Rumour GFC 2017 Player Trading, Drafting, FA, Rumours, and Wish lists.

[Turbocat]

Really turbo cat so if they are proactive like you say they can trade him anywhere back into Melbourne and actually get a first and second rounder for him off various clubs who would snap him up. Why would they trade chips for a contracted just so they can get a 1000 draft points of us. When we cannot accommodate the requirements for a player like this.

There is a whole list of players and talent on the GWS roster they are always doing deals to minimise list size. More first round picks or academy selections than nearly any side ever. And apparently the world will fall down for them over a late first round selection. When they are a equal premiership favourite?

I dont think I specified that they would only deal with us , only that a deal with them is probable.

 

[Turbocat]

Doesn't make any difference if the franchises are privately owned its still run by a league just like afl governed by rules. Clubs operate independently from the AFL in terms of how they run their own operation.

The age of drafted players you have completely wrong as they usually go to college and play in the 2nd biggest competition other than NBA or NFL so the drafting age is minimum 19 the best will come early and others will stay in college to 22 then go pro. Our draft age is much younger 18 out of highschool we also have pre selected 17 year olds go. as we don't have a professional level junior program. The cattleyard you are talking about is just pure size of the sport that's why so much pressure is on players because of the amount of exposure they have they will get a 100 thousand to college games. We get that to a grand final . We will never get to that level because we will never have a global game.

Players have to accept a trade now which would work as it usually does. And the clubs would have physicals you need to pass or trades are vetoed.

The AFL will start small but within 3 years you will be able to trade players in draft.

You look at the 12-6 model they want to bring in that is absolute crap. And is set up just like a division in NFL or NBA.

It is coming though its in the works so get ready for the cattleyard I love the idea even if it will take time for others to adjust. It puts more power into the hands of good management and crushes poor management. I have watched NBA and NFL for a decade though this is seems extremely normal and basic rule changes to me.

When you see trades 4-5 years into the future and exhanging 6-8 players over three teams. Or teams giving away 3 future top5 picks to get one franchise player it gets interesting. We will never get to that but change is definitely coming

I have the age completely wrong? Perhaps I was unclear. The age our our draftees is 18 , the age overseas is older. This trading of just drafted kids would seem a little to unfeeling to be trading schoolboys , I doubt it would sit well ...and the comment by Clayton that a player is not tied to a club till the draft is over would seem disingenuous to me , especially when in the same article they have a line up of the top10 kids in jumpers. Im not really seeing the huge advantage of trading recently drafted kids unless it involves the total list.

 

[Turbocat]

Hasn't hurt Hawks or Sydney !

As I said , its probably picking the low hang fruit to say what they have.
No doubt there are a lot of advantages of drafting and creating rather than trading in..but just like a Q and A episode where it easy to point out other peoples errors with having to deal without the reality of having to be elected , its easy to say draft rather than trade but they do not have to be concerned with memberships and financials of what happens with clubs that drop out of contention.

 

[Spazz Cat]

I have the age completely wrong? Perhaps I was unclear. The age our our draftees is 18 , the age overseas is older. This trading of just drafted kids would seem a little to unfeeling to be trading schoolboys , I doubt it would sit well ...and the comment by Clayton that a player is not tied to a club till the draft is over would seem disingenuous to me , especially when in the same article they have a line up of the top10 kids in jumpers. Im not really seeing the huge advantage of trading recently drafted kids unless it involves the total list.

I agree. As Daz said picks is enough. It doesn't sit well with me either stuffing around with kids on draft day.
Little bit off the topic but I wouldn't mind seeing the draft age raised till 19, and a sort of college type system set up with the VFL or something like that.
Would work better for players as they have more time to mature, and also clubs as they get to have a look at players running around in a more senior competition.

 

[Turbocat]

I agree. As Daz said picks is enough. It doesn't sit well with me either stuffing around with kids on draft day.
Little bit off the topic but I wouldn't mind seeing the draft age raised till 19, and a sort of college type system set up with the VFL or something like that.
Would work better for players as they have more time to mature, and also clubs as they get to have a look at players running around in a more senior competition.

Its a tough dilemma spazz , some kids are ready to go.. Joel Selwood like. Go thru games played from last years (2015) draft. Plenty played a heap of games.. to deny some kids an income when they were ready would seem wrong as well.

