Recommitted Brad Crouch [RFA 2020]

[DangerSloane]

They clearly have plenty of currency. If it's a tip 10 pick you want then they simply trade up the order.

You seek very cranky today.

I really dont think anyone wants a late first round pick and a couple of late seconds for a top 10 pick.

 

[tiger_tough]

They clearly have plenty of currency. If it's a tip 10 pick you want then they simply trade up the order.

You seek very cranky today.

Wouldn't be hard if that's what they needed to do, I'd imagine.

 

[Turbocat]

Jenkins and Greenwood I'd say will certainly not be there next year.
Keath probably the same. Douglas and Otten retired already. A couple of blokes will be delisted.

Thats 7 or 8 already.

Most of it is the fact that our age profile doesn't match where our performances are.
Jenkins and Greenwood both want to stay.

How many of your best 22 ? The way the media are talking 7 to 8 is not what id have called a big change. we would done that level change quiet often recently.

We have turned over our list .. and only a few left from the flag in 2011 but really the best 11 of the 22 are still strongly made up of guys closer to the end than the start. Add a player like kelly going and one can see ..turning a list over really is not the same as a big change in your best22. Thats coming for us as well if we are not careful .. if none of the younger players dont become some of our better players.

So do you think hard calls be made on any of the older guys in you best 11 types..?

 

[tiger_tough]

I really dont think anyone wants a late first round pick and a couple of late seconds for a top 10 pick.

I really don't think you understand how it works. For example pick 8 is worth a fair bit less than 16, 34 and 37 in terms of points. Plenty of clubs will look to bank points for academy and father/son picks.

It can be done. Easily.

 

[DangerSloane]

Last I checked pick 16 isn't a 2nd rounder.

16, 34, 35 (compo) and 37 are equal in value to pick 2. Not saying that would be the trade, just demonstrating that there is plenty to work with in addition to future picks and players.

So, I say again, we have the currency in one way or another whether you like it or not.

Equal in points, but if you can find any team that will take that deal then they've been sharing around the crack pipe.

 

[DangerSloane]

How many of your best 22 ? The way the media are talking 7 to 8 is not what id have called a big change. we would done that level change quiet often recently.

We have turned over our list .. and only a few left from the flag in 2011 but really the best 11 of the 22 are still strongly made up of guys closer to the end than the start. Add a player like kelly going and one can see ..turning a list over really is not the same as a big change in your best22. Thats coming for us as well if we are not careful .. if none of the younger players dont become some of our better players.

So do you think hard calls be made on any of the older guys in you best 11 types..?

Depends who you'd call best 11.
Before this season Jenkins would've definitely been in it. He will be gone.
Keath has definitely been in it this year. He will likely be gone.
Greenwood is in other clubs best 22 probably but not ours given we have too many similar guys.

The problem is the ones that need the hard calls dont have a lot of currency.
They're either too old or have gone downhill too quickly.

If you're talking about guys like Tex, Sloane, Crouch... I would hope they are untouchable. They are far from the problem.

 

[tiger_tough]

Equal in points, but if you can find any team that will take that deal then they've been sharing around the crack pipe.

Again, I didn't say that would be the deal, just that the currency is there. Whether the finer details are worked out with the crows or with another club first to secure picks that would satisfy crows, the currency is there. Do you understand?

 

[DangerSloane]

Wouldn't be hard if that's what they needed to do, I'd imagine.

Yeh see how you go packaging 4 rubbish picks for a top 10.
We couldnt even get to pick 3 or 4 last year with 4 picks inside 25. So not sure how you think you're going to do it with 16 and late 2nd rounders.

 

[kreglze]

If the Suns were to get a mid first round pick (11?) instead of that Pick 1, I would be more than happy to trade that along with something else for Crouch if he was interested, would give us a big boost through the middle and would instantly make us more competitive.

 

[DangerSloane]

Again, I didn't say that would be the deal, just that the currency is there. Whether the finer details are worked out with the crows or with another club first to secure picks that would satisfy crows, the currency is there. Do you understand?

I understand what you're saying.
I also understand that its never going to happen.

Its a playstation trade.
I'll trade all my draft picks this year and a rubbish player for a top pick. Works on numbers, not in practice.

Find me a time when its happened?

 

[DangerSloane]

I really don't think you understand how it works. For example pick 8 is worth a fair bit less than 16, 34 and 37 in terms of points. Plenty of clubs will look to bank points for academy and father/son picks.

It can be done. Easily.

Clubs wont be banking points using their top 10 draft pick lol
If they need points for academy or father son they will drop their 2nd pick back to 2 later picks or something similar.
Or offload a couple of fringe players or future picks for 3rd rounders.

