List Mgmt. Contracts, trades, draft - 2021 offseason edition

[Keys]

So the 2021 season is officially done and dusted.

It’s time now to fully turn our attention to the off season and what we can do through the trade period/draft to chase down Melbourne in 2022.

List and personnel changes have already been made and I’ll update this OP as and when any further changes are made.

As it stands these are our official list changes :

Out -
• Venables (R) - retired
• Vardy - retired
• Hutchings (R) - delisted
• Ah Chee (R) - delisted
• Ainsworth - delisted
• Johnson - delisted
• Collins (R) - delisted
• Brander - cluster****
• Cameron - retired/delisted not that it was officially acknowledged by the club
• Sheppard - retired

Inactive listed -
• Cole
• Chesser

In -
• Petrevski-Seton - traded for pick 52
• Chesser - Pick 14
• Hough - Pick 31
• Bazzo - Pick 37
• Williams (Jack) - Pick 57
• Clark - Pick 62
• Dixon - SSP
• Joyce - SSP
• Strnadica - SSP
• Naish - SSP

Players on main list - 37 (Including 2 inactive)
Players on rookie list - 7

Future trade picks :
In - Port Adelaide future 2nd
Out - Future 4th

Assistant Coaches :
• Out - Graham, Hickmott
• In - Schofield (Strategy and Stoppage), Knights (Midfield), Wiley (WAFL coach), Brennan (development)

Link to contract status of all players -

The Contracts Thread

Updated (20/3/24) the status of all contracts for people’s reference : Overall List - 44 Players : Main List(37), Rookie List(5), Cat B(2) Contracted until the end of 2027 (2) : Tom Barrass (8/10/95) - Signed a 5 year extension (2023,2024,2025,2026,2027) on an existing contract set to...

www.bigfooty.com

 

[Dugg]

Based on what we've seen so far you would hope the club makes the below decisions at the end of this season.

Retire:
Kennedy
Hurn

1 Year Deal (with the asterisk that we are rebuilding and they are retained to help the young players improve/injury cover):
Naitanui
Shuey
Redden

Asked to explore options:
Gaff
Darling

To be assessed at the end of 2023:
McGovern
Cripps

Would bring our age down quite a bit and allow us to get consistent games into young players to see whether they are worth persisting with, or moving on at the end of 2023. Potentially a few half-decent draft picks in exchange for Gaff/Darling. Wouldn't be against Rookie deals for Kennedy/Hurn as injury cover/development coaches if they were up for it.

 

[Get_The_Gaff]

Based on what we've seen so far you would hope the club makes the below decisions at the end of this season.

Retire:
Kennedy
Hurn

1 Year Deal (with the asterisk that we are rebuilding and they are retained to help the young players improve/injury cover):
Naitanui
Shuey
Redden

Asked to explore options:
Gaff
Darling

To be assessed at the end of 2023:
McGovern
Cripps

Would bring our age down quite a bit and allow us to get consistent games into young players to see whether they are worth persisting with, or moving on at the end of 2023. Potentially a few half-decent draft picks in exchange for Gaff/Darling. Wouldn't be against Rookie deals for Kennedy/Hurn as injury cover/development coaches if they were up for it.

I still don't get the point of trading darling.

He is still a good forward and can contribute in a rebuild for a couple of years

Without darling allen would be a lone tall of any quality in our forward line.

If all of gaff , shuey and redden go at the end of the year you still have some big seasoned bodies in the middle in yeo , Kelly , SPS and even Clark to protect the next generation mids coming through

 

[ep2018]

Last two years would have been interesting if Covid didn't hit and Rioli stayed off the good stuff that week.

I reckon we beat Geelong in the semi final had the Rioli shit not happened, even heavily distracted and without him we nearly pinched the game. Then from there, we match up well against Richmond at the MCG in the PF. What could have been.

 

[Dugg]

I still don't get the point of trading darling.

He is still a good forward and can contribute in a rebuild for a couple of years

Without darling allen would be a lone tall of any quality in our forward line.