 

[Spazz Cat]

Its a tough dilemma spazz , some kids are ready to go.. Joel Selwood like. Go thru games played from last years (2015) draft. Plenty played a heap of games.. to deny some kids an income when they were ready would seem wrong as well.

View attachment 336797

Yeah I guess you're right. And now I think of it even AFL clubs with all their resources and player welfare people etc sometimes have a tough time taking care of kids living away from home, a VFL type scenario probably would not be good.
Remember the days of u/19's, Reserves, Seniors.
Actually wasn't a bad setup.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Devon smith would be on similar cash to motlop. These are fantasy trades for starters Devon smith ain't coming to Geelong next year. FANTASY TRADES

We have nothing to trade except players as he is worth a first round guaranteed. We have a first rounder we can't trade we can't trade future firsts our salary cap is maxed as well.

So settle right down they were docked 1000 points which is equivalent to pick 17. So no one is desperate at all with the amount of picks GWS has had recently losing pick 17 means nothing.

Details
Giants were slapped with a $100,000 fine and the loss of 1000 draft points for their role in the long-running Whitfield saga.

The docked draft points is the equivalent of about pick 17.

They are not giving up one of their best young small forwards for two second rounders to reclaim pick 17. Devon smith is going nowhere he will stay at gws.

Actually i think he will leave but time will tell. As for our cap i dont believe its maxed out either and i think we have more room but the next 18 months will show either way on that.

You have missed the point of my post what I was pointing out was even if they got a top 10 pick for smith from another club they wont be able to use it in the draft it will be to match a bid on brander richards etc (as their other first rounder will get stripped). So why would they care about the pick number when they wont use it on an open draft player, they just want the most points possible. If geelong offered them 2 or more picks equal to a top 10 pick in points they wont care what the actual pick number is. If say 2 clubs offer them the equivalent of pick 9 they wont baulk because one offers the actual pick 9 and the other offers two picks where the points value is equal to pick 9, the outcome for them re academy players is the same either way.

As for the rest they are not in a strong position to bargain smith is ooc and if he wants to get back here he can nominate for the psd so long as one of the first 3 picks belongs to a vic club and they get nothing. They will compromise because they have to.

They also dont excel at getting value in their trades if you look at most of the players they have traded out (except for treloar) they have taken relative unders for and this will be no different.

I am not saying smith wants geelong but if he does and we want him here it will get done, these trades almost always do.

 

[Turbocat]

Yeah I guess you're right. And now I think of it even AFL clubs with all their resources and player welfare people etc sometimes have a tough time taking care of kids living away from home, a VFL type scenario probably would not be good.
Remember the days of u/19's, Reserves, Seniors.
Actually wasn't a bad setup.

Perhaps a Dangerfield type situation should be formalised somehow.
He let it be known he wanted to stay home for his final year. Probably one of the bugbears in Adelaide as they feel they didn't get full value from him in his first year. He did play a couple of games that were in Vic.
Anyway it would be an option if one fealt unready but also felt the underlying pressure to get drafted while there was interest.
There is also the option these days for some 19 year olds to stay in the TAC.

Yes , a lot to be said for the old three tier setup. If you were good enough and ready you could play , if not you gradually work towards readiness.

 

[Turbocat]

Actually i think he will leave but time will tell. As for our cap i dont believe its maxed out either and i think we have more room but the next 18 months will show either way on that.

You have missed the point of my post what I was pointing out was even if they got a top 10 pick for smith from another club they wont be able to use it in the draft it will be to match a bid on brander richards etc (as their other first rounder will get stripped). So why would they care about the pick number when they wont use it on an open draft player, they just want the most points possible. If geelong offered them 2 or more picks equal to a top 10 pick in points they wont care what the actual pick number is. If say 2 clubs offer them the equivalent of pick 9 they wont baulk because one offers the actual pick 9 and the other offers two picks where the points value is equal to pick 9, the outcome for them re academy players is the same either way.

As for the rest they are not in a strong position to bargain smith is ooc and if he wants to get back here he can nominate for the psd so long as one of the first 3 picks belongs to a vic club and they get nothing. They will compromise because they have to.

They also dont excel at getting value in their trades if you look at most of the players they have traded out (except for treloar) they have taken relative unders for and this will be no different.

