (Skunk & Super Cooper).

Surely our recruiting should be focused on getting the very best player available at every spot? If anything, getting a back up ruck for a pack of chips has been proven to be a poor approach to take.

Strahany · Sep 22, 2021

I like Ladhams, but we don’t really have anything to offer this year.

A future third seems too little, and a future second too much. Perhaps we could get him for the latter with some later 2021 pick(s) coming back. This should prevent our 2022 picks from copping a penalty with NGA matching.

Dr Spaceman · Sep 22, 2021

Joffaboy said:
Why even worry about King, he wont be at the Saints in 2022 and may never be. God forbid but he could have a career ending injury in 2022, or the Suns come good get Clarko and he decides to stay or a number of other reasons to not build your trading in 2021 from what 'may' happen in the future with Ben King.

Bloody hell hasn't covid, lockdowns, riots, and earthquakes taught us anything can happen in a short space of time??

Yeah, this is where everyone needs to take a deep breath.

It’s a footy forum and it’s fun to speculate. It may also be fun for some to put their expert opinion, superior knowledge or ITK status on show. However people sometimes need to chill a bit and put their forum crayons back in their holsters.

Do we need Ladhams if we have Bing coming? Probably not.

Do we know if we’re getting Bing in 2022/2023? No we don’t.

Does the club know if they’re getting Bing in 2022/2023? They probably have a fair idea. Therefore it’s quite likely that if the club knows Bing is coming then this Ladhams stuff will amount to nothing other than media chatter.

If we’re simply talking about getting a player (e.g. Crouch last year) then sure let your opinions flow. However where getting one player is dependent upon another player coming or not coming, and where the likelihood of those events is not being spruiked by the club, then it’s simply not worth getting worked up about.

At the end of the day the club has not, at this stage, mentioned either Ladhams or King.

bird_man · Sep 22, 2021

Joffaboy said:
Why even worry about King, he wont be at the Saints in 2022 and may never be. God forbid but he could have a career ending injury in 2022, or the Suns come good get Clarko and he decides to stay or a number of other reasons to not build your trading in 2021 from what 'may' happen in the future with Ben King.

Bloody hell hasn't covid, lockdowns, riots, and earthquakes taught us anything can happen in a short space of time??

It's not just King though, we already have 2 quality first rucks so it makes sense to see what happens in 12 months before giving up a good price for a ruck that might not be best 22 next year.

Seems like smart list management to wait and see.

crasha301 · Sep 22, 2021

I don't think we'll end up with bing, from a salary cap point of view paying two key fwds around 1.7-2mill combine just dosent make sence.

If bing was to come and play as a KPD that would be a different story but I think he'll get snatched up by ess or Collingwood on a million a year deal to play forward.

Getting another Ruckman for life after paddy is a higher need then another key fwd.

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bird_man · Sep 22, 2021

Winmar2Lockett said:
I really don't see the issue here.

Ladhams comes in as Paddy's replacement. He splits time with Roma in the ruck then brief stints in the forward line and on the bench.

Bing plays a mix of CHF & FF (or possibly CHB- I don't subscribe to the theory that he will only play as a forward like he's a petulant child).

Winx plays a mix of FF & CHF.

Both also have their time on the pine as well. At any time you may only have 3 of them on field (all 4 if Bing is at CHB).

Very manageable IMO.

We're very fortunate that our other marking targets are super mobile and can play high or low (Skunk & Super Cooper).

Surely our recruiting should be focused on getting the very best player available at every spot? If anything, getting a back up ruck for a pack of chips has been proven to be a poor approach to take.

Where do Membrey and Sharman fit?

King, King, Marshall, Ladhams, Sharman, Membrey

Seems like the obvious thing to do woukd be to play one ruck and use one of our 205cm key forwards to pinch hit rather than carry a 2 rucks and 4 key forwards.

I doubt there'd be a side that has gone that tall before.

bird_man · Sep 22, 2021

crasha301 said:
I don't think we'll end up with bing, from a salary cap point of view paying two key fwds around 1.7-2mill combine just dosent make sence.

If bing was to come and play as a KPD that would be a different story but I think he'll get snatched up by ess or Collingwood on a million a year deal to play forward.

Getting another Ruckman for life after paddy is a higher need then another key fwd.

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Max is on 750 in 2023 so Ben would have to be on 1.25 to get their salary to a combined $2m

If that's what it cost to get him then we probably don't worry, but I'd imagine there'd be plenty of clubs willing to pay up to 1.7m for two quality key forwards.

JediSaint · Sep 22, 2021

RalphyHeraldSun

I understand Pies stand in coach Robert Harvey will join the Hawks as an assistant coach. Plenty wanted him. Brilliant get by Sam Mitchell

Winmar2Lockett · Sep 22, 2021

bird_man said:
Where do Membrey and Sharman fit?

King, King, Marshall, Ladhams, Sharman, Membrey

Seems like the obvious thing to do woukd be to play one ruck and use one of our 205cm key forwards to pinch hit rather than carry a 2 rucks and 4 key forwards.

I doubt there'd be a side that has gone that tall before.

No different to Kennedy, Darling, Allen, NicNat & Lycett/Hickey/2nd ruckman really.

Skunk isn't a KP, he plays like a tall HFF.