There are a heap of ways you can get extra points without sacrificing a top pick.

 

[tiger_tough]

Yeh see how you go packaging 4 rubbish picks for a top 10.
We couldnt even get to pick 3 or 4 last year with 4 picks inside 25. So not sure how you think you're going to do it with 16 and late 2nd rounders.

16 a rubbish pick? . In a draft where they say the talent is fairly even from 3 to 20 odd there really isn't a huge difference.

I understand what you're saying.
I also understand that its never going to happen.

Its a playstation trade.
I'll trade all my draft picks this year and a rubbish player for a top pick. Works on numbers, not in practice.

Find me a time when its happened?

Packaging later picks for an upgrade isn't going to happen? Have you been watching the last few drafts since the points system and academy/father-son bidding system came in?

Clubs wont be banking points using their top 10 draft pick lol
If they need points for academy or father son they will drop their 2nd pick back to 2 later picks or something similar.
Or offload a couple of fringe player for 3rd rounders.

Freo traded pick 6 and a 3rd to Port Adelaide for 11, two 2nds and a 3rd just last year.....

I think we're done here. Like I've said multiple times now, there are options. Whether it's actually on the cards or not, we'll see.

 

[Damon_3388]

Bulls**t.

If Crouch is injury free you take him over Francis. He is exactly what we need in the middle.

If you think he's exactly what you need in the middle, I think you have a misconception on the type of player he is.

 

[bird_man]

I understand what you're saying.
I also understand that its never going to happen.

Its a playstation trade.
I'll trade all my draft picks this year and a rubbish player for a top pick. Works on numbers, not in practice.

Find me a time when its happened?

Clubs trade up and down the draft every year.

First example that comes to mind is Freo trading pick 6 for 11 and some second rounders.

Pick 16 to 9 or 10 isn't a huge leap.

 

[RaySamuel]

Carded for what?
Telling you that you have no idea what you're talking about?

Thats just a statement of fact.

I bet you thought he was leaving last year? I mean that is what was being reported...

The players leaving Adelaide will mostly be players that are not wanted by the club or have value to get some youth in the door, not players wanting out.
For example Jenkins, Betts, B Crouch, Greenwood all WANT to stay. I'm fairly sure Jenkins and Greenwood wont be there next year even though they'd prefer to stay at Adelaide.

The reports of player unrest are largely bulls**t and based off childish rumours.

Why did the crows have such a bad year (making it 2 in a row after starting favourites in a GF)? There's obviously something not right.

 

[DangerSloane]

Why did the crows have such a bad year (making it 2 in a row after starting favourites in a GF)? There's obviously something not right.

The not right started before that grand final.
We got found out. Our game plan became outdated but we continued to run with it for the end of 2017.

We then had a shocking run with injuries in 2018 (FYI Brad Crouch was out the entire year and will win our B+F this year), however after this year it looks like we had a number of senior players fall off a cliff.
Our game style changes clearly didnt work this season and our personnel dont suit where the game is headed (speed is king).
6-6-6 meant that our midfield who are slow and almost entirely inside got found out by teams with speed in the middle.

I sense that doesnt fit the Victorian agenda though of "all the crows players and staff hate each other and all want to leave"

I mean in the last month we've had bs rumours about Betts leaving, Tex leaving, Pyke and Jenkins punching on...how much more BS has to come out before people stop believing it.

 

[DangerSloane]

16 a rubbish pick? . In a draft where they say the talent is fairly even from 3 to 20 odd there really isn't a huge difference.


Packaging later picks for an upgrade isn't going to happen? Have you been watching the last few drafts since the points system and academy/father-son bidding system came in?


Freo traded pick 6 and a 3rd to Port Adelaide for 11, two 2nds and a 3rd just last year.....

I think we're done here. Like I've said multiple times now, there are options. Whether it's actually on the cards or not, we'll see.

Tell me again how 16 is a good pick:


Even then that is misleading because Himmelberg was an academy selection that Adelaide bid on.

 

[Crow till I die]

Tell me again how 16 is a good pick:
View attachment 736517

Even then that is misleading because Himmelberg was an academy selection that Adelaide bid on.

This Richmond poster is having a laugh - pick 16. How will it be pick 16 when there is every chance they win the bleedy thing this year and after any PP to GC + tom green gets a bid, their 1st rounder could be into the 20's. No, Richmond are not the club I would even countenance speaking to about trading one of our blue chip players to

 

[tiger_tough]

Tell me again how 16 is a good pick:
View attachment 736517

Even then that is misleading because Himmelberg was an academy selection that Adelaide bid on.

