Hawthorn - Do they trade into the first round this season?

[pinot]

Hawthorn don't have the currency to meaningfully trade into the first round this year.

They could trade a good player and their second round pick for a late first but would that even be worthwhile? Doubt it.

They can trade Rioli to Gold Coast for three 2nd round picks

 

[Jake_09]

Chick wanted out - traded for pick 8 Luke Brennan (19 games) FAIL!

Thompson wanted out after contracting clinical depression at Hawthorn- Traded for 10 and 26, Collingwood got 10, Hawthorn took Matt Little with 26 (1 game) FAIL!

Rawlings wanted out - The infamous "Veale deal" saw Jade in the PSD to the bulldogs. Hawthorn received Danny Jacobs (45 games) FAIL!

Hay wanted out after he also contracted a mental illness that was covered up by Hawthorn - Trade for pick 18 Max Bailey (43 games) slight but devious Win

Trent Croad - Well, there's only one Freo. The only real win of these trades. Doubled down again when Croad came back, but they did give up a better player in McPharlin who (surprise, surprise) wanted out. WIN!

Hawthorn effectively owes its premiership era to Fremantles ineptness.

Good luck getting that to happen again.

Never mind that when giving Collingwood pick 10 in the draft we got pick 7 Jordan Lewis. Or that we also got Grant Birchall at 14 which we also received in the trade for Hay. Doesn't suit your narrative though.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Never mind that when giving Collingwood pick 10 in the draft we got pick 7 Jordan Lewis. Or that we also got Grant Birchall at 14 which we also received in the trade for Hay. Doesn't suit your narrative though.

There was no guarantee of any machinations when you made the initial trades. YOU are revising these trades with after the fact scenarios.

Do you expect anyone to believe that Hawthorn brilliantly uptraded to pick 7 in the knowledge that Jordan Lewis was going to be available and was going to be a gun? Talk about drawing a long bow!!!

As for Birchall, Hawthorn knew he was going to be a gun at pick 14 also? I suppose Ellis and Dowler must have bludged on the training track.

 

[The Swert]

Hawthorn effectively owes its premiership era to Fremantles ineptness.

Good luck getting that to happen again.

What the heck are you going on about???

All I said was never say never. Players that a club (or supporters) banks its future on can end up leaving, for better or worse.

Hawthorn supporters have been bitten more than most I would suggest. Not only those core players in the early 2000s, but nobody expected Franklin to leave...or Mitchell and Lewis. But within a few months, they were gone.

No supporter can really say 'nah that player's locked in, he's never going to be traded'.


I didn't say anything about building a premiership team.

 

[Procrastinator35]

Good luck acquiring draft capital then.

Who says we either want or desire it?

Plenty of quality F/A's going around this year....And we have both the funds & the score on the board on that front.

 

[LeverPuller]

Who says we either want or desire it?

Plenty of quality F/A's going around this year....And we have both the funds & the score on the board on that front.

You don't have the trade assets for RFAs and with the team falling off the perch the score on the board means jack.

Other teams have the 2017 results, the funds and the trade assets.

 

[Procrastinator35]

You don't have the trade assets for RFAs and with the team falling off the perch the score on the board means jack.

Other teams have the 2017 results, the funds and the trade assets.

Hardly....Most big -name F/A's will have already decided where they will be next year.....Just in case you came down in the last shower.

 

[LeverPuller]

Hardly....Most big -name F/A's will have already decided where they will be next year.....Just in case you came down in the last shower.

And how does Hawthorn do a deal for any of them, given they have no 2017 first?

 

[Procrastinator35]

And how does Hawthorn do a deal for any of them, given they have no 2017 first?

Their F/A's....No team has ever matched.....That's unlikely to change anytime soon.

Club's are reluctant to stand in players way given the threat of the AFLPA wanting greater player freedom & movements....That would only give them more ammo & club's even less power again.

 

[LeverPuller]

Their F/A's....No team has ever matched.....That's unlikely to change anytime soon.

Club's are reluctant to stand in players way given the threat of the AFLPA wanting greater player freedom & movements....That would only give them more ammo & club's even less power again.

We haven't had the likes of Fyfe and Danger hit FA in a situation where clubs are able to match. Hawthorn didn't have the cap to match on Buddy. Danger deal was agreed in advance. But Freo and Richmond have both been clearing the decks for Fyfe and Martin. Rocky could go but he wouldn't be the solution when the Hawks have so many other problems.

There is one other name, but no way JPK leaves the Swans.

 

[Procrastinator35]

We haven't had the likes of Fyfe and Danger hit FA in a situation where clubs are able to match. Hawthorn didn't have the cap to match on Buddy. Danger deal was agreed in advance. But Freo and Richmond have both been clearing the decks for Fyfe and Martin. Rocky could go but he wouldn't be the solution when the Hawks have so many other problems.