Ducky Tie · Sep 22, 2021

Winmar2Lockett said:
Bing plays a mix of CHF & FF (or possibly CHB- I don't subscribe to the theory that he will only play as a forward like he's a petulant child).

I don't see how it's got anything to do with petulance. He's just kicked 50 goals in his third year and is entirely unproven as a defender at AFL level. If we're putting the big sell to him, it's hardly childish to expect to play in the role he has proven himself in. Wouldn't make sense from his end or our end to play him down back.

Premium · Sep 22, 2021

Joffaboy said:
Why even worry about King, he wont be at the Saints in 2022 and may never be. God forbid but he could have a career ending injury in 2022, or the Suns come good get Clarko and he decides to stay or a number of other reasons to not build your trading in 2021 from what 'may' happen in the future with Ben King.

Bloody hell hasn't covid, lockdowns, riots, and earthquakes taught us anything can happen in a short space of time??

I hate to say it but we will not have the draft picks or even compete money wise for Ben King , for instance teams will be offering him crazy money and they will more than likely offer them first round draft picks far better than we can offer because hopefully next year we will be a lot higher up the ladder.
If we wanted Ben King who has been playing in the same position as his brother we would need to give up a player - would we be prepared to give up Membery and our first round draft pick - maybe , but then would Bing knock back say 900k from a Bombers , Hawthorn or Magpies.
Would are Darcy Moore or a Taranto be a better fit if we get Ladhams this year.

Don't get me wrong I would love Ben King in the team , have him CHF and Max FF or the other way around but I just feel teams will be offering anything he wanted and we just can't match when we are still trying to find players to fill in gaps in our 22 like a Key backman , Ruck and of course that other elite midfielder to go with Steele.

JediSaint · Sep 22, 2021

gringo2011 said:
You'd be pretty sure that Ryder won't play 23 games and Marshall and him would share the ruck the rest of the time. I doubt that would be his major concern. 12 months at best for Paddy and by that time he should be primed to take over. If we are getting King though it just makes zero sense to have so many talls. One of the Kings would have to back up ruck IMO or it's just too much of an imbalance. Marshall would have to be the prime ruck. We'd still probably have to let a tall forward go. Unless they think that they can trade Marshall out for overs it seems to be a weird move.

What is Ladhams like? athletic type player? Could he go as CHB as KPD and pinch Ruck?

Minga · Sep 22, 2021

I mean, it’s up to Ben if he’s OOC next year. If he picks Saints it’ll happen. If he doesn’t, so be it there’s logic to that as well. Either way we win IMO. Time will tell.

Would hate to see him at Collingwood or Essendon though

bird_man · Sep 22, 2021

Winmar2Lockett said:
No different to Kennedy, Darling, Allen, NicNat & Lycett/Hickey/2nd ruckman really.

Skunk isn't a KP, he plays like a tall HFF.

Membrey plays a very similar role to Darling. Both average between 1.3 and 1.6 contested marks a game and very similar goals. He may be under sized but he plays as a key forward.

His game is based around his marking, not his ground balls.

crasha301 · Sep 22, 2021

bird_man said:
Max is on 750 in 2023 so Ben would have to be on 1.25 to get their salary to a combined $2m

If that's what it cost to get him then we probably don't worry, but I'd imagine there'd be plenty of clubs willing to pay up to 1.7m for two quality key forwards.

Still to much money on the same player in basically the same position.

I like the Richmond and west coast model of having your main man like lynch and Kennedy with Jroo and darling backing up.

I doubt at any point they made over 1.5 together.

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Premium · Sep 22, 2021

Winmar2Lockett said:
I really don't see the issue here.

Ladhams comes in as Paddy's replacement. He splits time with Roma in the ruck then brief stints in the forward line and on the bench.

Bing plays a mix of CHF & FF (or possibly CHB- I don't subscribe to the theory that he will only play as a forward like he's a petulant child).

Winx plays a mix of FF & CHF.

Both also have their time on the pine as well. At any time you may only have 3 of them on field (all 4 if Bing is at CHB).

Very manageable IMO.

We're very fortunate that our other marking targets are super mobile and can play high or low (Skunk & Super Cooper).

Surely our recruiting should be focused on getting the very best player available at every spot? If anything, getting a back up ruck for a pack of chips has been proven to be a poor approach to take.

I fully expect Ladhams will be at the club next year - they tried for that Bombers guy and Ladhams is only a year older than Draper.
It is the position they have been trying to fill and Ladhams fits the bill.

Webster - Howard - Paton
Sinclair - Wilkie - Highmore
Billings - Steele - Hill
Membery - Marshall - Butler
Gresham - King - Higgins

Ladhams - Ryder / Crouch / Jones

Sharman - Clark - Coffield - Bytel

BrutThough · Sep 22, 2021

Premium said:
I fully expect Ladhams will be at the club next year - they tried for that Bombers guy and Ladhams is only a year older than Draper.
It is the position they have been trying to fill and Ladhams fits the bill.

Webster - Howard - Paton
Sinclair - Wilkie - Highmore
Billings - Steele - Hill
Membery - Marshall - Butler
Gresham - King - Higgins

Ladhams - Ryder / Crouch / Jones

Sharman - Clark - Coffield - Bytel

Based off what exactly?

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