I am not saying smith wants geelong but if he does and we want him here it will get done, these trades almost always do.

I think they have done reasonably well out of most the trades when one considers what they have done at their next clubs. Perhaps thats just misinterpretation , as I have not done a study on it. Boyd for instance , think they have done well on that trade... although Id agree that Marchbank now trade may burn them a bit.
The issue for them is they cant fit them all in the side. Kids like Hooped would be in nearly any other side.

 

[Ray Donovan]

IMO, The AFLPA won't want the players to lose the autonomy of where they play.

Thus, I removed it as a variable. not saying it wont appear down the road but currently and in the near term (5 years) I dont see it personally.

The rest will happen but then need to introduce and let it play out for several cycles before changing it again - just to see how it plays out.

I know the NFL allows the trading of players on draft day but its rare in its occurrence. Also the trading of recently selected players is rare too - the most recent NFL example I can recall is Philly Rivers and Eli Manning with the Chargers and Giants. Point being is so infrequent, and with the AFLPA situation, I just dont see the need for it anytime soon.

The trading picks, IMO, will be enough for the interim (next 3-5) years to "spice up" thee Draft process.

The Redskins gave up the planet to get RGIII - 3 years of picks - and it sunk them. Rams did with Goff too and while the jury is still out they look to have lost so far.

I dont mind the process but the AFL needs to put trading restrictions in place, be clear about them, and enforce them. Id hate to see a team like the Lions for example become the Browns.

GO Catters

Yeah agree with your points NFL has very few 100% guaranteed contracts so it changes things in that respect. Agreed these trades are rare because generally two franchises

I agree. As Daz said picks is enough. It doesn't sit well with me either stuffing around with kids on draft day.
Little bit off the topic but I wouldn't mind seeing the draft age raised till 19, and a sort of college type system set up with the VFL or something like that.
Would work better for players as they have more time to mature, and also clubs as they get to have a look at players running around in a more senior competition.

I have the age completely wrong? Perhaps I was unclear. The age our our draftees is 18 , the age overseas is older. This trading of just drafted kids would seem a little to unfeeling to be trading schoolboys , I doubt it would sit well ...and the comment by Clayton that a player is not tied to a club till the draft is over would seem disingenuous to me , especially when in the same article they have a line up of the top10 kids in jumpers. Im not really seeing the huge advantage of trading recently drafted kids unless it involves the total list.

It's not disengenious at all its business this is why draftees have managers. This is professional sport this can be a huge amount of money and amazing career for some devastation for a lot of others that miss out that would kill to get drafted millions of teenagers want to get drafted. You don't choose where you get drafted too. Clubs are making huge investments in the draft on players if they see a good deal and it requires them to move a recently acquired selection. Or select a player with the intention on moving them to benefit the club with more picks future picks etc so be it.

I understand this theory is hard to swallow if your not familiar with american free agency trading and college sport. Clayton is describing a typical NBA draft period.

This is an entertainent sport this creates interest it creates an extra level on preparation and player movement and will allow teams to regenerate and or disintegrate much quicker.

I actually agree with a lot of your points but I think it will work wonders for under leagues TAC cup, WAFL, Sanfl, VFL all these leagues will greatly benefit because of the ability to move players and picks. The coverage will double because clubs when dealing afl listed players or top draft picks have to rate them perfectly which we all know how unpredictable draft picks can be. As evidenced by Richmond and Melbourne 5 years ago.

So the backbone of american sport is high school and college sport. Because talent evaluation is crucial when making multi million dollar franchise decisions with players. It is the biggest level under the pro's.

If we can get Changes like this in it could revolutionize junior competitions and then we can look at lifting the draft age. The problem with lifting draft age is players then sit in limbo for a year and VFL WAFL clubs would want to contract guys all clubs want to put players on payroll. There is no premier u22 comp in this league if you want to be a pro footballer its hard to except a uni degree course its VFL WAFL or club football somewhere. Our system is a designed for players to be drafted at 18-19 and if good enough go pro.

 

[Ray Donovan]

Actually i think he will leave but time will tell. As for our cap i dont believe its maxed out either and i think we have more room but the next 18 months will show either way on that.

