Is Shaun Burgoyne the best clutch player of all time?

[seysearles]

I still can't believe Geelong lost that game. I'd have thought Geelong could've had someone to step up to Burgoynes level, it's a shame that Geelong (not for you) didn't have anyone to step it up, I felt that the flag went begging, but kudos to Hawthorn, an elite premiership side full of legends.

Yeah I have no doubt that if they had tagged Burgoyne out of that final quarter they would have won. It would have been worth their while to put two guys on him just to quell his influence. Pretty much the entire momentum was being driven by him from the midfield and then later when it was "break glass in case of emergency" time as a goal kicker up forward. I kept thinking that any moment Scott was going to make the move but it never came. Burgoyne became an instant Hawthorn legend that night.

 

[demondavey]

Yeah I have no doubt that if they had tagged Burgoyne out of that final quarter they would have won. It would have been worth their while to put two guys on him just to quell his influence. Pretty much the entire momentum was being driven by him from the midfield and then later when it was "break glass in case of emergency" time as a goal kicker up forward. I kept thinking that any moment Scott was going to make the move but it never came. Burgoyne became an instant Hawthorn legend that night.

Varcoe almost missed a critical goal, but yes, Burgoyne was the difference. Unbelievable player.

 

[Steven Gerrard]

Was chatting to some mates, all neutrals except MightyHawks and they all said Burgoyne.

Got me thinking and I can’t actually think of a player who consistently performs when it matters more than him.

I’m sure someone will come up with some other names, these are my favourite type of players.

No. And I have 119 reasons why.

An example of how and why he is the exact opposite. Round 21 (I think), in 2010 or 2011 (I think), Hawthorn v Freo in Tassie, dead game, nothing riding on it, Fremantle fielded its B side. Hawthorn thumped them. Burgoyne BOG, a million possessions. 2 weeks later, same two teams, Elimination final, Freo's A side, Burgoyne doesn't get a farking kick.

I have always likened S Burgoyne to Mark Waugh. he is the Mark Waugh of the AFL. When Mark Waugh would come in when Australia was 1-250, he'd make a slow and gracious ton. When Australia was looking shaky, he'd get out cheaply. Steve Waugh on the other hand, constantly saved Australia's bacon, he's the guy you'd want batting for your life. Not gracious like Mark, but boy he could grind it out when the going got tough. And Shaun is just like Mark Waugh. When the team around him is doing well, he chimes in like the silk that he is. When it's tough in the trenches, he's the last player you'd want in there with you.

He will peform when it matters most if his team mates are peforming. But don't expect him to peform if his team mates aren't and are looking to him for leadership. He's a farking spud in those circumstances and I have no qualms in saying that.

Want another example. Port v Crows 2005, round 19 or round 20. Crows top, Port struggling to make the 8. Crows clearly the best team all year, favourites for the flag, Port needing a win to avoid becoming the first reigning premier to avoid missing the 8 in god knows how long. This was the game Eddie cracked the shits because it was being beamed lived around the nation ahead of another bla bla Collingwood Carlton game. I remember it well because I could not even sit in the same room as my Crows supporting brother, so we were shouting obscenities at each other all night, across the house. Close game all night, Crows ahead for most of it. Late in the game Port rally, about 3 or 4 points behind, a minute to go. Shaun Burgoyne has the ball in the middle of the ground and starts running, his team mates streaming forward with him. One bounce, 2 bounce, 3 bounces, 4th bounce as he's approaching 50, ball doesn't come up. Crows players pounce on the turnover, stream forward, kick a goal, 9 or 10 points the difference. 30 seconds later, siren has gone to end the game. Crows win because he couldn't bounce a farking ball.

Anyone who thinks this guy is clutch has no idea about Aussie Rules.

That is all.

 

[Gavin Excell]

No. And I have 119 reasons why.

An example of how and why he is the exact opposite. Round 21 (I think), in 2010 or 2011 (I think), Hawthorn v Freo in Tassie, dead game, nothing riding on it, Fremantle fielded its B side. Hawthorn thumped them. Burgoyne BOG, a million possessions. 2 weeks later, same two teams, Elimination final, Freo's A side, Burgoyne doesn't get a farking kick.

I have always likened S Burgoyne to Mark Waugh. he is the Mark Waugh of the AFL. When Mark Waugh would come in when Australia was 1-250, he'd make a slow and gracious ton. When Australia was looking shaky, he'd get out cheaply. Steve Waugh on the other hand, constantly saved Australia's bacon, he's the guy you'd want batting for your life. Not gracious like Mark, but boy he could grind it out when the going got tough. And Shaun is just like Mark Waugh. When the team around him is doing well, he chimes in like the silk that he is. When it's tough in the trenches, he's the last player you'd want in there with you.

He will peform when it matters most if his team mates are peforming. But don't expect him to peform if his team mates aren't and are looking to him for leadership. He's a farking spud in those circumstances and I have no qualms in saying that.

