The Offseason: Essendon
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Donakebab
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Crusty sun-bleached dog turd for Lobbe?
Enough of this now, leave the shitty troll proposals for the general trade thread.
I really hope we stay way from Eric Mackenzie,Mitch Brown and Ballantyne.
All 3 are past their best and will be no use to us.
All 3 are past their best and will be no use to us.
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Nuggs Bunny
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Essendon Player Sponsor 2024 - Archie Perkins and Nic Martin
Essendon Player Sponsor 2023 - Archie Perkins and Nic Martin
Essendon Player Sponsor 2022 - Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti and Archie Perkins
Essendon Player Sponsor 2021 - Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti and Archie Perkins
Essendon Player Sponsor 2020 - Orazio Fantasia, Anthony McDonald Tipungwuti, Shaun McKernan
- Oct 12, 2015
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- #30
Depends what the cost that improvement comes with. For the moment, Ambrose is serviceable enough to let us concentrate on other areas and Emac is 28. Unless we can get him at a very good price, I can't help but wonder why we'd be interested.
Nuggs Bunny
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- #31
From our perspective, a third rounder. Maybe the Hibberd pick depending on how we see the draft.
I don't understand why we are chasing Emac when we have Hurley,Hooker,Hartley,Brown as our key backs.
Nuggs Bunny
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Essendon Player Sponsor 2020 - Orazio Fantasia, Anthony McDonald Tipungwuti, Shaun McKernan
- Oct 12, 2015
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- #34
Trust in our lord and saviour John Worsfold.
If Woosha wasn't playing games mentioning McKenzie, Hooker would definitely play forward and solve an immediate issue, a second key forward. I'd think Watson would be more likely to play on if Essendon were a realistic finals possibility in 2017. Assuming JOM wants to come to Essendon and he's fully fit, expectations would be Essendon push for top 8.
Mackenzie strikes me as an odd target. Brown too. Given we have some good tall defenders in hooker, Hurley, Hartley, ambrose and likely to sign dea.
If we can walk away with jaeger, kelly, dea, pick 1 and our 1st Rd in 2017 intact, that's an A+
If we can walk away with jaeger, kelly, dea, pick 1 and our 1st Rd in 2017 intact, that's an A+
General consensus on our board is a mid 2nd rounder, so your 2nd would be overs obviously. Melbourne's 2nd (Hibberd) with something coming back I guess?
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Wouldn't want him.
Nuggs Bunny
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Essendon Player Sponsor 2024 - Archie Perkins and Nic Martin
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Essendon Player Sponsor 2020 - Orazio Fantasia, Anthony McDonald Tipungwuti, Shaun McKernan
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- #39
Depends what comes back. Before we start bringing in players like Stevens to round out the team, we need to get the basics right first. Hence, this year we're more than likely to take our draft picks to the draft or use them in a godfather deal to snare a player like O'Meara. Koby is a good player but players like him are not exactly our top priority now and we will value him accordingly.
foj1
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- Oct 25, 2005
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To be frank nothing
I hope we are driving up his price and he stays with you
You got Crameri for unders
You had a real dip at a contracted Hurley
I think we owe Bulldogs a bit of payback
Stevens would be crazy to go anywhere when the doggies are in a pretty good era anyway
foj1
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- Oct 25, 2005
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You won't get it
That is what you forked out for Crameri
Crameri is way more valuable than Stevens
Agree it's strange you are apparently targetting him. He is perfect for a club like Gold Coast though who lack a big inside body. Not sure if driving his price up would really bother us though tbh as he seems on the outer and behind Libba, Wallis, Dunkley and others in his best role. If he wants too much I'd say we will just let him go.
Definitely got Crameri for unders. I would say our 3rd round to come back, but we only have 2 4th rounders this year.
Such rage Donakebab, take a chill pill mate - relaaaaxx..!!!