Wow. Considering draft order isn't finalized yet (hence why I said currently) and there are still likely to be a couple early academy/father-son picks to be added this is a pointless exercise.

You can find duds and bargains for any pick up to the 4th or 5th round. A first rounder is a first rounder. It's what your recruiters do with it that makes it valuable, not what has been done with that pick in the past.

This Richmond poster is having a laugh - pick 16. How will it be pick 16 when there is every chance they win the bleedy thing this year and after any PP to GC + tom green gets a bid, their 1st rounder could be into the 20's. No, Richmond are not the club I would even countenance speaking to about trading one of our blue chip players to

I said currently

Unfortunately it's not up to you. If it's true that we are keen and have been in his ear for a couple seasons now plus the tumultuous situation your club is knee deep in I'd think looking to move to someone like us would be a rather appealing move for him.

It's all hypothetical at this point anyway. Don't stress crows fans. It's just a discussion, don't take it personally. Clubs have shown time and time again that they can produce what is required to get a trade done when they need to.

 

[DangerSloane]

Wow. Considering draft order isn't finalized yet (hence why I said currently) and there are still likely to be a couple early academy/father-son picks to be added this is a pointless exercise.

You can find duds and bargains for any pick up to the 4th or 5th round. A first rounder is a first rounder. It's what your recruiters do with it that makes it valuable, not what has been done with that pick in the past.


I said currently

Unfortunately it's not up to you. If it's true that we are keen and have been in his ear for a couple seasons now plus the tumultuous situation your club is knee deep in I'd think looking to move to someone like us would be a rather appealing move for him.

It's all hypothetical at this point anyway. Don't stress crows fans. It's just a discussion, don't take it personally. Clubs have shown time and time again that they can produce what is required to get a trade done when they need to.

The point is, besides a few outliers, the lower the pick the better the player.
Especially once you leave the top 6 or 7, the quality and games numbers drop away.

A low first rounder isnt the same as a high first rounder.. thats the point. Teams wont take 2 in the teens for one under 10.
The fact is there is A LOT more value in pick 5 than pick 15.

A 'first rounder' covers everything from the best kid in the land to possibly the 22nd best kid in the land (after PP, FS, Academy).

 

[tiger_tough]

The point is, besides a few outliers, the lower the pick the better the player.
Especially once you leave the top 6 or 7, the quality and games numbers drop away.

A low first rounder isnt the same as a high first rounder.. thats the point. Teams wont take 2 in the teens for one under 10.
The fact is there is A LOT more value in pick 5 than pick 15.

A 'first rounder' covers everything from the best kid in the land to possibly the 22nd best kid in the land (after PP, FS, Academy).

Great insight. Thanks.

 

[Kreuuuzeurns]

Wow. Considering draft order isn't finalized yet (hence why I said currently) and there are still likely to be a couple early academy/father-son picks to be added this is a pointless exercise.

You can find duds and bargains for any pick up to the 4th or 5th round. A first rounder is a first rounder. It's what your recruiters do with it that makes it valuable, not what has been done with that pick in the past.

Crows in the past have done pretty well in the mid-later part of the first round (Doedee, Lever, Milera etc). They will let you know about it too.

For some reason this year they are undervaluing those picks. Saw a suggestion saying they’d only trade pick 3 for 12,13 and a 2020 first rounder!? In a draft that’s so even past the top 2 that is absurd to me. You’re getting much of the same with any pick from 3-20 this year as you mentioned.

 

[DangerSloane]

Great insight. Thanks.

Well it sure beats "a first rounder is a first rounder"
Like saying a car is a car.

No a smart car and a ferrari are not the same.

 

[DangerSloane]

Crows in the past have done pretty well in the mid-later part of the first round (Doedee, Lever, Milera etc). They will let you know about it too.

For some reason this year they are undervaluing those picks. Saw a suggestion saying they’d only trade pick 3 for 12,13 and a 2020 first rounder!? In a draft that’s so even past the top 2 that is absurd to me. You’re getting much of the same with any pick from 3-20 this year as you mentioned.

Just because we make the best of a poor poker hand doesn't mean you want to be dealt the poor hand every time...
Some people are saying 3-20 are the same.
People have said things like that in the past and turned out to be dead wrong.

 

[marty36]

I'd be surprised if a first and two seconds didn't get it done. He's not worth two firsts. And did you read the part about next year's first likely to be available? We have plenty of picks and depth players with currency that could be worked to find a suitable deal.

The issue isn't us having the currency or not, it's us having the cap space or not. If we are actually interested as reported.

Adelaide will get around pick 5 for him next year or he stays

What is better than pick 5

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