List Mgmt. Player List Management 2019-20

MALTSY

Club Legend
May 2, 2011
1,916
1,600
silver sands
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
That’s a cop out.

Our forwards are s**t. None of them are consistent goal kickers.

Sam Gray, Motlop, Westhoff, Ryder and Ebert does not a premiership forward line make.
What about a motivated and well coached forward line of Dixon, Rozee, R.Gray, Marshall, Hayes, Farrell? An elite tall mid who can push forward would also help but that mix of players are not bad at all.
 

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JUSTWORK

Norm Smith Medallist
Aug 25, 2013
9,808
11,470
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
That’s a cop out.

Our forwards are s**t. None of them are consistent goal kickers.

Sam Gray, Motlop, Westhoff, Ryder and Ebert does not a premiership forward line make.
Here’s the thing, other then Motlop none of those guys are actually forwards. They just get shoehorned there by Hinkley.
 

Kiss from a Rozee

Club Legend
Nov 23, 2018
2,264
3,728
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Its not. We have so much evidence.
Maybe, but under Hinkey who would know. I’m very confident Fantasia would be made to look an arse by Hinkley forward line coaching too.
Hinkley being a bad coach doesn’t excuse players for being s**t.

Our midfield is legitimately elite, and they are under the same coaches.

Clear out a few of Johnson, Ryder, Sam Gray, Ebert and Westhoff and replacing them with either walk up start first 22 players (which Fantasia would absolutely fit at this stage) or more youngsters and hopefully we can find something better for 2020 onwards.

Yeah maybe it’s Hinkley’s fault the list is this way, but it doesn’t change the fact we are desperate for quality forwards. We definitely have a shot at a flag with our current midfield if our forward line can get to a B+ at least.
 

afl2004

Premiership Player
Feb 7, 2014
3,966
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reynella
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Hinkley being a bad coach doesn’t excuse players for being s**t.

Our midfield is legitimately elite, and they are under the same coaches.

Clear out a few of Johnson, Ryder, Sam Gray, Ebert and Westhoff and replacing them with either walk up start first 22 players (which Fantasia would absolutely fit at this stage) or more youngsters and hopefully we can find something better for 2020 onwards.

Yeah maybe it’s Hinkley’s fault the list is this way, but it doesn’t change the fact we are desperate for quality forwards. We definitely have a shot at a flag with our current midfield if our forward line can get to a B+ at least.
Our midfield is not elite , even boak is a hacker
 

raptalia

Premium Platinum
Mar 1, 2014
6,303
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People's Republic of Onkaparinga
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Port Adelaide
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Boak is a casualty of Hinkley's bulls**t. If he left us for Geelong then he would be considered elite.
Boak (#5), Hartlett (#4), Wines (#7) were all top ten draft paicks yet none of them have blossomed into super stars at Alberton. Are we just unlucky or have we misread the drafts, or is it our Coaching?

In 2014 Ollie Wines looked a super star in the making yet his progress has stalled since then.
 

El_Scorcho

Brownlow Medallist
Aug 21, 2007
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What thread am I reading where AA captaincy candidate Travis Boak isn't a superstar? Christ on a bike.

Hinkley being a bad coach doesn’t excuse players for being s**t.

Our midfield is legitimately elite, and they are under the same coaches.

Clear out a few of Johnson, Ryder, Sam Gray, Ebert and Westhoff and replacing them with either walk up start first 22 players (which Fantasia would absolutely fit at this stage) or more youngsters and hopefully we can find something better for 2020 onwards.

Yeah maybe it’s Hinkley’s fault the list is this way, but it doesn’t change the fact we are desperate for quality forwards. We definitely have a shot at a flag with our current midfield if our forward line can get to a B+ at least.
The same coaches who have consistently not placed any value on an efficient and effective forward line over half a decade. What a strange opinion.

Our defence was elite in 2018 when we played 12 players back there every game. Strange that our 1-2 player forward line wasn't elite at the same time and UNDER THE SAME COACHES!
 

Butters Made Me Do It

secretly Portia, ssh
Mar 16, 2019
2,458
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The Sack Hinkleys
Hinkley being a bad coach doesn’t excuse players for being s**t.
Players being s**t because you don’t know how to use them is precisely what makes someone a bad coach. A toxic coach, even, which at this point Hinkley is.

Also on Orazio, he’s kicked a total of three goals (in 4 games) against top 8 sides this year (6 goals in 6 games in 2017). He’s basically Essendon’s Sam Gray and you seriously want to trade for him?

Back in what we’ve got under a coach that isn’t forward-phobic first.
 
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FineWines11

All Australian
Aug 7, 2015
909
1,137
Perth
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Boak (#5), Hartlett (#4), Wines (#7) were all top ten draft paicks yet none of them have blossomed into super stars at Alberton. Are we just unlucky or have we misread the drafts, or is it our Coaching?

In 2014 Ollie Wines looked a super star in the making yet his progress has stalled since then.
Wines' numbers were of the charts for a second year player back then, better than Judds at same age. I reckon his ceiling is either lower or he's stagnated being in Hinkleys system for too long. Boak is 2xAA and should be 3xAA after this season so I'd call him a star but not superstar. Hammer just never had the tank to be a midfielder which impaired him. Wines could still get there, still younger than Dusty before he hit superstar status.
 