You have missed the point of my post what I was pointing out was even if they got a top 10 pick for smith from another club they wont be able to use it in the draft it will be to match a bid on brander richards etc (as their other first rounder will get stripped). So why would they care about the pick number when they wont use it on an open draft player, they just want the most points possible. If geelong offered them 2 or more picks equal to a top 10 pick in points they wont care what the actual pick number is. If say 2 clubs offer them the equivalent of pick 9 they wont baulk because one offers the actual pick 9 and the other offers two picks where the points value is equal to pick 9, the outcome for them re academy players is the same either way.

As for the rest they are not in a strong position to bargain smith is ooc and if he wants to get back here he can nominate for the psd so long as one of the first 3 picks belongs to a vic club and they get nothing. They will compromise because they have to.

They also dont excel at getting value in their trades if you look at most of the players they have traded out (except for treloar) they have taken relative unders for and this will be no different.

I am not saying smith wants geelong but if he does and we want him here it will get done, these trades almost always do.

Of course I want Devon Smith at geelong. My reasoning is he is a top 5 young talent at GWS he could be a superstar guys like that just don't get thrown away for any reason let alone to satisfy this drafting scenario. A million others trades can satisfy the needs of GWS like March bank last season went for our first rounder. You don't throw talent like that out in a premiership window for chips he has some really good mates at GWS at a superstrong club in premiership contention for multiple years. They played hardball with McCarthy and your telling me they will let a restricted free agent like smith go for a couple of 2nd rounders to satisfy academy selection. I highly doubt he is leaving GWS and if he is the asking price will be extremely high as they will want players in exchange they have had enough picks. Just this years crop would satisfy the needs for the next 4years we haven't even had a first rounder last 2 years don't worry about gws and picks.

They are in win now mode
Deliedio, DB, Mzungu are evidence of that

 

[Ray Donovan]

Actually i think he will leave but time will tell. As for our cap i dont believe its maxed out either and i think we have more room but the next 18 months will show either way on that.

You have missed the point of my post what I was pointing out was even if they got a top 10 pick for smith from another club they wont be able to use it in the draft it will be to match a bid on brander richards etc (as their other first rounder will get stripped). So why would they care about the pick number when they wont use it on an open draft player, they just want the most points possible. If geelong offered them 2 or more picks equal to a top 10 pick in points they wont care what the actual pick number is. If say 2 clubs offer them the equivalent of pick 9 they wont baulk because one offers the actual pick 9 and the other offers two picks where the points value is equal to pick 9, the outcome for them re academy players is the same either way.

As for the rest they are not in a strong position to bargain smith is ooc and if he wants to get back here he can nominate for the psd so long as one of the first 3 picks belongs to a vic club and they get nothing. They will compromise because they have to.

They also dont excel at getting value in their trades if you look at most of the players they have traded out (except for treloar) they have taken relative unders for and this will be no different.

I am not saying smith wants geelong but if he does and we want him here it will get done, these trades almost always do.

We spent multiple posts arguing about the Geelong 4-2 and how you believed it wouldn't matter the penalty of restricting our trading of futures or a draft pick penalty of some description.

All of a sudden gws of all clubs loses a pick and it really matters of the list of every club in the league GWS are the most likely not to care.

 

[Ray Donovan]

As I said , its probably picking the low hang fruit to say what they have.
No doubt there are a lot of advantages of drafting and creating rather than trading in..but just like a Q and A episode where it easy to point out other peoples errors with having to deal with the reality of having to be elected , its easy to say draft rather than trade but they do not have to be concerned with memberships and financials of what happens with clubs that drop out of contention.

I read if we won the flag this season with bonuses Geelong would of been in the plus. I am assuming a top 4 got us nearly breaking even. This is also why equalization was brought in which doesn't really help Geelong. But does help to prob up clubs like GS and Bris etc who must be leaking money afl wise at the moment

 

[Ray Donovan]

Perhaps a Dangerfield type situation should be formalised somehow.
He let it be known he wanted to stay home for his final year. Probably one of the bugbears in Adelaide as they feel they didn't get full value from him in his first year. He did play a couple of games that were in Vic.
Anyway it would be an option if one fealt unready but also felt the underlying pressure to get drafted while there was interest.
There is also the option these days for some 19 year olds to stay in the TAC.

Yes , a lot to be said for the old three tier setup. If you were good enough and ready you could play , if not you gradually work towards readiness.