Donakebab
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Essendon Player Sponsor 2022 - Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti and Archie Perkins
Essendon Player Sponsor 2022 - Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti and Archie Perkins
Essendon Player Sponsor 2021 - Anthony McDonald-Tipungwuti and Archie Perkins
Essendon Player Sponsor 2020 - Orazio Fantasia, Anthony McDonald Tipungwuti, Shaun McKernan
Essendon Player Sponsor 2019 - Orazio Fantasia, Anthony McDonald Tipungwuti, Shaun McKernan
Bit of banter = rage?
There is a very good reason Sydney fans bring Towers into trade discussions. Have a good mate who is avid Swans fan . To quote : 'Towers is not an AFL footballer' . No thanks!
I'll put my feelings down in the same format.
What they need?
More guns, midfield depth. With the exception of Hooker Essendon's talls are not too old, with the oldest being Hooker turning 28 later this year. But in the midfield over the next few years they need to replace Watson, Goddard, Stanton and Hocking. Three of those were in our best players 2-3 years ago, and need to be replaced by guns.
So the focus has to be on midfielders, and ones with the potential to be guns. This also reflects the general feeling that the depth isn't too bad across the board, just more champions required to replace those ageing mids just mentioned, as well as Ryder/Carlisle/Crameri. Z Merrett obviously fills one hole.
The talls need is a myth. With Ambrose, Brown and Hartley all establishing themselves as being journeyman quality as a minimum, with Hooker and Hurley, and taking Francis at #6 last year, Essendon is reasonably well placed for talls. Up forward Hooker averaged 2 goals a game in his 10 games forward last year (of which we won 2 games so service was terrible), and 2.4 goals over the last five games. Between the talls we have, the three "medium" forwards coming through in Langford, Laverde and Redman, and Bellchambers ability to play forward, we're pretty covered. A later pick on a tall or a cheap tall such as S. Reid wouldn't be remiss. And of course if a blue chip tall was available, he'd need to be considered.
On Ambrose, he gets missed because he gives you nothing going the other way. But he's been extremely tight and would have done well in a reverse Coleman. And you just have to look at Dawson and Gilham to know Grand Finalists can get away with one journeyman who can shut down. As a bonus, he also plays on medium talls with his big engine.
Biggest names out of contract
Jobe Watson (UFA)
Jayden Laverde
Martin Gleeson
James Kelly & Matthew Dea (top-ups)
Best signing of the year
As the article stated.
Who won’t be there next year?
Mostly the article was right. Only changes are that:
Likely to be Cooney, Edwards, Kommer, Ashby, Dempsey, Pears and Hibberd, with a few others being considered (McKernan, Gwilt).
Likely in's
Walla, McKenna and Dea are all likely to be either promoted from the rookie list, or picked up as a DFA. Kelly is also an option.
That would leave 3-5 draft picks, of which we are likely to have #1, #19, #26, #37 and #55 as a minimum.
Best find of the year
The three listed were all good, especially now we are good odds of being able to keep Dea for free. In addition the form of all three of Hartley, Ambrose and Brown has been fantastic, as it took us from zero tall depth to quite a nice position in one year.
And Zachary Merrett establishing himself as a bonafide A grade midfielder was brilliant.
Biggest decision looming
Agree pick #1 is the big decision. But its really, can we convert it into a better selection of picks? #4 or #5 and anything from #20 down might be seen as a win if our recruiting department believe the top 5 is as even as reported. Ainsworth or McGrath may do us as well as McCluggage or Brodie. Getting any one of those (plus SPS) and someone like Berry/Battle/Kerr/Simpkin for pick #1 could be a big win.
Do GWS or GCS want it, and what will they offer? We need quality over quantity, so that will effect any player discussions.
Agree on Jobe Watson as well.
Other big question - how many (if any) of the older players get to stay? I think Dempsey's gone. But do Kelly and Dea get offered contracts?
Plus do we promote McKenna, and do we keep/delist Hams?
Throw a lifeline to...