Want another example. Port v Crows 2005, round 19 or round 20. Crows top, Port struggling to make the 8. Crows clearly the best team all year, favourites for the flag, Port needing a win to avoid becoming the first reigning premier to avoid missing the 8 in god knows how long. This was the game Eddie cracked the shits because it was being beamed lived around the nation ahead of another bla bla Collingwood Carlton game. I remember it well because I could not even sit in the same room as my Crows supporting brother, so we were shouting obscenities at each other all night, across the house. Close game all night, Crows ahead for most of it. Late in the game Port rally, about 3 or 4 points behind, a minute to go. Shaun Burgoyne has the ball in the middle of the ground and starts running, his team mates streaming forward with him. One bounce, 2 bounce, 3 bounces, 4th bounce as he's approaching 50, ball doesn't come up. Crows players pounce on the turnover, stream forward, kick a goal, 9 or 10 points the difference. 30 seconds later, siren has gone to end the game. Crows win because he couldn't bounce a farking ball.

Anyone who thinks this guy is clutch has no idea about Aussie Rules.

That is all.

He has been pretty intrumental for Hawks when they've been up against it

The 2013 prelim comes to mind

 

[dcutter]

No. And I have 119 reasons why.

An example of how and why he is the exact opposite. Round 21 (I think), in 2010 or 2011 (I think), Hawthorn v Freo in Tassie, dead game, nothing riding on it, Fremantle fielded its B side. Hawthorn thumped them. Burgoyne BOG, a million possessions. 2 weeks later, same two teams, Elimination final, Freo's A side, Burgoyne doesn't get a farking kick.

I have always likened S Burgoyne to Mark Waugh. he is the Mark Waugh of the AFL. When Mark Waugh would come in when Australia was 1-250, he'd make a slow and gracious ton. When Australia was looking shaky, he'd get out cheaply. Steve Waugh on the other hand, constantly saved Australia's bacon, he's the guy you'd want batting for your life. Not gracious like Mark, but boy he could grind it out when the going got tough. And Shaun is just like Mark Waugh. When the team around him is doing well, he chimes in like the silk that he is. When it's tough in the trenches, he's the last player you'd want in there with you.

He will peform when it matters most if his team mates are peforming. But don't expect him to peform if his team mates aren't and are looking to him for leadership. He's a farking spud in those circumstances and I have no qualms in saying that.

Want another example. Port v Crows 2005, round 19 or round 20. Crows top, Port struggling to make the 8. Crows clearly the best team all year, favourites for the flag, Port needing a win to avoid becoming the first reigning premier to avoid missing the 8 in god knows how long. This was the game Eddie cracked the shits because it was being beamed lived around the nation ahead of another bla bla Collingwood Carlton game. I remember it well because I could not even sit in the same room as my Crows supporting brother, so we were shouting obscenities at each other all night, across the house. Close game all night, Crows ahead for most of it. Late in the game Port rally, about 3 or 4 points behind, a minute to go. Shaun Burgoyne has the ball in the middle of the ground and starts running, his team mates streaming forward with him. One bounce, 2 bounce, 3 bounces, 4th bounce as he's approaching 50, ball doesn't come up. Crows players pounce on the turnover, stream forward, kick a goal, 9 or 10 points the difference. 30 seconds later, siren has gone to end the game. Crows win because he couldn't bounce a farking ball.

Anyone who thinks this guy is clutch has no idea about Aussie Rules.

That is all.

The off season brings about some idiotic posts at times.

But this one, unquestionably, takes the cake.

 

[PhatBoy]

Again, a gun fwd but also missed an after the siren chance to win.

Whats with nominating dudes who at some point in their careers have failed the ultimate clutch test???

Should i put forward Isaac Smith?

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Because there is a huge difference between failing with a difficult shot that you’ll probably rarely kick in normal time (ie. Hawkins’ shot against the Giants) and missing one that you’d normally nail just because of the extra pressure.

Michael Bevan wouldn’t suddenly become a non-pressure player if, in one game, he needed 3 off the last ball and couldn’t manage to hit a Yorker into the deep.

Hawkins has also passed the test many times, famously from 55m out after the siren on one occasion.

If the criteria is based purely on something as specific as kicking a goal after the siren then George Horlin-Smith becomes a star.

 

[Hawk_francais]

I have always likened S Burgoyne to Mark Waugh. he is the Mark Waugh of the AFL.

When it's tough in the trenches, he's the last player you'd want in there with you.

Anyone who thinks this guy is clutch has no idea about Aussie Rules.

That is all.

You don't think you've overstated anything here?

 

[Frank Gallagher]

Not sure if father time has caught up with him but damn he looked slow tonight.