Most clubs are pretty good with allowing students to finish school and Dangerfield was 17 when drafted finishing year 12. Not 18 finished with VCE. And a top 10 draft pick I don't think guys picked 20 plus are going to give up their dream to sit at home till they turn 18.

The media training and counselling has vastly improved and as the game gets even more media focused with technology more scutiny will be on players. Its why so much psychological testing is done on young draftees because its such a tough game mentally in the spotlight.

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Of course I want Devon Smith at geelong. My reasoning is he is a top 5 young talent at GWS he could be a superstar guys like that just don't get thrown away for any reason let alone to satisfy this drafting scenario. A million others trades can satisfy the needs of GWS like March bank last season went for our first rounder. You don't throw talent like that out in a premiership window for chips he has some really good mates at GWS at a superstrong club in premiership contention for multiple years. They played hardball with McCarthy and your telling me they will let a restricted free agent like smith go for a couple of 2nd rounders to satisfy academy selection. I highly doubt he is leaving GWS and if he is the asking price will be extremely high as they will want players in exchange they have had enough picks. Just this years crop would satisfy the needs for the next 4years we haven't even had a first rounder last 2 years don't worry about gws and picks.

They are in win now mode
Deliedio, DB, Mzungu are evidence of that

They huffed and puffed on mccarthy but in the end they traded him and picks 7 34 and 72 for 3, in other words they traded mccarthy for pretty much nothing. And he was contracted. If smith, while uncontracted (he is not afree agent of any sort they have no matching rights) requests a trade they will end up getting unders (whoever its from). There are plenty of examples of this in recent years as the players have the power not the clubs, this is how the system has been for some time.

As to whether geelong should trade again or focus on the draft this year i can see your point there but thats a different debate.

As a side point i disagree on smith being a top 5 talent at gws they have a fair few better than him.

 

[Ray Donovan]

They huffed and puffed on mccarthy but in the end they traded him and picks 7 34 and 72 for 3, in other words they traded mccarthy for pretty much nothing. And he was contracted. If smith, while uncontracted (he is not afree agent of any sort they have no matching rights) requests a trade they will end up getting unders (whoever its from). There are plenty of examples of this in recent years as the players have the power not the clubs, this is how the system has been for some time.

As to whether geelong should trade again or focus on the draft this year i can see your point there but thats a different debate.

As a side point i disagree on smith being a top 5 talent at gws they have a fair few better than him.

Lol mcarthy sat out a season for mental health issues so let's not say huffed and puffed they did everything possible to keep him. They just couldn't he didn't want to be in sydney and would refuse to play afl anywhere else than in Perth.


Aplogies he will not be a restricted free agent. But the club would still have to trade hard for him last time I checked tuohy and Henderson didnt have contracts either they cost us first rounders so hmmm. Or he walks to PSD which almost never happens O'Meara did he have years left ? That was a monster deal in works for months nearly fell over 4 times.

I said Devon smith is a top 5 young talent at GWS and you go and give me 5 guys his age or younger better than him at GWS?

 

[Pure_Ownage]

Lol mcarthy sat out a season for mental health issues so let's not say huffed and puffed they did everything possible to keep him. They just couldn't he didn't want to be in sydney and would refuse to play afl anywhere else than in Perth.


Aplogies he will not be a restricted free agent. But the club would still have to trade hard for him last time I checked tuohy and Henderson didnt have contracts either they cost us first rounders so hmmm. Or he walks to PSD which almost never happens O'Meara did he have years left ? That was a monster deal in works for months nearly fell over 4 times.

I said Devon smith is a top 5 young talent at GWS and you go and give me 5 guys his age or younger better than him at GWS?

I think we all have an awareness of McCarthy's issues my point is more the fact that if clubs struggle these days to get 'full value' even when a player is contracted and they can keep them they have even less hope of doing it when a player was OOC.

I was more presenting a counter view to your assertion a) that GWS would choose not to deal with Geelong as other clubs have more currency and b) Geelong would have to pay up handsomely for Smith.
Whether you sit on the side of believing Hawthorn traded too much for Omeara or got him cheap it points back to the point, GC would have rather dealt with many other clubs than Hawthorn but they didn't get to control it, OMeara picked a club and they had to deal with that club and though they wanted (and asked for) top tier players in the trade in the end they had to take the picks that Hawthorn had available. This is almost always how it works now if you look at recent history as the players largely control the trade market (unlike overseas sports) and dictate which club they go to and the current club almost always ends up having to take relative unders on the trade. My point is I don't expect Smith would be any different, if he chose Geelong GWS would end up having to deal with us even if they wanted to deal with other clubs who might have more currency, and while we would pay some sort of price they would invariably end up getting less than what they want and would get relative unders.