If all of gaff , shuey and redden go at the end of the year you still have some big seasoned bodies in the middle in yeo , Kelly , SPS and even Clark to protect the next generation mids coming through

Simply because it's now or never. He's got value while he can kick 30-40 goals a season, but he is 30 this year. If we're serious about a rebuild, it's going to be at least 3-4 years before we can be a serious contender and at the point he likely won't be part of the picture anymore. With Allen at #1 Forward, we still have other options for 2023 - Dixon/Naitanui/BWilliams, Waterman/Bazzo, Trade/Draft or Kennedy for another year. Heck, we could even have Edwards play and throw McGovern forward.

 

[The_Gambler]

Possibly the biggest blunder of the off season was keeping shuey as captain. Body fat to fragile to possibility lead by example and he should be focusing entirely on his own game as he’s no longer a walk up start.

 

[Matsu]

Possibly the biggest blunder of the off season was keeping shuey as captain. Body fat to fragile to possibility lead by example and he should be focusing entirely on his own game as he’s no longer a walk up start.

I feel like playing Shuey off HB or HF should be an option. A lot of older quality mids are being put to pasture off HB and its worked pretty well.

 

[Eastcoasteagle]

Si

I feel like playing Shuey off HB or HF should be an option. A lot of older quality mids are being put to pasture off HB and its worked pretty well.

Simply has to move out of the engine room, for his own good and also give others opportunities. A fair few have shown a bit in there this year.

 

[KBLT]

Jordyn Baker our academy player looks like he had a good game on the weekend for EP Colts: 22 disposals, 5 Mark's, 2 I50s.
Skinny winger with good skills and courageous.

Is there a full list of our NGA eligible players yet?

 

[Godfather32]

Is there a full list of our NGA eligible players yet?

We had one but it got lost in Rohan O'Brien's junkmail

 

[garlic munchers]

Ok, so I was too broad with my generalisation. But teams like Melbourne and Carlton moved players on and invested too heavily in the draft. Surely there has to be a balance. Move on players by all means but cutting too many players currently in your best 18-22 is going to far in one direction in my opinion.

Seems to be working for the Hawks and Issac Smith just reinforces this.

Cut deep and hard to get as many 2nd round picks as we can and use $$ to put pressure on WA guns over East.

Darling for Bullies 1st, Yeo for Carltons 1st. Both teams need something extra to compete with the Demons.

Gaff for anyone prepared to part with a 2nd.

Need to be bold, but we are WC.

 

[Royalbeagle]

In the next three years as long as these players are either traded/retired, dont care in what order.

Kennedy
Hurn
Nic Nat
Shuey
Redden
McGovern
Cripps
Gaff
Darling

We need to hit the draft and hard!! Its time to bottom out and get potential A graders, while also trying to pinch players of the same ilk as Robertson/Bruhn on the cheap. Its 2010 again lads, build it and they will come!

And trade Sheed, Rioli, or
Kelly. They might still be worth something.

 

[Biggie]

And trade Sheed, Rioli, or
Kelly. They might still be worth something.

 

[Eastcoasteagle]

Is there a full list of our NGA eligible players yet?

Haven't seen one yet, just picked that one up from a game of his I watched last year.

 

[Rowan18]

Seems to be working for the Hawks and Issac Smith just reinforces this.

Cut deep and hard to get as many 2nd round picks as we can and use $$ to put pressure on WA guns over East.

Darling for Bullies 1st, Yeo for Carltons 1st. Both teams need something extra to compete with the Demons.

Gaff for anyone prepared to part with a 2nd.

Need to be bold, but we are WC.

How many times do we have go over this - no-one is paying a first rounder for a 30 year old Darling. We are much better keeping him and getting him back to form. He will help Allen's development and can transition to a third tall to help develop the next forward in line (either one we draft or Williams etc). Too valuable to throw away.

Gaff would be seen as a salary dump, probably a third rounder at best. No point in doing that as we don't need salary for anything (we don't have any big stars coming out of contract and no FA wanting to come over).

Yeo needs to get back to form before he has value. He is young enough to be in our next flag tilt, trading him would be foolish unless we know his body is shot.

