Strategy Changes & Pre-match Discussion - Round 23 vs. Brisbane, Marvel, Fri 18/08, 7:50pm

[SwanBet]

So, you are happy to see McStay at centre bounces against Daniher who is their back up ruckman or even Oscar? Our mids are already struggling enough at the centre bounces. Both of them will simply grab the pill and boot it fifty metres deep into their forward line.

What are you proposing then? Bringing back Cox?

Come finals, Frampton will be playing that second ruck role, who I am quite comfortable in there competing in the ruck.

I would rather us keep our new found forward structure in place (Howe/McStay/Mihocek) then bring back Cox for 2 weeks and force Howe to go back.

 

[gouki88]

If Cameron went down in the first ten minutes on Friday night and Frampton has to go into the ruck who takes Daniher and then Hipwood? Howe is up forward. So, Maynard goes to Hipwood and Murphy to Daniher. That sounds very scary.

Cox provides so much in terms of options and structure. He has put his head down and played well in two VFL games. He knows his finals chances are in doubt so if ever a player has had a rocket and motivation to impact a game it's Cox.

I feel like you can play this game with any key position player though, with Moore out especially.

 

[sideswipe]

Too in awe of height. Don't think he's tall.

Nah - classic ruckman behaviour to overestimate their importance.*

* they can be important at times. Those times being moments after one verbally bested an opponent whose intellectual limitations led them to respond with violence.



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[Timmy from Thomastown]

Why? Don't you agree it is a high risk approach for the reasons I stated as well as because the two ruck combo has seen us win most of our games with that structure these past two seasons.

Last season maybe. This season we’ve been winning with all sorts of combinations. The two ruck combo is very costly in terms of rotations, given cox spends 40-50 percent of the time on the pine. With one ruckman instead of two, our midfielders get the benefit of extra recovery time and more burst efforts.

The main reason we haven’t tried one ruck earlier is because mcstay was unavailable. As soon as he returned the dilemma was inevitable.

 

[sr36]

Nah - classic ruckman behaviour to overestimate their importance.*

* they can be important at times. Those times being moments after one verbally bested an opponent whose intellectual limitations led them to respond with violence.



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Video reports have really made rucks irrelevant.

 

[domus]

I feel like you can play this game with any key position player though, with Moore out especially.

McStay and Checkers are both undersized key forwards. When they are off we look impotent. They are outmarked or disappear in a pack and unlike the big keys at the Dogs, Blues, Geelong, Port etc. they don't have the capacity to split a pack or sit on their shoulders. I always look at worst possible scenarios in preparation for any game and especially finals.

There is nothing more depressing than those days when the keys are covered and we are looking for inspiration, but the cupboard is bare so poor Billy Elliott breaks his body flying for marks and trying to provide a spark as has happened the past three weeks.

Others mention being able to rotate the mids and keep them fresh with an extra small on the bench but I could easily suggest there are any number of players both forward and back who have and could have a run in the middle from Crisp, Maynard, Markov, Elliott and McCeery and even Josh or Sidey. I think we are wasting a weapon in Cox. I admit it is a weapon which occasionally fails to fire but when it works it can be a game turner whereas an extra runner does not usually lead to a match turning moment.

 

[unplugged]

Here's to not having about 300 six-six-six violations!

 

[sr36]

McStay and Checkers are both undersized key forwards. When they are off we look impotent. They are outmarked or disappear in a pack and unlike the big keys at the Dogs, Blues, Geelong, Port etc. they don't have the capacity to split a pack or sit on their shoulders. I always look at worst possible scenarios in preparation for any game and especially finals.

There is nothing more depressing than those days when the keys are covered and we are looking for inspiration, but the cupboard is bare so poor Billy Elliott breaks his body flying for marks and trying to provide a spark as has happened the past three weeks.

Is there a forward in the league who has clunked more contested marks inside 50 than McStay has in the last 3 weeks? Maybe one or two. Wouldn't be many.

 

[gouki88]

McStay and Checkers are both undersized key forwards. When they are off we look impotent. They are outmarked or disappear in a pack and unlike the big keys at the Dogs, Blues, Geelong, Port etc. they don't have the capacity to split a pack or sit on their shoulders. I always look at worst possible scenarios in preparation for any game and especially finals.

There is nothing more depressing than those days when the keys are covered and we are looking for inspiration, but the cupboard is bare so poor Billy Elliott breaks his body flying for marks and trying to provide a spark as has happened the past three weeks.

Others mention being able to rotate the mids and keep them fresh with an extra small on the bench but I could easily suggest there are any number of players both forward and back who have and could have a run in the middle from Crisp, Maynard, Markov, Elliott and McCeery and even Josh or Sidey. I think we are wasting a weapon in Cox. I admit it is a weapon which occasionally fails to fire but when it works it can be a game turner whereas an extra runner does not usually lead to a match turning moment.

McStay is simply not undersized at all

 

[Nuffsaid]

I worry because we have been average at Marvel for a few years. Their tall fwd line will stretch us.

 

[manicpie]

Is there a forward in the league who has clunked more contested marks inside 50 than McStay has in the last 3 weeks? Maybe one or two. Wouldn't be many.

He just needs to hit the scoreboard like most of the other good key forwards. He still lacks presence for mine and that usually comes with hitting the scoreboard

 

[sr36]

He just needs to hit the scoreboard like most of the other good key forwards. He still lacks presence for mine and that usually comes with hitting the scoreboard

I think he's playing really well. Clunking marks inside 50. Bringing it to ground when it's not to advantage. Working hard up the ground and tackling like a brute. But he's not going to be a big goal kicker - he doesn't have the pace to burn blokes on the lead and get it uncontested or ground level game to add a couple of goals to the tally. He's a grunt KPF.