As for the top 5 thing even if you take out the older gun players and look at only their 25 and under players, the following are clearly better than Smith IMO:
Jeremy Cameron
Dylan Shiel
Jonathon Patton
Rory Lobb
Josh Kelly
Toby Greene

and thats without considering the guys who you could argue who are at least equal quality with Smith like Whitfield Coniglio Haynes Williams and potentially even Hopper and Kennedy. If you started a thread on the main board and asked people to list their top 5 young players from GWS I doubt many would put Smith in their list. Now he's still a good player and is in their best 22 and would be best 22 at a lot of clubs including ours but top 5 young talent at GWS is overrating him a fair bit IMO.

 

[Ray Donovan]

I think we all have an awareness of McCarthy's issues my point is more the fact that if clubs struggle these days to get 'full value' even when a player is contracted and they can keep them they have even less hope of doing it when a player was OOC.

I was more presenting a counter view to your assertion a) that GWS would choose not to deal with Geelong as other clubs have more currency and b) Geelong would have to pay up handsomely for Smith.
Whether you sit on the side of believing Hawthorn traded too much for Omeara or got him cheap it points back to the point, GC would have rather dealt with many other clubs than Hawthorn but they didn't get to control it, OMeara picked a club and they had to deal with that club and though they wanted (and asked for) top tier players in the trade in the end they had to take the picks that Hawthorn had available. This is almost always how it works now if you look at recent history as the players largely control the trade market (unlike overseas sports) and dictate which club they go to and the current club almost always ends up having to take relative unders on the trade. My point is I don't expect Smith would be any different, if he chose Geelong GWS would end up having to deal with us even if they wanted to deal with other clubs who might have more currency, and while we would pay some sort of price they would invariably end up getting less than what they want and would get relative unders.



As for the top 5 thing even if you take out the older gun players and look at only their 25 and under players, the following are clearly better than Smith IMO:
Jeremy Cameron
Dylan Shiel
Jonathon Patton
Rory Lobb
Josh Kelly
Toby Greene

and thats without considering the guys who you could argue who are at least equal quality with Smith like Whitfield Coniglio Haynes Williams and potentially even Hopper and Kennedy. If you started a thread on the main board and asked people to list their top 5 young players from GWS I doubt many would put Smith in their list. Now he's still a good player and is in their best 22 and would be best 22 at a lot of clubs including ours but top 5 young talent at GWS is overrating him a fair bit IMO.

I did not say they would not deal with geelong i argued your point about offering two second rounders for him because you said they were desperate to move recoup draft points because of penalties. Thats what i didnt agree with and related that to market value of tuohy henderson what those deals have cost us. We couldnt get those deals done for uncontracted players and they have half the market value of smith.

. my mcarthy point was referenced because they would not deal him the year before for two first rounders so clearly that is not an unders deal. Now your talking about a better player in a position with not as much market value. Still you reference it as though GWS are the desperate party in geelong negotiations which is just not true. Brett deliedio nominated geelong last season GWS had a better deal. And ability to trade more assets.

. And related that to throwing him away for chips because we are geelong supporters. And we like that deal i didnt see it as realistic and thought a deal involving a player was more likely in premiership window thats why i referenced motlop. As a fantasy trade


I specifically said top 5 young players around his age at club or younger i didnt have cameron and shiel in the grouping as they were pre selections. But will accept them as i set parameters they are definately of similar age.

Im not overatting him he is just coming off an injury affected season. You compare his body of work to patton, Lobb, Josh kelly, Greene his performance and numbers for a younger player were off the charts. And performance far exceeded this group on field greene had an outstanding season last year rory lobb has shown his talent, patton done 2 knees. Your discounting him off last season.

Cameron
Shiel

Greene
Coniglio
Smith
Lobb
Patton
Kelly
Williams Z
Whitfield

If you made me rank that group in some kind of performance order i realise lobb has uncapped potential and patton, kelly but rankings dont work on potential. They work on results show me the data from previous seasons that show smith has not been more effective.