We have most of the pieces to rebuild our spine (need a good ruck) and just need some midfield depth. It's not actually that bad if we can get our coaching and S&C right. Kelly and Yeo are decent mids if we can get them fit and in the right roles. Need to add some more depth (either from guys like Edwards coming on or trading in mids that can't get an opportunity to take the next step).

Defence should be fine for a couple of seasons with Gov, Barrass and Edwards. Forward line should also be OK If we can get Darling fit to play FF next year, then Allen should be ready for CHF. Our HFF are pretty strong.

I know it's fun to get upset about our recruiters not drafting mids, but we're in a pretty good position for talls which helps because they take a lot longer to develop. The club started on that part of the rebuild in the 2017 draft. Finish bottom 4 and nail some mids/HBF and we could be back performing in a season or two.

 

[Tugga27]

And trade Sheed, Rioli, or
Kelly. They might still be worth something.

You obviously have have no idea how trades work.
FMD.

 

[THE A5]

Harsh but I don't see any currency in Bailey Williams at all. I just don't think he'll make it at this level. It's not just he's getting beaten but he totally uncompetitive out there.

 

[langdon19]

I'm having threesomes at home every night while my wife watches.

Still dreaming, still waiting

Why can’t she join in?

 

[Bacchus]

Seems to be working for the Hawks and Issac Smith just reinforces this.

Cut deep and hard to get as many 2nd round picks as we can and use $$ to put pressure on WA guns over East.

Darling for Bullies 1st, Yeo for Carltons 1st. Both teams need something extra to compete with the Demons.

Gaff for anyone prepared to part with a 2nd.

Need to be bold, but we are WC.

NM cut hard and deep, hasn’t worked too well for them, they are still a shambles after several years.

Hawthorn have a group of experienced players supporting their younger players. And it’s yet to be seen whether Hawthorn are going anywhere this year anyway despite the good win today.

It‘s necessary to establish which older players should be retained for the reset period. Throwing the baby out with the bath water is disastrous. Pruning a tree too hard can set it back years.

 

[xInfected_Virus]

I reckon we beat Geelong in the semi final had the Rioli shit not happened, even heavily distracted and without him we nearly pinched the game. Then from there, we match up well against Richmond at the MCG in the PF. What could have been.

Or even accept the Tim Kelly deal in 2018 when it was somewhat fairer. From memory it was one of the three deals of picks 20, 22, 2019 first and Brander or 20,22 and Brander or 20,22, and 2019 first which the club said no. Not sure but one of the three. But then I don't know if we could've gotten XON and Foley though.

Agreed I think we would've beaten Geelong with Rioli's class, flair and creativity getting us over the line and plus the club not getting distracted, it may create a butterfly effect such as Rioli not smoking pot with Kelly's influence. In my scenario in form Kelly would be with us playing against the team that stole him from the team that wanted him.

The 2019 prelim was a dry night with Kelly and Rioli I think the club would've beaten Richmond since we do match up well against them in the dry at least. Our kick mark tactics was perfect to counter Richmond's high pressure game at the time but only when it was dry which as mentioned the 2019 prelim was dry (in our 2019 regular season match against them we dominated them in the dry but once it was wet they started to make a comeback and it became scrappy with constant lead changes. Who knows I reckon Kelly would've dragged us over the line in that game).

We would've won the GF for sure against a cooked Giants side on a dry sunny MCG. The club matches well against them and after a hard fought scrappy match against Collingwood plus the extra day rest we would've had they would've been cooked later on and the club would be piling on scores to smash the Giants. JK and co would've dominated and Shuey probably wins his second Norm Smith.

Assuming 2019 first isn't taken the club probably may have drafted Devon Robertson who originally went to Brisbane and Jeremy Sharp who originally went to Gold Coast. Also assuming we haven't traded pick 33 to Essendon we probably may have gotten Chad Warner.

Now to 2020 COVID restricted season. With Rioli there and Kelly who's had an extra season with the club. I think we get over the line against the Dogs with Rioli's flair and creativity he would've gotten that magical goal or be involved in a game winning play that puts us over the line against the Dogs. With that extra win the club finishes third on the ladder ahead of Richmond.