Matthew Dea a definite to be offered a contract. As Hibberd is leaving, Ashby and Dempsey will be cut and Baguley is 29, we need another medium/small defender. Dea will slot right in.
No way Dal Santo is offered a role. The only older player with any chance is Kelly, who we would seriously consider.
Trade Bait
Pick 1 – discussed above. I think it will either be kept or traded for picks. Either way, at least one midfielder really needs to come from it.
Michael Hibberd – Pick 26 from Melbourne is the most likely outcome.
Trade Targets
Jaeger O’meara – Worsfold says we'd love to have him at Essendon, and the media and message boards go into meltdown. Personally, I doubt with where our list is at, his knees, our history of Williams and others, that we'd touch him unless he comes cheap. But if GCS are threatening to send him to the draft, why on earth wouldn't the head coach make sure he knows he'd be welcome?
Hayden Ballantyne – yeah right. We've got Fantasia, Walla has been signed for three, getting back Colyer, and have Langford, Laverde and Redman coming through as forwards. Why on earth would we get Ballantyne? Same for Black. Yeah right.
GWS – Think we'll only be interested in a pick selection, or quality (if its on offer). We have salary cap space and the #1 pick, that might go far.
Surprise move of the off-season?
They mentioned S. Reid, I wouldn't rule it out if he comes cheap to get his salary cap off Sydney's books.
The great unknown?
How the missing 12 come back. If Watson, Stanton and all are back near their 2014 form, they are all huge inclusions. Hocking and Myers are reportedly better than they've been for years with an injury free 12 months. But they could also come back less fit, and with problems. Who knows.
The second element is how quickly the "two" teams can be integrated, and how quickly can the "12" (or rather 10) be brought onto Worsfold's game plan. It is no surprise that the side played its best footy in the last third of the year, as top-ups and youngsters got better with the game plan and player cohesion. How long will it take to merge the two groups?
What they need?
More guns, midfield depth. With the exception of Hooker Essendon's talls are not too old, with the oldest being Hooker turning 28 later this year. But in the midfield over the next few years they need to replace Watson, Goddard, Stanton and Hocking. Three of those were in our best players 2-3 years ago, and need to be replaced by guns.
So the focus has to be on midfielders, and ones with the potential to be guns. This also reflects the general feeling that the depth isn't too bad across the board, just more champions required to replace those ageing mids just mentioned, as well as Ryder/Carlisle/Crameri. Z Merrett obviously fills one hole.
The talls need is a myth. With Ambrose, Brown and Hartley all establishing themselves as being journeyman quality as a minimum, with Hooker and Hurley, and taking Francis at #6 last year, Essendon is reasonably well placed for talls. Up forward Hooker averaged 2 goals a game in his 10 games forward last year (of which we won 2 games so service was terrible), and 2.4 goals over the last five games. Between the talls we have, the three "medium" forwards coming through in Langford, Laverde and Redman, and Bellchambers ability to play forward, we're pretty covered. A later pick on a tall or a cheap tall such as S. Reid wouldn't be remiss. And of course if a blue chip tall was available, he'd need to be considered.
On Ambrose, he gets missed because he gives you nothing going the other way. But he's been extremely tight and would have done well in a reverse Coleman. And you just have to look at Dawson and Gilham to know Grand Finalists can get away with one journeyman who can shut down. As a bonus, he also plays on medium talls with his big engine.
Biggest names out of contract
Jobe Watson (UFA)
Jayden Laverde
Martin Gleeson
James Kelly & Matthew Dea (top-ups)
Best signing of the year
As the article stated.
Who won’t be there next year?
Mostly the article was right. Only changes are that:
- McKernan may be kept as mature depth behind Leunberger and Bellchambers.
- Edwards, Kommer and Ashby are almost certainly gone, as is Dempsey.
- Most EFC fans would hope that Pears retires.
- Gwilt would also have some question marks on him, but he's not out the door yet.