Schlez

Team Captain
May 10, 2006
507
504
AFL Club
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Wines' numbers were of the charts for a second year player back then, better than Judds at same age. I reckon his ceiling is either lower or he's stagnated being in Hinkleys system for too long. Boak is 2xAA and should be 3xAA after this season so I'd call him a star but not superstar. Hammer just never had the tank to be a midfielder which impaired him. Wines could still get there, still younger than Dusty before he hit superstar status.
Except what qualities does Wines have to be a superstar? He's not explosive, nor an elite athlete, his disposal is average. If he can get to star status, that would be a win.
 

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raptalia

Premium Platinum
Mar 1, 2014
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Players being s**t because you don’t know how to use them is precisely what makes someone a bad coach. A toxic coach, even, which at this point Hinkley is.

Also on Orazio, he’s kicked a total of three goals (in 4 games) against top 8 sides this year (6 goals in 6 games in 2017). He’s basically Essendon’s Sam Gray and you seriously want to trade for him?

Back in what we’ve got under a coach that isn’t forward-phobic first.
Yeah, I cannot understand the 'must get' hype surrounding Orazio. He had a good season in 2017 with 39 goals but other than that his figures are no better than players we already have. I suspect the entire Orazio thing is a beat up. it puts me in mind of the 'let's get him' campaign that surrounded Stephen Motlop.

I think our forward set up would benefit more from saying sayonara to the present forward Coach than recruiting any one player. With the right people guiding them Marshall. Butters, Rozee, Frampton, Woodcock could well do the job. Who knows?
 

Windy Cindy

Team Captain
May 16, 2019
328
829
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Wines' numbers were of the charts for a second year player back then, better than Judds at same age. I reckon his ceiling is either lower or he's stagnated being in Hinkleys system for too long. Boak is 2xAA and should be 3xAA after this season so I'd call him a star but not superstar. Hammer just never had the tank to be a midfielder which impaired him. Wines could still get there, still younger than Dusty before he hit superstar status.
hes no chance of being a super star, not with his disposal.
 

Portology

Cheap, fast, safe: pick two, or juggle three.
Sep 27, 2007
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Sydney
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Players being s**t because you don’t know how to use them is precisely what makes someone a bad coach. A toxic coach, even, which at this point Hinkley is.

Also on Orazio, he’s kicked a total of three goals (in 4 games) against top 8 sides this year (6 goals in 6 games in 2017). He’s basically Essendon’s Sam Gray and you seriously want to trade for him?

Back in what we’ve got under a coach that isn’t forward-phobic first.
Or we could give our new coach time to decide which of Sam or Orazio they’d prefer, by sacking Ken ASAP ;)


On iPhone using recycled electrons, via BigFooty.com mobile app
 

RedBullRacing

Senior List
Aug 30, 2014
218
280
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Westhoff and Ebert are both down in stats. I don't know where to find running stats but would be interesting. I don't think they've had an injury affected pre-season. Looks concerning.
 

RedBullRacing

Senior List
Aug 30, 2014
218
280
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Eberts been playing deep forward, stats from previous years are irrelevant in his case
Westhoff is concerning. I wouldn't be surprised if he retires. Face it, we need to move at least 2, possibly 3 players in the 30+ group. If we do that for the next three seasons, butters, Rozee et.al will be in their 5th season with a side built on youth.

It's hard to predict which players will stick around but I reckon Boak could go a while yet.
 

TeeKray

Moderator
Mar 1, 2014
9,775
48,221
Perth
AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Wines is in his 7th season of AFL. Fyfe had won a Brownlow and was considered the best player in the game by his 6th season. Dusty had done the same by his 8th season. Wines is what he is. When injury free and in the right head space, an above average footballer. And when things get tough, he's a plodder.
 

Kiss from a Rozee

Club Legend
Nov 23, 2018
2,264
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AFL Club
Port Adelaide
Players being s**t because you don’t know how to use them is precisely what makes someone a bad coach. A toxic coach, even, which at this point Hinkley is.
Are you happy with players like Motlop, Westhoff, Ebert and potentially Boak/Sutcliffe running around in our forward line next year? If not who do we replace them with?

Also on Orazio, he’s kicked a total of three goals (in 4 games) against top 8 sides this year (6 goals in 6 games in 2017). He’s basically Essendon’s Sam Gray and you seriously want to trade for him?
That’s a great point. I’d honestly only looked at his goal tally in 2017 and said yeah that looks good enough.

If not Fantasia though, then who do we play as a high forward once Sam Gray is gone?

Back in what we’ve got under a coach that isn’t forward-phobic first.
You can be as single minded about Hinkley as you want, but the reality is there is a good chance he isn’t sacked this year, which means the only way our forward line improves is by getting another preseason into our young players, changing the forward coach, or bringing in new players.

Personally I’d like to see all four happen, but if Hinkley and Basset are here next year it could be a choice between Cam Sutcliffe and Orazio Fantasia getting games in 2020. Personally I’m choosing Fantasia.
 

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