The club would've faced the Lions at The Gabba, I don't see us beating Brisbane in QF2 considering it was dewy on that day and the club doesn't do well with a slippery footy plus if injuries stay the same as normal the senior guys would've been underdone. I reckon we would've put the Saints away, our finals experience bringing us over the line. On the other QF1 Port vs Richmond, I'd say Richmond takes this knowing how badly Port Choke and they may beat the Cats at home since they would've smashed Collingwood in the EF1 and assuming Port win, they still choke to Richmond again with Dusty going god mode. Back to our hypothetical 2020 finals, I think with our mids fully fit now, the club being more motivated plus finals experience from the core group someone will be a match winner for us whether it's Nic Nat, JK, Gov, Ryan, Rioli, Kelly, Shuey or Yeo. 2020 Grand Final West Coast Eagles vs Richmond, now my whole family went to Crown for a holiday I can imagine the noise in such an environment. We have the momentum plus a fit and firing core players but Richmond are better suited for slippery conditions plus Dusty's godliness during finals especially the Grand Final so I'd say 50/50. Nic Nat or Dusty for Norm Smith.

Hypothetical 2020 draft. TBH not sure who we take maybe N.O'Driscoll???

2021 season. I do think with Kelly with an extra season at West Coast (assuming no injuries) and Rioli not being suspended and also no injuries, I can see the club beating the Bulldogs and stop the Saints momentum heck they may even get us over the line against the Giants which was neck and neck for pretty much most of the match and stop the Bombers from coming back as Rioli's crumbing ability and magic would've helped us wrestle back momentum and keep us in the game. By this point the club should be 12-1 at the bye and I do see us winning against Norf, got barely over the line against the eventual premiers and beaten Freo. There was also a possibility we beat the Lions as the match was neck and neck until the end. So by 2021 seasons end I can see the club finish at 18-4 which would've been top of the ladder or even second if we don't get over the Lions.

Hypothetical 2021 finals assuming we're first on the ladder.
For QF1 vs Bulldogs (Thanks to our hypothetical win against the Lions or losing with a much closer margin the Lions are not in the top 4 due to percentage), I do see the club beating the Doggies at Adelaide, the club maybe aging but finals experience may have gotten us over the line combined with Rioli magic and eventually the club will expose the Dog's below average backline. In the elimination final Dogs vs Lions I can see Brisbane Choking again so we'd be facing the Dogs at Optus on a dry night as we'll be getting Kelly back. If we do win then we face the Dees at Optus and I think being on a dry night plus the home factor combined with finals experienced players I think the team wins it's fourth premiership in a row. I can see JK and Hurn retiring on a high.

Hypothetical 2021 draft. Now assuming we four peated something that's pretty much never been done before. Now I remember reading Dylan82's post regarding what Brisbane tried to do and what player's they would've taken. With us winning the flag, Brisbane would've taken Chesser at 16 so he was no go and since we have pick 20 after father son selections we probably would've drafted M.Johnson a WA guy (lol Freo). I doubt Hough will be on the board since Brisbane will trade their pick 41 to get ahead of West Coast at pick 37 from Port so they can get Hough. The club gets J.Williams and G.Clark as normal.

This is just me being very optimistic but then highlighting how extremely important Rioli is and getting Kelly a year earlier.

 

[dinnaz]

The best environment surely has to be to maximise development.
That means time training within an elite environment, following those with good preparation, the best habits and running out at a high level on the track.

Melbourne's mistake:
Not playing an older guy who is performing in the reserves just to see a rookie gifted a game and get 5 possessions. Way to piss the players off, and stunt the development of your rookies.

Its better to earn your spot through hard work and have a good base at reserves level. And then take the next small step to being a role player at league level etc etc.
The alternative is to just get to smashed at AFL level and not contribute anything. We saw what happens over the first few rounds this year, J Williams & Jamieson looked absolutely lost, and our youth players O'neil, Edwards, B. Williams just weren't up to the task.

 

[Dark Sharks]

Kelly cost us but he is by far out best mid. If the team and game plan had not imploded he would have been of great value.

Is he though?