- Stokes was a top up.
Likely to be Cooney, Edwards, Kommer, Ashby, Dempsey, Pears and Hibberd, with a few others being considered (McKernan, Gwilt).
Likely in's
Walla, McKenna and Dea are all likely to be either promoted from the rookie list, or picked up as a DFA. Kelly is also an option.
That would leave 3-5 draft picks, of which we are likely to have #1, #19, #26, #37 and #55 as a minimum.
Best find of the year
The three listed were all good, especially now we are good odds of being able to keep Dea for free. In addition the form of all three of Hartley, Ambrose and Brown has been fantastic, as it took us from zero tall depth to quite a nice position in one year.
And Zachary Merrett establishing himself as a bonafide A grade midfielder was brilliant.
Biggest decision looming
Agree pick #1 is the big decision. But its really, can we convert it into a better selection of picks? #4 or #5 and anything from #20 down might be seen as a win if our recruiting department believe the top 5 is as even as reported. Ainsworth or McGrath may do us as well as McCluggage or Brodie. Getting any one of those (plus SPS) and someone like Berry/Battle/Kerr/Simpkin for pick #1 could be a big win.
Do GWS or GCS want it, and what will they offer? We need quality over quantity, so that will effect any player discussions.
Agree on Jobe Watson as well.
Other big question - how many (if any) of the older players get to stay? I think Dempsey's gone. But do Kelly and Dea get offered contracts?
Plus do we promote McKenna, and do we keep/delist Hams?
Throw a lifeline to...
Matthew Dea a definite to be offered a contract. As Hibberd is leaving, Ashby and Dempsey will be cut and Baguley is 29, we need another medium/small defender. Dea will slot right in.
No way Dal Santo is offered a role. The only older player with any chance is Kelly, who we would seriously consider.
Trade Bait
Pick 1 – discussed above. I think it will either be kept or traded for picks. Either way, at least one midfielder really needs to come from it.
Michael Hibberd – Pick 26 from Melbourne is the most likely outcome.
Trade Targets
Jaeger O’meara – Worsfold says we'd love to have him at Essendon, and the media and message boards go into meltdown. Personally, I doubt with where our list is at, his knees, our history of Williams and others, that we'd touch him unless he comes cheap. But if GCS are threatening to send him to the draft, why on earth wouldn't the head coach make sure he knows he'd be welcome?
Hayden Ballantyne – yeah right. We've got Fantasia, Walla has been signed for three, getting back Colyer, and have Langford, Laverde and Redman coming through as forwards. Why on earth would we get Ballantyne? Same for Black. Yeah right.
GWS – Think we'll only be interested in a pick selection, or quality (if its on offer). We have salary cap space and the #1 pick, that might go far.
Surprise move of the off-season?
They mentioned S. Reid, I wouldn't rule it out if he comes cheap to get his salary cap off Sydney's books.
The great unknown?
How the missing 12 come back. If Watson, Stanton and all are back near their 2014 form, they are all huge inclusions. Hocking and Myers are reportedly better than they've been for years with an injury free 12 months. But they could also come back less fit, and with problems. Who knows.
The second element is how quickly the "two" teams can be integrated, and how quickly can the "12" (or rather 10) be brought onto Worsfold's game plan. It is no surprise that the side played its best footy in the last third of the year, as top-ups and youngsters got better with the game plan and player cohesion. How long will it take to merge the two groups?
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You seem to forget we get back Watson, Stanton, Heppell, Myers, Hocking, Howlett and Colyer who all go through the midfield from our missing 12. Howlett is likely to play VFL pending injuries, but the others will likely all start. So we're adding those to Goddard, Merrett, Zaharakis, Parish and Bird. That is 12 for 9 spots. There are obviously question marks on how they'll all come back, but the midfield could be perfectly fine. Short term.