 

[CatRiot]

What is our list's average age and average number of games now? How do we stack up with the rest of the competition in this regard?

 

[CatRiot]

What is our list's average age and average number of games now? How do we stack up with the rest of the competition in this regard?

Found it...

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-12-03/total-list-breakdown-all-the-key-stats

 

[David the Cat]

Found it...

http://www.afl.com.au/news/2016-12-03/total-list-breakdown-all-the-key-stats

Thanks for that...really interesting.

 

[ChookNorris]

Thanks for that...really interesting.

Ours isn't a great reflection. Takes whole list, we've taken a lot of rookies and speculative late picks last few years that won't be best 22. The real way to look at those age profiles to check for club success is when looking at age and games played of best 22.

 

[Turbocat]

Interesting article about the jaw dropping strength of GWS list in todays HS , makes a good case for a decade of GWS domination. There was a table in the article that listed the number players on a clubs list drafted 1-5 , 1-20. Does it make a counter intuitive argument as 3rd and 2nd bottom clubs are Sydney and WBulldogs? Perhaps. Id still say our numbers are low and the zero in the 1-5 column makes Adelaide and us the only club without players drafted that early.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...t/news-story/e75fc06533d0fafcd3fc6e9fa7088f42

PICKS OF THE CROP (Source: Champion Data)

CLUB PICK 1-5 PICK 1-20
GWS Giants 10 22
Carlton 7 19
Richmond 2 16
Collingwood 4 14
Essendon 5 14
Gold Coast 5 14
Port Adelaide 4 13
Hawthorn 3 12
Melbourne 6 12
North Melbourne 2 12
West Coast 4 12
Adelaide 0 10
Fremantle 2 10
St Kilda 3 10
Geelong 0 9
Sydney 3 7
W.Bulldogs 3 7
Brisbane 2 6

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...t/news-story/e75fc06533d0fafcd3fc6e9fa7088f42

 

[dazbroncos]

Interesting article about the jaw dropping strength of GWS list in todays HS , makes a good case for a decade of GWS domination. There was a table in the article that listed the number players on a clubs list drafted 1-5 , 1-20. Does it make a counter intuitive argument as 3rd and 2nd bottom clubs are Sydney and WBulldogs? Perhaps. Id still say our numbers are low and the zero in the 1-5 column makes Adelaide and us the only club without players drafted that early.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...t/news-story/e75fc06533d0fafcd3fc6e9fa7088f42

PICKS OF THE CROP (Source: Champion Data)

CLUB PICK 1-5 PICK 1-20
GWS Giants 10 22
Carlton 7 19
Richmond 2 16
Collingwood 4 14
Essendon 5 14
Gold Coast 5 14
Port Adelaide 4 13
Hawthorn 3 12
Melbourne 6 12
North Melbourne 2 12
West Coast 4 12
Adelaide 0 10
Fremantle 2 10
St Kilda 3 10
Geelong 0 9
Sydney 3 7
W.Bulldogs 3 7
Brisbane 2 6

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/a...t/news-story/e75fc06533d0fafcd3fc6e9fa7088f42

That list makes the colossal Godzilla that is/will be GWS just jaw dropping.

Hopefully the AFL will finally get tired of the Frankenstein they have built after their 3 peat (IMO) and start to dismantle their advantages.

GO Catters

 

[Turbocat]

That list makes the colossal Godzilla that is/will be GWS just jaw dropping.

Hopefully the AFL will finally get tired of the Frankenstein they have built after their 3 peat (IMO) and start to dismantle their advantages.

GO Catters

and its shows the issue they have with Brisbane.

The GWS list strength issue is its like some sort delayed superannuation scheme , it seems obvious to a non aligned observer , it seems obvious to experienced insider like Pelchin and Wallace. The trouble is we are here now and the AFL seem intent on them being successful , and by the time GWS wins a Premiership it will be set for a period of domination enforced by a level of talent not seen in the last 20 years , perhaps not since Haw in the 80's.

And its a self feeding perpetual motion monster because of their their Academy and because they rarely seem to loose players without getting something valuable.

I guess for us the question really is ... is it possible to beat so overwhelming odds on credential drafted talent?