I feel like Kelly is only our "best midfielder" these days due to Shuey being old/injury prone, and Yeo being completely dead and underdone the past 2 and a bit seasons. There's no other competition for the best mid tag at the club, other than almost about to retire Redden, and B grade Dom Sheed. That's it

Kelly's actual performance for West Coast has been poor in comparison to legit A grade midfielders (let alone one's who cost as much as he did), and also he hasn't even hit the heights of either of his 2 seasons at Geelong. Mainly due to his scoreboard impact completely disappearing.



Geelong 20218 - 23 disposals, 10 contested, 4 clearances, 4 tackles, 6 score involvements, 367MG, 93 ranking points - Kicked 24 goals
Geelong 2019 - 25 disposals, 12 contested, 6 clearances, 4 tackles, 6 score involvements, 446MG, 104 ranking points - Kicked 24 goals

West Coast 2020 - 20 disposals, 9 contested, 4 clearances, 4 tackles, 4 score involvements, 364MG, 95 ranking points - Kicked 5 goals
West Coast 2021 - 23 disposals, 11 contested, 5 clearances, 3 tackles, 6 score involvements 356MG, 85 ranking points - Kicked 6 goals
West Coast 2022 - 17 disposals, 7 contested, 4 clearances, 5 tackles, 1 score involvements, 300MG, 68 ranking points - Kicked 0 goals so far


On this evidence he hasn't improved at West Coast at all. He is the same, or worse a player than he was at Geelong, as the 4th best midfielder.

It's one thing crying about Vozzo's trade ad nauseam, but on field Kelly isn't anything spectacular for West Coast either. He's the best midfielder by default.





In his 39 games for West Coast, he's failed to have 20 disposals 17 times.

In the 2021 Elimination final, the only final he has played for West Coast, he had 12 disposals, from 83% TOG

 

[Schtinker]

Pruning a tree too hard can set it back years.

Not pruning it hard enough leaves you with old wood that will never fruit.

 

[Truckosaurus]

Or even accept the Tim Kelly deal in 2018 when it was somewhat fairer. From memory it was one of the three deals of picks 20, 22, 2019 first and Brander or 20,22 and Brander or 20,22, and 2019 first which the club said no. Not sure but one of the three.

Nothing we offered or agreed to would have satisfied Geelong. They were keeping him to his contract. When we agreed to anything they moved the goalposts and added more demands. The negotiations were a sham. They were in their window and had a gun mid on second-round-pick wages and weren't going to pass him to a rival for anything.

 

[Obeanie1]

How many times do we have go over this - no-one is paying a first rounder for a 30 year old Darling. We are much better keeping him and getting him back to form. He will help Allen's development and can transition to a third tall to help develop the next forward in line (either one we draft or Williams etc). Too valuable to throw away.

Gaff would be seen as a salary dump, probably a third rounder at best. No point in doing that as we don't need salary for anything (we don't have any big stars coming out of contract and no FA wanting to come over).

Yeo needs to get back to form before he has value. He is young enough to be in our next flag tilt, trading him would be foolish unless we know his body is shot.

We have most of the pieces to rebuild our spine (need a good ruck) and just need some midfield depth. It's not actually that bad if we can get our coaching and S&C right. Kelly and Yeo are decent mids if we can get them fit and in the right roles. Need to add some more depth (either from guys like Edwards coming on or trading in mids that can't get an opportunity to take the next step).

Defence should be fine for a couple of seasons with Gov, Barrass and Edwards. Forward line should also be OK If we can get Darling fit to play FF next year, then Allen should be ready for CHF. Our HFF are pretty strong.

I know it's fun to get upset about our recruiters not drafting mids, but we're in a pretty good position for talls which helps because they take a lot longer to develop. The club started on that part of the rebuild in the 2017 draft. Finish bottom 4 and nail some mids/HBF and we could be back performing in a season or two.

Darling won't be here for the next flag.

He's burnt bridges here.

It's obvious that we have a fractured group.

Darling is not the future he is the past.

And he would net a decent pick, pick upgrade or help land a player.

I see many more reasons to let him go than retain.

 

[Carbine Chaos]

Riley Garcia hurt his knee for the Dogs earlier this weekend. Provided it’s not too bad, but it keeps him out of their side for a sizeable chunk, should be all over him for a late pick.