There is one other name, but no way JPK leaves the Swans.

No...We could have wheeled & dealed to accommodate Buddy, but the offer was both crazy & suicidal....Which makes a mockery of the compensation.
Besides which, we did better without him anyhow.

The majority of our current squad are still experienced premiership players....That ability doesn't disappear over-night....We're just jaded is all.

I've no doubt both Martyn & Fyfe's destinations were decided prior to the season commencing....That's usually the way with the big guns.

Plenty of other names still on offer too: Trengove & Zaharakis to name but 2.....I can't see us being players for Rockliff, way too similar type to shiels & Mitchell....We need pace & a goal-kicking midfielder & he aint either.

 

[Ian Dunross]

Got a Dogs team from 2012? They managed to win a flag 4 years later. 5 wins 2012. 8 wins 2013. 7 wins 2014.

About half the best 22 from 2012 has moved on. How did their list get rated in 2015?

People seem to have this bizarre belief that a single Draft will make or break a club, and that whatever they do right now will affect them for the next 8 or 10 years.

Dogs 2012 team had Boyd, Morris, Murphy, Wood, Roughead, Liberatore, Wallis

They also had DRAFT PICKS in 2012... 2 in fact inside the top 10. Imagine if the Dogs had no first round draft picks in 2012... They wouldn't even have made the prelim in 2016 let alone won the flag

Unfortunately, the O'Meara trade will put the Hawks rebuild back another season because of their 2017 draft deficit

The Hawks will bounce back, it will just take a number of seasons

 

[Son_Of_God29]

Does any Hawk fan actually know how it would be possible to get back into the 1st round?

Many in this thread have said they will not trade players with 1st round value ie Cyril, Gunston & Bruest so tell us HOW it can be done

 

[Gday1]

Does any Hawk fan actually know how it would be possible to get back into the 1st round?

Many in this thread have said they will not trade players with 1st round value ie Cyril, Gunston & Bruest so tell us HOW it can be done

By giving you guys Shoenmakers or Vickery

 

[Son_Of_God29]

By giving you guys Shoenmakers or Vickery

Neither of them would get a game for our Womens team

 

[HairyO]

Dogs 2012 team had Boyd, Morris, Murphy, Wood, Roughead, Liberatore, Wallis

They also had DRAFT PICKS in 2012... 2 in fact inside the top 10. Imagine if the Dogs had no first round draft picks in 2012... They wouldn't even have made the prelim in 2016 let alone won the flag

Unfortunately, the O'Meara trade will put the Hawks rebuild back another season because of their 2017 draft deficit

The Hawks will bounce back, it will just take a number of seasons

Or we trade and make use of Free Agents...

 

[Ian Dunross]

Or we trade and make use of Free Agents...

Like Vickery?

 

[HairyO]

Like Vickery?

Sure. Who should we have taken to replace Ceglar?

 

[Ian Dunross]

Sure. Who should we have taken to replace Ceglar?

My point is you won't rebuild a premiership side w free agents of the calibre of Vickery

You may be able to attract FAs like that, but it's questionable whether you'd be able to attract high level

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

"You can't trade for anyone, you have no assets"
"you have to trade into the 1st round"
"No one will want to join Hawthorn"
"How could a trade be agreed?"

Rinse and repeat, and it's only May.



Hang on to your hats.

 

[thetradesman]

I'm not seeing Roughead and Franklin there.



In other words, lucky.

They don't need to have Roughead and Franklin..

 

[pinot]

"You can't trade for anyone, you have no assets"
"you have to trade into the 1st round"
"No one will want to join Hawthorn"
"How could a trade be agreed?"

Rinse and repeat, and it's only May.



Hang on to your hats.

Well, time is running out - third way through the season and have an idea of top 8 after round 8. Gotta get a wiggle on.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Well, time is running out - third way through the season and have an idea of top 8 after round 8. Gotta get a wiggle on.

Top 8 or not, it doesn't matter.

Hawthorn have plenty of players who could go on to have fresh starts at other clubs, if they can't find the effort this year.

Any club thinking that they are 1-2 players off a flag tilt would love to add an Isaac Smith or Ben Stratton to their list.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Who says we either want or desire it?

See, that's just dumb. Every club would desire trade capital.

 

[Snake_Baker]

Top 8 or not, it doesn't matter.

Hawthorn have plenty of players who could go on to have fresh starts at other clubs, if they can't find the effort this year.

Any club thinking that they are 1-2 players off a flag tilt would love to add an Isaac Smith or Ben Stratton to their list.

Smith is your clubs vice captain and therefore I assume untradeable.

However, let's engage in a hypothetical.

What picks would the Hawks expect for those two and which clubs would those two players elevate in to genuine premiership contention?

Personally, I can't see any club in the 4 to 6 spots improving enough because of the inclusion of those two.

They are good players, but they are icing.