Player Watch Trent Cotchin - Elite

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Grrr

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Well sure but despite Richmond losing most stats Dustin Martin still ranks elite in a lot of key areas as does Lynch and Riewoldt.

There is a stat for just about anything you do on a football field these days, what is it he does that makes him an elite midfielder.

Because that has been my whole point through this entire thread, i am not arguing he is one of the Tigers most important players and i am not arguing he is a big part of the reason they are successful. I am saying those things don't make him an elite mid.
There are about 3 or 4 elite midfielders in the game. Martin, Fyfe, Dangerfield and probably still Pendelbury. The rest are on the next tear down, as they all do some things well, but not many influence games like the above.
Cotchin may not rack up the possessions like elite possession mids like Neale and Mitchell, and he might not be an elite clearance machine like Cripps, but he is elite at his attack on the ball and his ability to influence games at the right time. Hodge was the best at this, Selwood not far behind. So he has an elite trait as a midfielder, that of being a great leader and someone who sets a great example. So it all depends on what you consider important in a mid.
 

THE_GUN

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There are about 3 or 4 elite midfielders in the game. Martin, Fyfe, Dangerfield and probably still Pendelbury. The rest are on the next tear down, as they all do some things well, but not many influence games like the above.
Cotchin may not rack up the possessions like elite possession mids like Neale and Mitchell, and he might not be an elite clearance machine like Cripps, but he is elite at his attack on the ball and his ability to influence games at the right time. Hodge was the best at this, Selwood not far behind. So he has an elite trait as a midfielder, that of being a great leader and someone who sets a great example. So it all depends on what you consider important in a mid.
Cripps & Coniglio go all right
 

Grrr

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Cripps & Coniglio go all right
Yes they have elite traits, like a dozen or so other mids, and maybe they are close to the top of that next bracket, but they are not Martin/Fyfe/Dangerfield, who break games apart. Coniglio is one to watch that is for sure. Also, they have been doing it for so long, hence the inclusion of Pendelbury.
 

THE_GUN

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Yes they have elite traits, like a dozen or so other mids, and maybe they are close to the top of that next bracket, but they are not Martin/Fyfe/Dangerfield, who break games apart. Coniglio is one to watch that is for sure. Also, they have been doing it for so long, hence the inclusion of Pendelbury.
I would take Cripps & Coniglio over Dangerfield at this moment
 

H00t

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Sep 28, 2019
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What Cotchin does well is he allows the players around him to play better. He sets up so well defensively, allowing players like Martin, Edwards, Lambert etc. to get into more damaging positions ahead of the footy.

He is such a big part of why Richmond is able to run in waves forward of the footy and be so damaging on turnovers. Where without him these players would be forced to defend more and therefore become less damaging.

Saying this though I feel cotchin’s days of being elite or even very good offensively are probably over but his defensive aspects make him much more valuable to Richmond than his early days

In many ways I feel he is an opposite type of leader to Hodge but equally effective. Hodge was someone who just lead from the front, dominated grand finals and dragged everyone up with him. Where as Cotchin (17-19) while not as good a player as hodge (12-15) is pushing all his players up and making them play better with his hard work out of the spotlight doing the little things that the coaches love with his defensive pressure. He isn’t out and out elite but he is the best player he could be for Richmond. He is a two time premiership captain for a reason
 

BJK#5

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Cotchin is a far better player than Tom Mitchell. Next Hawks fans will be using SuperCoach points to justify their opinion...
Nah i wouldn't be stupid enough to do that... I would use

Disposals, clearances, goals, inside 50's, score involvements, tackles and contested possessions.
 

nineteen eighty

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Nah i wouldn't be stupid enough to do that... I would use

Disposals, clearances, goals, inside 50's, score involvements, tackles and contested possessions.
Mitchell is therefore better than Hodge was. See what you're saying?!

Mitchell and Cotchin are 2 very different players. Your fellow Hawks supporter H00t summed it up nicely just above.

Which one is better? They can't be compared.

Which one would others like to play alongside? I know what my answer would be.

And that's not putting down the other. Simply that one is a great leader of teams and the other is a great ball winning magnet. Each to their own.
 

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RichLeMonde

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What Cotchin does well is he allows the players around him to play better. He sets up so well defensively, allowing players like Martin, Edwards, Lambert etc. to get into more damaging positions ahead of the footy.

He is such a big part of why Richmond is able to run in waves forward of the footy and be so damaging on turnovers. Where without him these players would be forced to defend more and therefore become less damaging.

Saying this though I feel cotchin’s days of being elite or even very good offensively are probably over but his defensive aspects make him much more valuable to Richmond than his early days

In many ways I feel he is an opposite type of leader to Hodge but equally effective. Hodge was someone who just lead from the front, dominated grand finals and dragged everyone up with him. Where as Cotchin (17-19) while not as good a player as hodge (12-15) is pushing all his players up and making them play better with his hard work out of the spotlight doing the little things that the coaches love with his defensive pressure. He isn’t out and out elite but he is the best player he could be for Richmond. He is a two time premiership captain for a reason
Thoughtful comment. I concur
 

BJK#5

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Mitchell is therefore better than Hodge was. See what you're saying?!