Rucks aren't bad. Leuy and a fit Bellchambers are both AFL quality. People forget that about Bellchambers as he's had two injury ravaged seasons. He was the best performing ruck/forward in the league in 2013, outscoring Hale for goals and tap outs. I suspect we'll keep McKernan as mature back-up.
No need for tall backs. A Hurley/Hartley/Ambrose tall back line with possible depth in Francis, Dea and Gwilt is fine (and Brown if he's not needed forward). No need for an ageing MacKenzie. If you read the transcript of Worsfold's conversation, he used Mackenzie and M. Brown (WCE version) as examples, he wasn't saying we would be interested in them.
Woosha wasn't playing games on MacKenzie, he mentioned him as an example of a point. The media just then ran with it as if he'd said we were interested.
We don't need more tall backs, even with Hooker playing forward.
Ambrose goes under-rated as he is purely shut down. But there is room for one defender in the team who does that if they do it very well, and he has.
With Myers, Bird, Parish, Watson, Hocking, Howlett, Zerrett I just don't see a need for Stevens. Especially when he is being dropped by the Bulldogs. If we did get him he'd need to be pretty cheap IMO.
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For the sake of this post I am assuming Watson will return with Pears joining the fire brigade.
Re-sign 3 years: Laverde
Re-sign 2 years: Gleeson
Re-sign 1 year: Watson, Dea, Kelly and McKernan
Trade: Hibberd (Let's assume pick 27)
Delist: Kommer, Edwards, Dempsey, Gwilt and Ashby
Retire: Pears and Cooney
Elevate: Tippa and McKenna
Re-rookie: Long, Hams, Nyuan and Wallis
This then gives us 4 live selections (1st rounder, 2 2nd rounders and a 3rd round) at the draft along with 2 elevations and 2 rookie draft picks. With those draft picks I would go something like.
1: Hugh McLuggage (outside classy mid)
19: Tim English (Skinny but athletic ruckman. Think he is worth a punt here.)
27: Jack Graham (Inside mid with plenty of grunt)
37: Alex Witherden (Good mid sized defender)
55: TIPPA!!!!!!
73: McKenna!!!!!!
*McKernan gets another go because if Leuy or Bellchambers go down we have zero ruck depth other than Gach who is clearly not ready based on VFL form.
This allows us to turn over 8 players (Kommer, Edwards, Ashby, Dempsey, Gwilt, Cooney, Hibberd and Pears) and bring in some new talent (4 live picks) two of our homegrown talents who we know are good (Tippa and McKenna) and reward Matty Dea and James Kelly for outstanding seasons.
Re-sign 3 years: Laverde
Re-sign 2 years: Gleeson
Re-sign 1 year: Watson, Dea, Kelly and McKernan
Trade: Hibberd (Let's assume pick 27)
Delist: Kommer, Edwards, Dempsey, Gwilt and Ashby
Retire: Pears and Cooney
Elevate: Tippa and McKenna
Re-rookie: Long, Hams, Nyuan and Wallis
This then gives us 4 live selections (1st rounder, 2 2nd rounders and a 3rd round) at the draft along with 2 elevations and 2 rookie draft picks. With those draft picks I would go something like.
1: Hugh McLuggage (outside classy mid)
19: Tim English (Skinny but athletic ruckman. Think he is worth a punt here.)
27: Jack Graham (Inside mid with plenty of grunt)
37: Alex Witherden (Good mid sized defender)
55: TIPPA!!!!!!
73: McKenna!!!!!!
*McKernan gets another go because if Leuy or Bellchambers go down we have zero ruck depth other than Gach who is clearly not ready based on VFL form.
This allows us to turn over 8 players (Kommer, Edwards, Ashby, Dempsey, Gwilt, Cooney, Hibberd and Pears) and bring in some new talent (4 live picks) two of our homegrown talents who we know are good (Tippa and McKenna) and reward Matty Dea and James Kelly for outstanding seasons.
English and Witherden will be looooong gone by those picks I suspect.
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