 

[Chameleon75]

What are you proposing then? Bringing back Cox?

Come finals, Frampton will be playing that second ruck role, who I am quite comfortable in there competing in the ruck.

I would rather us keep our new found forward structure in place (Howe/McStay/Mihocek) then bring back Cox for 2 weeks and force Howe to go back.

frampton can follow Daniher into the ruck like he did with casboult earlier in the year when we played one ruck.

 

[partypie]

frampton can follow Daniher into the ruck like he did with casboult earlier in the year when we played one ruck.

I doubt very much that would happen - that will leave us with nobody over 192cm down back vs Big O and Hipwood so Brisbane will be able to just drop balls on their heads while Frampton isn't there. Gunston going down this week certainly does help us a bit with our KPD woes though.

Maybe it is time to think about rolling the dice a little and give Kreuger a job down back to keep one of their forwards quiet and make them "earn" every touch they do get, if he has the tank in him to do so (not so sure on that last bit)?

The key for us next week is to corral and minimise the impact of most of their forward line as much as possible, especially their small forwards. If one of their forwards gets off the chain a bit (ala Cameron this week) then we can probably manage that, but our team defence will need to smother the rest of them fairly well if we're to have any chance of winning the game.

 

[domus]

Is there a forward in the league who has clunked more contested marks inside 50 than McStay has in the last 3 weeks? Maybe one or two. Wouldn't be many.

I'd like to see the stats. I like McStay. I reckon I can recall 4 or 5 good contested marks in the past three games but that could be my failing memory. Coxy took nine in a prelim final!

 

[Magnanimous]

I don't know why I'm replying as you seem to have a very strong bias for the big guys, but you're right that Frampton can deal with him in one on ones - it'd be a good match up if Cameron had to stand still and wrestle in one on ones, but he doesn't. That last quarter was scary - Frampton just couldn't keep himself near him. I hope I never see that match up again.

He should play on the Hawkins types

from my Delorean

 

[Finnishpie]

I reckon start resting everyone

I reckon a few on this board could use a rest.

 

[Pragmatic Shill]

All teams that have done well recently against Brisbane have successfully deployed a heavy tag on Lachie Neale

9

Lachie Neale

Age

30

Ht

178cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

27.0

5star

K

11.5

4star

HB

15.5

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

3.7

5star

CL

5.9

5star

D

28.3

5star

K

13.9

5star

HB

14.4

5star

M

4.6

4star

T

4.0

5star

CL

5.9

5star

D

12.0

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

7.4

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

1.0

3star

CL

0.4

3star

Wonder if we try this tactic ? Not that we want to show all our cards before required , but it might be nice to have a tagging option up our sleeves should we need it in finals

Greenwood to come out of retirement?

On SM-G981B using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[domus]

McStay is simply not undersized at all

He isn't key position size when I think of players I consider "key position size" like Hawkins, J Cameron, the King Twins, Naughton, Ugle-Hagan, Charlie Dixon, Mckay, two metre Pete, Hogan, Lynch, Amarti, Hipwood, Daniher etc....

 

[Magnanimous]

All teams that have done well recently against Brisbane have successfully deployed a heavy tag on Lachie Neale

9

Lachie Neale

Age

30

Ht

178cm

Wt

84kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

27.0

5star

K

11.5

4star

HB

15.5

5star

M

4.0

4star

T

3.7

5star

CL

5.9

5star

D

28.3

5star

K

13.9

5star

HB

14.4

5star

M

4.6

4star

T

4.0

5star

CL

5.9

5star

D

12.0

3star

K

4.6

2star

HB

7.4

5star

M

2.0

3star

T

1.0

3star

CL

0.4

3star

Wonder if we try this tactic ? Not that we want to show all our cards before required , but it might be nice to have a tagging option up our sleeves should we need it in finals

IQ c'mon down

from my Delorean

 

[domus]

Guessing you were a ruckman back in the day Domey?


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A cheeky rover/ wing player but always pumped when some big lug wandered in off the street to join the club. Big forwards and ruckmen were always something we lacked. Maybe that's where my obsession with Coxy comes from!

 

[manicpie]

I think he's playing really well. Clunking marks inside 50. Bringing it to ground when it's not to advantage. Working hard up the ground and tackling like a brute. But he's not going to be a big goal kicker - he doesn't have the pace to burn blokes on the lead and get it uncontested or ground level game to add a couple of goals to the tally. He's a grunt KPF.

He's been better the last couple of weeks

 

[windchimes]

He isn't key position size when I think of players I consider "key position size" like Hawkins, J Cameron, the King Twins, Naughton, Ugle-Hagan, Charlie Dixon, Mckay, two metre Pete, Hogan, Lynch, Amarti etc....

At 196cm and 99kg, he is about the same height and weight as 5 of the examples you just mentioned.

 

[domus]

At 196cm and 99kg, he is about the same height and weight as 5 of the examples you just mentioned.

No way. The eye test never fails! The internet tells me McStay is 6' 6 ' and nearly 100kg! No bloody way!

Daniel McStay - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[windchimes]

No way. The eye test never fails! The internet tells me McStay is 6' 6 ' and nearly 100kg! No bloody way!

Daniel McStay - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

He is built like a brick sh1thouse and is for sure about that 196cm height, give or take. Sure you've been looking at the same player?