 

[Xtreme]

Burgoyne is a 4 time premiership winner

Thats 4 more flags than what Nick Riewoldt could ever dream about. And 4 more premierships than Dangerfield will ever win.

He's a superstar
He's a hero!!

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Last quarter of the 2013 PF was one of the most inspiring things i've ever seen on a football field. Burgoyne single handedly dragged us into a grand final, which unfolded into a threepeat. Geelong had the game in their pockets and it was Burgoyne that said "no, this is not happening today". I get emotional even reflecting on it. The guy is a frikin legend.

Before that game an ITK poster posted that Clarkson had a plan to throw someone forward as a secret weapon that would surprise Geelong.

 

[ManOfClay]

In terms of performance to game importance ratio, Tom Boyd is currently the most clutch player in the league

 

[Luv_our_club]

Not sure if father time has caught up with him but damn he looked slow tonight.

He has always looked slow. He is part of that unicorn group of footballers who looks slow but have space and time like Tuck, Pendles, Jarman.

 

[threesixpio]

Last quarter of the 2013 PF was one of the most inspiring things i've ever seen on a football field. Burgoyne single handedly dragged us into a grand final, which unfolded into a threepeat. Geelong had the game in their pockets and it was Burgoyne that said "no, this is not happening today". I get emotional even reflecting on it. The guy is a frikin legend.

Crazily emotional game of footy

 

[PetterdHoisted]

Always funny reading opinions on that Hawks side, when in the games I watched them in Vs the Tigers in that era, they often didn't turn up.

Personally I never minded Burgoyne getting the ball against the Tiges, held on to the ball a split second longer than the other Hawks players and not overly quick either, very often got run down HTB.

 

[PhatBoy]

Burgoyne is a 4 time premiership winner

Thats 4 more flags than what Nick Riewoldt could ever dream about. And 4 more premierships than Dangerfield will ever win.

He's a superstar
He's a hero!!

Oh well then, like Trent West and Mark Blake it automatically makes him a far better player than both.

 

[Xhoquelin]

I love Burgoyne but he's more of a Iguodala/injured knees Roy/past his prime Allen than a Kobe IMO, a smart player who can make game defining actions when the team needs him but ultimately succeeds in a great system which covers up his age and lack of endurance.

Luke Hodge would be my pick from 2005 onwards, two Norms says it all. Loved Bartel and Goodes as well but I'd have Burgoyne ahead of them in terms of clutchness. Goodes was more unstoppable than clutch. Bartel simply has a brilliant footy mind all throughout the game so he's someone who is just overall a very high level player.

 

[Stratton_Gun]

More clutch than Hodge imo. Game in the balance with a couple of minutes to go. There is a 90% chance he will be in the centre

 

[Bokonon_]

When a game needed to be won you wanted Voss or Hird.

In that order.

Voss has to be the most influential player I have ever watched. Just willed himself into everything.

You've described Mathhews but I'm assuming he was before your time

 

[Vindicater]

You've described Mathhews but I'm assuming he was before your time

Yes.

Started watching in the late 80's.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

For best big game player ever, I would argue Dermott Brereton - I know I am biased. And i know its also because he played so many, which is a huge advantage. His debut was a final in 1982 - kicks 5. Breaks the record for most goals in a GF when he kicks 8 in 1985. He Kicks 3 with broken ribs and split kidney in the 1989 GF. He kicks 5 in the 1991 GF. And so on.

...and so on? What about the 1987 grand final, where his direct opponent towelled him up to the extent that he won the Norm Smith? And it's not like we're talking about Bradley, Kernahan, or Silvagni...David Rhys-Jones embarrassed him.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Always funny reading opinions on that Hawks side, when in the games I watched them in Vs the Tigers in that era, they often didn't turn up.

Personally I never minded Burgoyne getting the ball against the Tiges, held on to the ball a split second longer than the other Hawks players and not overly quick either, very often got run down HTB.

I guess you’re unaware that Burgoyne was the fastest player on the Hawthorn list up until only recently.

It was a cool story about him being caught “very often” though.

 

[Fluro Boots]

...and so on? What about the 1987 grand final, where his direct opponent towelled him up to the extent that he won the Norm Smith? And it's not like we're talking about Bradley, Kernahan, or Silvagni...David Rhys-Jones embarrassed him.

He played lame, and was exposed as such.

 

[PhatBoy]

I guess you’re unaware that Burgoyne was the fastest player on the Hawthorn list up until only recently.

It was a cool story about him being caught “very often” though.

Yes because no player in the sport’s history has ever been tackled from front or side on

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Yes because no player in the sport’s history has ever been tackled from front or side on

What does run down mean to you?

 

[PhatBoy]

What does run down mean to you?

It means tackled while running with the ball.

I didn’t realise a protractor had to be produced to show someone running in a line directly behind the ball carrier to do it. The most famous tackle in rugby league history, referred to as Todd Byrne being run down, came from more or less side on.