Mitchell and Cotchin are 2 very different players. Your fellow Hawks supporter H00t summed it up nicely just above.

Which one is better? They can't be compared.

Which one would others like to play alongside? I know what my answer would be.

And that's not putting down the other. Simply that one is a great leader of teams and the other is a great ball winning magnet. Each to their own.
No Hodge spent a large chunk of his career as a defender so you would expect to see those differences in stats.

Okay Cotchin is a great leader that has been established and argued by no one, but those difference in stats show up because one is clearly a better midfielder currently.
 

Do the Dew

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No Hodge spent a large chunk of his career as a defender so you would expect to see those differences in stats.

Okay Cotchin is a great leader that has been established and argued by no one, but those difference in stats show up because one is clearly a better midfielder currently.
Not if you compare their 2019 stats. Let’s just wait and see how Mitchell returns from a broken leg, and see if Trent can get a full pre-season and not miss half the year with hammy issues.

Personally I’d take Cotchin over Mitchell in my 2020 tigers lineup. As other posters have said, it depends on what you value


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BJK#5

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Not if you compare their 2019 stats. Let’s just wait and see how Mitchell returns from a broken leg, and see if Trent can get a full pre-season and not miss half the year with hammy issues.

Personally I’d take Cotchin over Mitchell in my 2020 tigers lineup. As other posters have said, it depends on what you value


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Well that is shifting the goal posts, i agree we don't necessarily know how Mitchell will return which is why i was using stats from last time they both played close to a full season.
 

BJK#5

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Grand final stats:

362 Disposals 361
35 Clearances 32
53 Tackles 56
134 Contested Possessions 115



RfC: 17.12 114
GWS: 3.7 25 (lowest score ever)
Sigh... No midfielder has ever been described as an elite mid purely for what they do off the ball. It does not happen he is a brilliant player in the Richmond system but that does not make him elite.
 

Marcel Proust

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yeah its not like a winning grand final has relevance

or the style of richmond play the last three seasons


No midfielder has ever been described as an elite mid purely for what they do off the ball. It does not happen he is a brilliant player in the Richmond system but that does not make him elite.

Matthew de Boer was called by some 'the best tagger ever' on here until Prestia gave him a bath.

Not only is Cotchin elite but he is very elite. If you cant see it bad luck to you brother
 

Ghost Patrol

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Sigh... No midfielder has ever been described as an elite mid purely for what they do off the ball. It does not happen he is a brilliant player in the Richmond system but that does not make him elite.
Ok. But who would win a fight between an elite player and a statistician?

Seriously, there's so many levels to this. Even his hair makes him look bigger.

Elite presentation.
 

BJK#5

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yeah its not like a winning grand final has relevance

or the style of richmond play the last three seasons





Matthew de Boer was called by some 'the best tagger ever' on here until Prestia gave him a bath.

Not only is Cotchin elite but he is very elite. If you cant see it bad luck to you brother
Winning a Grand Final is not relevant to him being an elite mid when he didn't even poll a coaches vote on the day no...

That just goes to show he played his role in a very very good team.
 

Cotchins Hair Piece

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Nah i wouldn't be stupid enough to do that... I would use

Disposals, clearances, goals, inside 50's, score involvements, tackles and contested possessions.
I’d take Cotchin with his average of 23.5 disposals in his career vs Mitchell’s 29.5. Cotchin is a much more damaging player, Mitchell gets too many of his possessions going for the easy one-two handball or the short pass out of the goal square.

I’m unbiased here, unlike a Tigers or Hawks supporter.

 

queensberryrules

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2 tackles:
17 Townsend on Crouch, or is it Couch?
19 Trent on Mummy, who nearly everyone in the lead up suggested would go out with a bang. Very prescient of them.

Those tackles are worth goals, raise spirits, win contests, win games. Comes up on the stat sheet as a 1, impact far greater.

Watch the game.

On SM-G955F using BigFooty.com mobile app
 

BJK#5

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I’d take Cotchin with his average of 23.5 disposals in his career vs Mitchell’s 29.5. Cotchin is a much more damaging player, Mitchell gets too many of his possessions going for the rest one-two handball or the short pass out of the goal square.

Strongly disagree that his disposals are much more damaging.

If they were he would be well ahead of Mitchell in clearances or score involvements but in 2018 when they were both last fit it wasn't close.

Mitchell has more of an impact on the scoreboard as well as winning the footy.
 

Marcel Proust

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Winning a Grand Final is not relevant to him being an elite mid when he didn't even poll a coaches vote on the day no...

That just goes to show he played his role in a very very good team.
but your overlooking the fact half his afl life was in a very very bad team but he kicked ass, individually. especially, prior to the freo leg injury thing

He is capable or being a offensive mid and getting a lot of the ball but more valauble in a Voss/Hodge type role

Strongly disagree that his disposals are much more damaging.
lol well much of the footy world disagrees with your mitchell assessment. Very good at finding it. questionable impact.

poor mans Lachie Neale?
 

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